I currently have a 2021 Midnight Special. I absolutely love the bike but have some minor gripes so I’ve been keeping my eye out for a possible replacement that would improve some of the nagging issues.
I have two main issues with the Surly. The standover is just a hair more than ideal. I can straddle it but just barely. The second, and more nagging issue is that I’ve got a zero setback seat post and the saddle is pushed as far forward as the rails will allow and I still feel like I’m up on the nose a bit more than I want.
My friend pointed out the news of the 2025 Nicasio 2. It ticks all the boxes in terms of features and, at least to my eye and the numbers on bikeinsights, it seems like I could get a better setback for my proportions with only a marginal change in reach (would need 10mm more on my stem). Does this seem right?
What other characteristics would I notice from the slight differences in overall frame geometry between these two?
by terdward
8 Comments
Sounds like the Surly is too big for you. Maybe I’m missing something but if you’re up on the nose of the saddle, why would you want another bike with the same reach instead of going shorter? How tall are you?
I read through this 3-4 times looking for an explanation as to why you’re comparing different sizes. …. Is that because you know your current frame is too large already? Are you looking to change bikes and sizes?
I’d definitely recommend trying to ride them both, geometry changes can have some really noticeable effects on ride feel. Their front ends look like cockpit feel will be pretty similar (the surly will be a little twitchier), but you might think the back end of one feels more “floppy/tight” than the other depending on what you like.
Aesthetically surly bikes are more upright looking bikes with tighter clearances similar to italian lugged track or roadbikes even the njs ones from japan but surly bikes not meant for performance but all about looks, retro looking bikes, i will go for surly if you will ask me, i have seen enough marin roadbikes i dont understand their selling point 🤣 they aren’t good looking nor perform as performance bike.
Is the saddle position uncomfortable because of the reach or the way it positions your body relative to the pedals?
If it’s the former, you should probably try a smaller bike. You seem to have a particular attachment to a particular size of bike. The correct bike size is the one that you can ride comfortably.
If it’s the latter, you can look for a bike with a more upright seat post angle.
You need to look at size 55ish frames, based on other comments
The geometry values that matter for handling are rear-center, BB drop, front-center, HTA and fork offset. The measurements that matter for fit are STA, reach and stack. You haven‘t listed any of these.
1. I see a big difference in standover height, which is unimportant.
2. I see the Marin has more BB drop. More BB drop makes bike handling feel more direct/quicker.
3. The Marin has a longer wheelbase. That will make it require a bigger steering input to make the same radius turn as the Surly.
4. The Marin has a slacker HTA (less responsive steering) and larger fork offset (more responsive steering.) They offset each other, but not completely. Overall the Nicasio‘s HTA/offset results in slightly more trail and lazier steering.
5. You would likely use a 1cm shorter stem with the Surly, which would result in slightly more responsive steering feel.
Surlys run large