Are painted on cycle areas enough protection. In this episode, we have a look at the infrastructure on Great Homer Street.
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sirens. I’m okay for now. [Music] Now, these cycle areas, um, I’m not a great fan of them, to be honest. This one is reasonable because it’s reasonably maintained. The road surface within the cycle area is good. It’s protected by a solid line as well. Um which which does help part of the way as you’ll see in a moment. Um, but often cycle areas like this that are an afterthought actually just encourage problems and close passes because people think if that car lane and motorist lane was narrower, people would think, well, I’m in my lane, the cyclist is in theirs, and it for me induces close passes. It can also cause issues in situations like this where cars are parked on them. Um, and a broken line it’s actually no issue. Um, solid line is different. Sometimes what you are going to find that these pieces of cycling infrastructure are made in front of people’s properties. you’ll still get people parking in there. Um, just deal with it like I did. Literally, just go around safely. However, it does again have uh a detrimental impact on risk and it increases conflict because the motorists are thinking I’m just going to head off it here. Um, the motorists are thinking, well, they’re coming into my lane, which is a common trait of a lot of poor road users. In any case, um, I’d like your input on just those painted line cycle areas. Are they more trouble than they’re worth? Keep safe. I’ll see you soon.
45 Comments
I hate the 'afterthought' painted white lines on the roads, I wish they wouldn't bother. They push cyclists too close to the kerb and can actually make travel more dangerous. Cyclists should be an arms length away from the kerb, minimally, that can mean they are already traveling on the painted line or to the right of it already – why bother having it?
The painted cycle lanes are nothing but virtue signalling council nonsense. That can create division between motorists and cyclists, not in a good way.
I don't necessarily think that they're bad, they're just not at all useful if your goal is to shift people from cars into bikes. Somebody who refuses to cycle because they're not comfortable sharing a space with cars is unlikely to find painted lines on a road sufficient to even consider switching.
That's true even if they're well designed and maintained, because even the really good ones still have you sharing space on the same carriageway.
Cars are always parked in advisory lanes, rendering them utterly useless. Cycling infrastructure is an afterthought for councils, who would rather pander to motorists. That's why so few people cycle.
They have "upgraded" a lot of cycle lanes with solid lines in Edinburgh but I don't think road users know the difference. Some of the cycle lanes are in terrible condition but I guess some roads are too (I don't drive). It's a tough balance to get to on ageing infrastructure no longer fit for purpose for any road users.
Where I live, the painted lines are pretty useless, because the have 'dashed' line not solid. So one still have to dodge around plenty of parked cars.
Tick box exercise. Your bars are too wide. Look at where your palm is naturally and you have to turn your wrist out.
Is that £123.9 for unleaded and £129.9 for diesel? Muck fe that is cheap up there!!
i don't mind the painted ones if they are wide enough
The street name is a tad unfortunate – just like the 🚴 lane that offers relatively little protection.
You know what's coming……
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DOH!!! 🤣🤣🤣
You should have stayed on that road as an example. It's just a bit after that that the road seems to speed up and the painted cycle lane disappears completely just as the road goes to two lanes. Horrible when the traffic is heavy heading towards town.
That first pass was too close for no gain.
Paint isn't infrastructure. Paint won't get more people to cycle, segregated and safe dedicated lanes will. I grew up with those skinny 'cycle lanes' (sometimes green) and cars would always overtake when it wasn't safe, unfortunatly, you get use to it. As well as shared bus lanes which I'm not sure are any better, close passing buses are terrifying and you have constant conflict with buses needing to pickup/dropoff passangers.
Living in rural Devon and before in rural Wales, there is not many cycle lanes around. But we did used to live in Tamworth which had a good infrastructure, with car free paths. I noticed some of these types of path when driving in the midlands, and they are useless. Too narrow and more often than not blocked by parked cars. The problem is we have a confrontational atmosphere between vehicle users and cyclists, so any money spent on real cycling infrastructure is criticised as a waste of money, and vehicles have been prioritised for long it will take many years for it to change.
To be fair. If the cyclist stayed in a cycle lane, and driver stayed in the 'car lane' there would be zero drama.
What you never seem to mention is just how much sharper your senses are when on a bike. You can hear far more than any motorist or motorcyclist can ever do. You heard the police car long before any motorist would have (a professional driver will always crack their window to improve hearing).
Also, as a cyclist, you can do a lifesaver glance so easily.
Painted lines = murder strip
‘Murder Strip’. Says it all really…
Usually the white line on narrow painted cycleways is exactly where your wheels should be and no less than that from the kerb
Own it, you’re half a car wide on a bike.
This have about as much value as "Sharrows". In some ways these are more dangerous because road users treat it as a separate lane until it inconveniences them. At least with Sharrows there's no assumption there's an extra lane there.
That said, it does serve to make the cyclist a bit more visible and somewhat gives them their own space.
The big problem with this type of car infrastructure is that it does nothing to make riding there safer or more civilized. It generally just promotes the shouts of "get in the cycle lane".
So many problems with this type of lane, especially when poorly maintained and conceived only as a token afterthought, but I think the worst is that most of them are not enough to encourage safe passing even if respected by drivers. The Highway Code standards have actually made them not just obsolete, but potentially harmful if drivers take them as their passing standard, or otherwise as a substitute for their own care and judgement.
I have a road with painted "cycle lanes" near me, where the cycle bit isn't wide enough for a bike and the "car" bit isn't wide enough for a car, plus it's got double white lines down the middle! It's shockingly dangerous and I won't ride in it.
I seen people use these cycle areas going in the wrong direction. Which I think is a problem if they weren’t there the wouldn’t ride in the wrong direction.
My commute takes me on the A226, between Strood and Higham, where there is a solid white line cycle lane. It has been there for decades, and while the road has been resurfaced the cycle lane has not,; it is now degraded, pot-holed and obstructed. It's far safer to use the main carriageway. While most drivers are respectul of this, I do get the occasional close 'punishment' pass by drivers who think I am obliged to use the cycle lane.
My belief is the motorist will often think that the width of the cycle lane will have sufficient space to pass the cyclist regardless of road surface conditions
Given the development of the area around that Sainsburys in recent years, it doesn’t surprise me to see this infrastructure and nor does it surprise me to see how well maintained it is
To add also the segregated section of Regent Road around Everton’s new stadium is a better piece of infrastructure than this if not as well swept
If only the utility companies or road maintenance had an excuse to dig a hole here, soon see the surface crumble
I don’t see the line as anything more than a left hand boundary for the cars.
In my area, we didn’t used to have a left line at all in many suburban/semi rural areas. So you had a centre line, and an ill-defined boundary on the left. If the road lane was wide cars might position themselves relative to the centre line, or alternatively to the road shoulder.
The unbroken white line to the left of the car, to the right of the cyclist, is good, whether it’s designated a cycleway or not. It’s simply a wider, safer, recognised shoulder.
It's a sodding joke.
In some locations they are a problem for sure. There are a some I use on a dual carriageway, where busses pass at speed, they always cause a wobble because the air disturbance and close proximity while passing, it feels quite dangerous at times,
Road studies has proven that those cycle lanes are the most dangerous piece of road infrastructure, and cyclists should not ride in them, because they invite motorists to close pass.
Paint is not infrastructure, might as well not bother.
They can be useful at busy junctions where there is often queueing traffic, they enable cyclists to easily filter to the front of the queue to a cycle box.
They are often painted on quiet roads where they are of little value and can as you say cause close passing.
*Paint Saves Lives!*😉
Not great but I've seen some where the painted lane runs next to car parking spaces – leaving the cyclist to pick between riding in the door zone or risking driver aggression for not being in the cycle lane.
Your comments on painted cycle lines resonates with me. non-cycling motorists seem to think that it is a magic barrier making the cyclist safe. I cycle on some that are obviously just an afterthought and make the lane too narrow for a bike and a car to occupy the same space, it would be far better not to have them.
I would love to have these cycle lanes in Lincoln, instead we have cracked bumpy footways with a bike symbol painted onto them, and you have to battle with pedestrians and vehicles parked on it.
Here's a question for you Ashley, if a cyclist is approaching a parked car the way you did and there were cars approaching quickly from behind does a cyclist have to stop and let them pass before going past the obstruction or can they just signal and pull out to pass?
See the difference between a fully trained cyclist using the road and the other 99.999% that refuse any suggestion that there should be mandatory training, testing & licencing for all wheeled road users?
There will always be situations on the road. Vehicles have to park or unload (note bikeys never mention all the limey bikes stacked up on the pavement obstructing pedestrians).
There will be pot-holes, litter, dog mess & broken glass in the road.
There will always be tossers, arrogant & dangerous road users.
A fully trained road user with the right mindset will be able to deal with these.
It is not the 1950's with today's busy roads & the influx of diversity 3rd word road use, now is the time to bring in mandatory training, testing, licencing & registration for all wheeled road users.
Start with the hire bikes. So easy to put a registration plate on these. Current renter can then easily be traced.
I think it speaks volumes about road user mentality when you hear phrases like "my lane". The road infrastructure belongs to the nation and the users are all just trying to get to their destination and working together is the smoothest way to achieve this
Most roads are so old they don't lend themselves to adding cycle lanes. As for cyclists moving out of the cycle lane into the main carriageway, to pass a stationary vehicle I doubt drivers see it as coming into their lane for any other reason then to pass a stationary vehicle. As long as the cyclist does not make traffic take evasive action I don't see it as a problem, good drivers will automatically give cyclists the room to move to the main carriageway to pass a stationary vehicle so again no problem. The problem in m my opinions is when the driver does not give way to the cyclist and the cyclist does not give way to the driver.
Personally, I'm happy to do away with most cycling infrastructure and just ride on the road with the cars. I'm not a fan of the segregated cycle lanes as it doesn't give you room or options to avoid hazards other than you hope you can slow/stop in time to avoid risks. Also doesn't give much or any room to overtake slower cyclists safely. And the separate lights which can take an age to cycle through and then only gives a couple of seconds and changes.
But I get why people use them and I try to use them when possible to avoid antagonising drivers when not using them.
I like cycle lanes when they’re properly built and designed, like this one
In free flowing traffic, they're more trouble than they're worth. They are only really any use at busy times when traffic is stationary, as they encourage the queueing traffic to stop further out to the right.
As soon as traffic is moving (at all), encouraging drivers and cyclists to behave as if there's an invisible barrier between them, when really it's just paint on the road seems a bad idea.
I honestly prefer the painted cycle lanes although I don't ride along Greaty or generally anywhere near town. It's not pleasant on a bike. The thing purportingto be a segregated bike lane that they've created on the Strand, allegedly to encourage "vulnerable" would-be cyclists who don't like using what was a perfectly adequate, wide road, is now almost entirely the preserve of persons from abroad on electric bikes, mini-mopeds and various other power-assisted contraptions; as these people are apparently incapable of riding pedal bikes or following simple traffic directions and instructions, the bike lane is now far more dangerous than the road ever was.
You only have to trace the evolution of your videos from 2014 to date to see how things have changed for the worse. Unless some of the subscribers actually think it's better now 🤔
Painted bicycle gutters are not infrastructure, they are just designating you to the part of the road with the worst quality surface. We need much better.
"protected by a solid white line" says it all really. Pointless.
Is that cycle lane 1.5 Metres wide? If not then how are drivers supposed to know what is an appropriate distance to give cyclists
Painted lanes work ok in more remote or rural areas, but once you get a lot of competing demand for road space, you start to need things like separated lanes (or alternate networks for bikes). I use some almost daily to get around. Better than nothing for the stretch of road I'm on, but it's my best available option. Not my preferred option.