Hoy Borja Fernández Zurrón, de Memorias de Pez, se une al club de los Vividores SL.
Va a explicarnos cómo fue el proceso de dejar un trabajo estable con un buen sueldo para dedicarse a lo que le apasionaba… Divulgar creando contenido con un estilo propio que le ha ayudado a ser un referente en su sector.
¡Ponte cómodo y dale Cañita al Like! 🍻
REDES DE MEMORIAS DE PEZ👇🏻
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/memoriasdepez/
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@memoriasdepez
X: https://x.com/MemoriasPez
YouTube: @MemoriasDePez
Capítulos de la charla:
00:00 Trailer
01:41 Intro
04:19 Origenes de Memorias de Pez
14:19 Unirse al enemigo
17:02 Dejar el trabajo
20:11 Mexas
22:14 El negocio de Memorias de Pez
26:34 Autoexigencia
28:22 Retirarse a los 40
29:05 Vuelta a casa
29:57 Exclusiva de la Pecera de Memorias
30:43 Necesitamos un reto
31:58 Javier Ares
33:26 Pregunta de Chente
34:51 ¿Cómo deberían invertir los jovenes?
38:44 Educación Financiera
40:10 ¿Es el SP500 una burbuja?
43:45 Invierte sabiendo lo que haces
46:41 El Problema de las Pensiones
50:25 Los Autónomos en España
53:30 Mi vecina
55:22 El Escenario a 10 años vista
01:00:07 El Baby Boom
01:01:27 ¿Todos los países tienen los mismos problemas?
01:03:38 La Economía Perfecta
01:07:40 Buscando soluciones
01:15:22 Mi situación personal
01:21:54 El test del vividor
01:24:05 Preguntas para Pitufollow
01:25:22 Cierre
Recuerda compartir el episodio si te ha gustado y no te olvides suscribirte al canal 😏
Darle Cañita al Like Vividores 👋🏼
Are you a freeloader or not? Well, I’d say yes. The root of all Spain’s economic problems lies in its aging population. I’m leaving my job around October . I think my first salary over €1,000 will arrive, I don’t know if it’s in January or February. They don’t talk about it at university, in high school, or anywhere else. Why isn’t there financial education at universities? Because until now, financial education has been practically nonexistent. How many followers do you have these days, so people can get their bearings? I think 2,700,000 on “Memories of PES,” I think, and then on “Shark Memories” we have 700-something, maybe 1,000, and on “The Fishbowl of Memories,” a hundred and something thousand. Raising taxes increases revenue up to a certain point because there’s a point where raising taxes discourages wealth creation so much that you actually don’t collect more, you start collecting less. I’d like to know what investment you’d recommend to young people. Investment for young people. Wow, I’m glad you asked. Well, not only within the world of geopolitics and history, but in general, the world of science communication is a world of total cooperation among creators. Something you’ve emphasized since we were little is that one of your big goals in life is to retire at 40. Yes, that’s true. Explain the Norway thing, please, because people are going to love it. Norway is very interesting; for me, it’s the perfect economic model and the perfect model of how an economy with a large state—that is, a strong state with high taxes—can develop and provide a very good life for its citizens. And have you shared this with the community, or is it a bit of an… Well, a bit of an exclusive for you. Watch out, watch out, exclusive, exclusive for the freeloaders. Hey guys. You saw a good intro, didn’t you? Today’s guest, as you know, is a real freeloader, he’s one of my friends. Now we’ll learn a little more about him. As you can see, he’s invited us to his place. We’re in what would be the “memory fishbowl,” which many of you will know. Today I’m with my friend Borja from “Memories of Fish.” Hello, how are you doing, freeloaders? How are you all? Well, what made me laugh? I found the answer funny. Very well. It’s just that I’m not used to it. Borja let me use his setup, he explained a bit how it works. If you see anything weird, hey, you just have to accept it, that’s what it is, right? For what you’re paying, no, it’s not a big deal. That ‘s true. That’s true. That’s the good thing about the democratization of content, at least you don’t lose money. You have a nice tone of voice, huh? Thank you very much. Hey, do you know that you change it when we’re having a normal conversation, when there’s a camera on? No, I know. It’s something you’re born with. It just comes naturally to me, like a video voice, a 19th-century storyteller’s voice. It just comes out, it just comes out, and I’m incapable of not using it when I’m being recorded. I don’t know why , but it’s something I don’t really talk about with everyone. I mean, it seems like I’m born with it , I’m born with it. Tell me. I always like to start interviews with a key question, okay? Are you a bon vivant or not? Well, I’d say yes. I’d say that both you and I really enjoy having a good time. And beyond how much fun we have in our free time, I think we’ve found a lifestyle we like, a lifestyle we enjoy , and we’re very lucky to spend, well, a third or half of our lives consciously not sleeping, not sleeping, because it’s our workday. In the end, it’s 8 hours a day, or more, but we spend it doing something we love, and also, well, I think we’re fulfilling a certain social function in the sense that, well, I think entertaining people is a really cool thing, very fulfilling, and then if they can also learn something from us, even better, because we know for sure that everyone learns something since we get stopped in the street quite often. Borja, thank you so much for all your support. Young people, older people, I think you help a little bit of everyone, right? On the one hand, older people, So that they understand the social problems we’re facing—sociopolitical, economic, call it what you will, because we’ll talk about it later—but you’re covering all the bases . You just need to get into sports, which you’d also do well in. Well, you dabbled in it in the past, but anyway. Yes, well, for now, let’s leave sports to the professionals. Are you happy where you are? You’re happy where you are. But I’d like you to tell us a bit about the origins, how all this started, because now we’re talking about Fish Memories, we’re talking about Shark Memories, they’re giants, I mean, they’re huge channels with millions of views. But what’s the origin of all this, Borja? Well, it all really started at university. I study business administration in Oviedo, and of course, we were there during a somewhat difficult time because it was a period when the entertainment industry, digital marketing, and everything online wasn’t very developed, and university professors had even less knowledge of it. So, if you wanted to learn about digital marketing or anything related to the internet, you were n’t going to learn it at university; you had to learn it on your own, right? Back then, content wasn’t recorded; it was written, mostly blogs, and some social media platforms that were just starting out, like Twitter, right? And that’s what I did. I said, “Well, since the best way to learn is by doing, let’s create a website, let’s create a Twitter account, and that way we’ll learn a bit about how content creation, SEO, search engine optimization, everything related to website creation and ranking, works.” And I said, “Okay, what should I make a website about?” Hmm. Well, back then I was really into history, and I thought, since there was practically no history content out there that wasn’t extremely dense, I thought, “Okay, I’m going to make the kind of content I’d like to consume, right?” And I started writing articles for a website called Battles of War and posting things on Twitter. And that went well, but back then monetizing it was very complicated. So, well, in the end it just became an anecdote that allowed me, well, in a way, to learn things and, above all, to understand what content worked and what content didn’t. The thing is, years later, when I was working as a data analyst for a digital marketing department at a company called Ticket Bis, which was later bought by the eBay group, I got a similar curiosity, you know? So now I want to learn. Social media was fully developed, YouTube had emerged with great force, and the question was, well, I’m going to try to create the kind of content I would have liked to consume, and at the same time, I’ll learn about social media, algorithms, and video editing. So, in the end, what I did was use the scripts I had written, the articles from the website. I said, “I’m going to turn them into videos.” And I came up with the format of the hand drawing, but the real hand at that time, the real hand was Sara’s, a girl who started the project with me. Was Sara from university too? No, she was simply a friend from Gijón, and she drew very well. I mentioned it to her, and she joined in, right? What year were we talking about? Right, so people can get a bit of context with the YouTube thing. I created the website in 2011 or 2012, I don’t remember exactly, but around then, and then on March 17, 2017, I launched the channel. I had the idea around 2015, but it took a while to actually get started until I found the right partner. So, what we did was create a couple of videos without much ambition, but they did really well. They quickly gained traction, and it immediately clicked for me that this could work if we scaled it up, meaning that instead of one video a month, we could do four or five. Now we almost, well, more than four or five videos a week, but back then, doing four or five videos a month was a huge undertaking. Challenge. And there was a moment when I said, well, I think if I dedicated myself to this professionally back then , the channel would bring in €300 a month. Wow, but I thought, with that you wouldn’t really make much in the end, but I thought, if I uploaded one video a month, if I even managed to upload it, because those analog drawing videos take a lot of time, but I thought, if I made more, especially after learning that they could be done digitally with software, if I made more, it’s very likely that the €300 would become something I could live on, right? So, I quit my job, started making videos, and it worked right away. And it worked right away because the numbers quickly added up as planned. And well, if I quit my job around October, I think my first salary over €1000 came, I don’t know if it was in January or February. Well, it didn’t take you that long, huh? Even so, it didn’t take me long. It’s just that people think YouTube is simpler than it actually is, and what you find there. You also have to keep in mind that when I started it was much easier because there was much less competition. There were incredibly large history or geopolitics topics with no videos ranking, right? You’d practically say something about World War II and you’d be the only one there, and now you have hundreds and hundreds of amazing videos from many creators. So, starting in 2017, in that three-year period, was much easier than it is today to start in any niche because right now everything is very saturated. What was that first video you uploaded to YouTube? The one I drew back then? Well, look, I uploaded the one about the history of the Second Republic, and that one did well, right? It got there, now it has a million and a half views, something like that, right? But back then, I was getting maybe 1,000 views a day, it was doing pretty well. But the second video I uploaded, the one about the history of the Spanish Tercios, suddenly took off, and I remember one day I had 25,000 views, which was spectacular back then. I mean, even compared to now, when you’re used to a different scale, those are still incredible numbers. But that’s what started bringing me a lot of subscribers, and then, if I did an interview in some media outlet, it quickly gained a lot of traction , and so, the idea was to professionalize the content creation a bit. Then, a little later, came the whole issue of the major wars, right? First came the US withdrawal from Afghanistan, which was a big spike, and then came the war in Ukraine, which is when I started thinking about getting a team, because I couldn’t do everything myself, and I saw that there was still a lot more content to be produced. There was an audience hungry for that kind of content, but I couldn’t do any more. So, that’s where I started building a team, and we’re still a team of six today, working to create content for people. I still remember back in the COVID era, those first meals that were legally allowed, and we celebrated your 300,000 subscribers back then. How many followers do you have today, just so people know? Well, I think on Memorias de P there are two, well, 2,700,000, I think. We’ll reach three, I believe, next year. And then on Memoria de Tiburón we have 700-something, maybe 1,000, and on La Pecera de Memorias, 100-something, which is curiously the channel with the fewest subscribers, but at the same time, the channel with the most loyal subscribers, right? And that ‘s because, ultimately, the idea behind creating the “Fishbowl of Memories” is to try and build a bit more of a personal brand, not only to reach a lot of people but also to retain them and create a kind of community. And to create that kind of community, I needed to be physically present in the videos, and I needed to create a kind of internal lore for the “Fishbowl of Memories” so that people would have inside jokes, iconic characters from the channel, a kind of context that, well, people have really liked, and we have a super loyal community in the “Fishbowl of Memories” that, honestly, fills me with pride . In the end, I think you’re like the news for young people, or… It’s the social media news, or at least that’s how I see it and how I like it. Whether you want to label it that or not, it’s good. It’s a different way of telling the news, a different way to get people interested in international politics, and hey, if, like I said, people have fun, learn, and we’re that little bit that fills a lot of people’s days, well, we’re delighted, and I hope it continues like this for a long time. I think one of the keys to your success, and what you do so well, is that you tackle topics that can be very complex because people don’t have much knowledge about them; they’re very dense, and you kind of spoon-feed them, explaining them in a simple, engaging way. I think that’s one of the keys to your success, isn’t it? Yes. The idea behind it is, if my mother can understand it, then the video is good, right? That’s kind of what we want, for people to stay engaged. And to stay engaged, they have to understand everything, right? When you explain too many things that aren’t well explained or that are too technical, that’s when your mind wanders. And if your mind wanders, you’re not going to stay hooked on the video, right? So, everything has to be simplified, but at the same time, we also want to avoid going into too much detail, even if it’s very well explained, so that those who want to delve deeper can also find value in the video. Because we don’t want the conclusions we reach or the analyses we do to just stay on the surface; we want them to be well understood and explore the different topics a bit more. But even so, for people who want to specialize even further, you recently launched the course, right? The summit course . Ah, well, uh, look, yes, we’ve launched a geopolitics course with Solo Fonseca, or rather, with Enrique Fonseca, from the Solo Fonseca channel, which is great, an international politics channel, the most-watched channel in Spanish. And we’ve teamed up, well, exactly, right? For anyone who wants to get started with a slightly deeper education, anyone who’s passionate about geopolitics and wants to go a little further, to have a timeless understanding of the world we live in. It’s interesting because you mention joining forces, so to speak, with one of your biggest rivals, your most direct competitor, and in other sectors that would seem impossible, wouldn’t it? So, is there a good atmosphere within your sector? Well, not only within the world of geopolitics and history, but in general in the world of popularization, it’s a world of total cooperation among creators, isn’t it? I know there are other sectors where people compete, I know there are, well, sectors with more rivalry, but in the case of science communication, most of us know each other, we’re friends. Well, one of my groups of friends in Madrid is made up of science communicators, so we even have an association where, well, we have parties, we organize events, we share, we help each other, and in general, the world of science communication on YouTube is good, science communication in general on social media is extremely non-toxic. Who is the creator for you? Two questions. Who do you feel most connected to? Who do you have the most rapport with? And then, who do you admire the most? The one you say, “Damn, this guy, he’s really passionate, he comes up with great ideas, he communicates really well.” Well, I think the best science communicator in this country, and possibly in the Spanish-speaking world, is José Luis Crespo from Quantum Fractur, who talks about physics. Look, I’m not really into physics, but if I ask, what should the perfect content creator be like? We have Crespo right there, right? Because of everything: his passion for science communication, his passion for his subject, his consistency, and how well he does it, right? And his perfect attention to detail. Then, in terms of personal affinity, well, I’d say with my group of science communication friends, we have Rocío, Rodinger’s cat, Hyperactin, 12 CSV, Carlos and Andrea Espinórbita who are also doing science communication, and Crespo himself. There’s a small group of people we get along with really well, and then, from my own circle, with a bit of my same interests, there’s Karim from the old continent, there’s Enrique Fonseca, right? And we were just talking about Lechero from Noticias Ilustradas. Well, there are some really great people, like Lechero. I’ve mentioned it before , he’s really cool because he has a unique personal brand and a very, very, very style. He ‘s worked really hard. I think what he’s always struggled with is finding a consistent source of income, but when it comes to content creation and community building, he’s one of the best. And Borja, going back to our roots a bit, you ‘re in a very good position now, of course, good income, you work really hard, nobody gives you anything for free, but I want to imagine that conversation you had with your mother when you came to Madrid, studied for your degree, [ __ ] always good grades, languages, Erasmus, and all that, the master’s degree was super cool, you got into a really, really good company, and suddenly, hey, I’m leaving all this for a job that pays less than €1,000 and I don’t know what the future holds. Look, at no point did my mother discourage me, but let’s just say that at first both she and my sister were skeptical, let’s say skeptical, because they didn’t see it as very clear. They were saying, “There’s the channel thing, I don’t know, Mexas, which is another company I started back in the day and it’s still going. They weren’t very sure about it. They were saying, “Well, look, we trust you because we know you’ve looked into things and you’re doing this for a reason.” Well, I don’t know. Well, but you’d better take a leave of absence, don’t quit your job, just in case you need it someday. But well, fortunately I’ve never had to go back and nothing, and they quickly saw that, okay, good, good, she did the right thing, good move. It was hard for you to make the decision, I mean, because when I think about it, you start thinking about it, right? Like, pros, cons, oh my god, what could happen to me, and if this doesn’t work out, the fears, right? Typical. Well, the truth is it wasn’t hard for me because when I make the decision, I make it from a place of being completely fed up, like, I had a job, right? I have to say, I was paid well for my age, and I worked extremely few hours, but of course, it’s good that you acknowledge that. Yes, yes, I worked very few hours. The thing is, there was a restructuring at the company, and in the restructuring, I was left without a boss. So, well, I didn’t have much to do, and it’s true that I thought, “Look, this is happening to me at 40 with two kids, and it’s great because I can enjoy my family and everything,” but at that time, when I was 27, something like that, I felt like I was missing out, I was missing my chance to do things, you know? So I wanted to quit. Besides, well, at that company I was the workers’ representative in UNERE, and I saw that it really resonates with you, and yes, I mean, if you get to know Borja, that’s what he’s like. Borja is like the ringleader of everything union-related. I represented the workers in UNC. We got really good results, of course. It was a company of 500 people, and there were three representatives, one of whom was me, and I was also the youngest in the company. So it was like, well, you know, you voted for me, but things didn’t all work out very well. But I also saw that for the company, we were just numbers, that nobody really cared about anyone’s personal situation. So what I said was, look, I’m not comfortable here, I’m not motivated either, I have ideas, I have an alternative project that I think could work, let’s go for that alternative project. And fortunately, it worked out well. Otherwise, I would have tried something else, probably, or, you know, I don’t mind staying still, at least for now. And while I was at that same company, someone came into my life who would end up being very important: Jessica. Jessica, no, don’t be surprised. Yes, Jessica is, well, my other half at Mexas, she’s my partner. She explains to people what Mexas is to give you more details. Well, me too, when I quit my job, I start binge-watching “Memories of Fish.” But I also started a company in parallel with a colleague from that job who was in the same situation as me, and that’s Jessica, right? It’s a women’s shoe brand, which we produce by hand in Mexico. We import it from there and have adapted it to the European market , and we sell throughout the European Union, and in the United States as well. It’s a company that’s doing very well. It’s true that I’m no longer involved in the operational side of the company, only in the decision-making, and Jessica is the one who really runs the business. But well, I’m still the owner of half the company, and well, Jessica also came into my life, a very important person, and well, I’ve also been there side by side with her, going through some tough times. I think I remember you starting right in the middle of the pandemic, right? That’s when you received your first order, quite a story. The thing is, we were going to start selling on March 9th, which is spring when the shoe season begins, and on March 9th, just one day before, COVID hit, so we had to postpone everything. Suddenly everyone was at home because if you’re at home you’re not even thinking about buying shoes, or if you are thinking about buying shoes you can’t wear them out on the street, so there’s no word of mouth. And what happened to us is that, well, it all started with a major setback that then multiplied the following year when we had a problem with a supplier that practically bankrupted us. And from there, well, the truth is we recovered well and now it’s a company that, well, it has its team, it has grown and continues on that path of growth, and hopefully it will continue, but well, it’s true that on a day-to-day basis what I’m focused on is the Memorias ecosystem. How many people are there now in the Memorias ecosystem in total? There are six of us. There are six of us, two editors and then four people who do a bit of everything. So, the income is very variable. You depend a little on… well, you know. You depend a lot on website visits, they fluctuate a lot, they vary a great deal, right? It’s a lot of pressure, isn’t it? How do you manage it? Because, well , there are six of us, believe me, I’m not kidding. Yes. Well, in a way, I think the six of us can rest easy because if there’s one thing I’m sure of, it’s that I prefer to err on the side of having a team that’s too small for what we could do than to err on the side of having an oversized team and then, at the slightest scare, have to let people go or stop working with some of them. So, well, for my part, I prefer it to be like this: hey, look, we could do this, but hey, I’d rather be six and not be able to do everything than be ten and suddenly say, “Hey guys, this suddenly isn’t as profitable as it used to be, right?” Because there are many, there are always potential disruptions in our business, right? Well, now it could be artificial intelligence, it could be the arrival of a bunch of American channels in Spanish-speaking countries. It could be the massive influx of people who now make videos about geopolitics, history, economics— it’s saturated, right?—with channels. So, well, it’s true that we already have a certain base of having a bit of a brand established, of already having an audience that trusts us, but it’s also true that this is very fluctuating, and where today you have a promotional contract for a tool, in a few months you might not have it anymore, and that makes you rethink everything, right? Do you manage all that part yourself, talking to brands? Do you send them briefs and such? Or do you delegate to a personal agency? Well, there are things I do directly with brands, and then there are things that are handled by an agency I regularly work with. I have two agencies I usually work with, and when these agencies propose some kind of collaboration, they manage it for me, they take their percentage, and everyone’s happy. But the idea is that we proactively manage anything that comes to our email . If we’re really busy, we might refer it to one of these agencies, and anything they propose directly, we do with them. But you, even though you could delegate a lot, I know you like to be very hands-on , to have everything under control, I mean, you’re a hard worker, basically, right? Yes, the truth is, well, we’ve had a very heavy workload for the last four or five years, especially me personally , but well, we’re also at that age, and I hope that the extra work we’re putting in now will be compensated for by putting in less in the future, right? That’s kind of the idea I have, isn’t it? Absolutely, but for example, sometimes when we’ve gone on vacation, we’ve been somewhere, Borja is the typical one who comes with his laptop and microphone, and suddenly we’re all eating in the living room and we hear Borja recording for his memoirs, locked in his room. This has happened several times. It happens because, on top of everything else, there’s this bad habit in the world of wars starting or coups happening the moment I get on a plane, you know, when I go on vacation. It’s something that’s happened on the last 10 vacations. It’s probably happened nine times. Hey, maybe if you don’t fly anymore, you’ll get a Nobel Peace Prize, right? Look, I went to Mexico last year and I thought, “Well, this time everything’s calm, nothing’s going to happen, I’m going to Mexico for a week, I’ve got everything ready, videos prepared, all that, airport on my way back, I’m at the gate, gate, uh, I check my phone before getting on a 13-hour plane, I check my phone, Iran has just attacked Israel.” I can’t believe it. I mean, was there a worse moment than the moment you board a plane where you’re going to be isolated for 13 hours? How could they even think of that? It’s just so selfish. It’s a real issue. I don’t know how I don’t. Did you ever consider canceling or changing your flight? No, no, no, no. But I was at the European Commission in Brussels yesterday. I already told them that next time they want to do something, they should call me beforehand, because I need to be organized. Isn’t this incredible? But this thing about not being able to disconnect , right? Is it something you demand of yourself because of the demands of your job, or is it something you’re just naturally drawn to? Because it happens to me with the daily reels. I’ve been thinking about changing my strategy a bit, maybe ditching the daily reels and focusing on less quantity and more quality. You know, you’re already at the top of your game in terms of quality, I mean, in my case. So, I have it. I could have even higher quality than I do. It’s just that I often prioritize producing more content over creating edits with amazing effects. Sure, editing matters, but ultimately, the content you provide, the value you bring—the information— is always very good. That said, that’s true, right? Where we sacrifice quality for quantity in editing . And have you considered changing formats or anything like that? Yes, yes, yes, we’re always trying new things. In fact, the “memory fishbowl” is, isn’t it, a response to this. When we started doing live streams from home, commenting on current international events, it was also to try new things, and I have different things in mind. We’ve also done interviews, and we’ve just held our first live event. As for disconnecting, it’s not good for me to disconnect 100% completely because then I feel worse. I’m more stressed being 100% disconnected than being 20% connected, you know? The thing is, well, it’s true that once you have a team and all that, there are many times when it’s hard to let go. Let go in the sense of everyone working, no one being idle, that, well, if you need something, you have it, and there are many times when that sense of duty makes you go beyond what you should, also because of the mental toll, because of all this, you know? And how are you going to manage it in the long term? Well, not in the long term, in the medium term I’d say, because something you ‘ve emphasized since we were little is that one of your big goals in life is to retire at 40. Yes, the truth is, well, not so much that I’ll stop working forever at 40, but it ‘s true that in the medium term what I’m really planning is to work as much as I want and not as much as is demanded of me, right? Because I’m planning for the financial situation by then to be Good enough that I can choose the hours I want to put in and the work I want to do. That’s more or less the idea. This retirement, where’s it going to be? Well, the question is offensive. It’s going to be in my beloved Gijón, where I hope to move soon. You know, I think we all have that longing, right? To go back home at some point, whether it’s Seville to Seville, Catalonia to Catalonia, wherever, right? It’s like all of us young people who go through Madrid eventually reach that point. But I think that Madrid is a city you’re going to miss a lot . Definitely, definitely. In fact, my plan is to come back to Madrid a lot once I go to Gijón, right? First, because you have a lot of people there with whom you’ve shared a lot and you want to keep sharing. Second, because Madrid is the city of the pleasure-seekers. Clearly. So, we have to be here. So, we have to be here. And third, because Madrid also offers many professional opportunities, and you have to come here regularly to do things, like events and networking. How would you like to manage all this when you’re here? For example, the memory fishbowl that’s being recorded here where we are now—do you already have a plan, or haven’t you started on it yet? Well, the idea is to change the format. I think so, I really liked the memory fishbowl, and it works very well, and it’s great doing it with David. We had a blast making it, but I think it has an expiration date, and it will be time to start something new. And have you shared this with the community, or is it a bit of a…? Well, a bit of an exclusive that I’m giving you. Watch out, watch out, exclusive, exclusive for the lively ones. Well, that’s the idea I have, right? To try new things and change the format a bit, but well, there’s still plenty of fishbowl left. We still have a few months left, and then we’ll see how we do it. Since I’m here with you, and you’re an expert on a million things, I really enjoy going for runs with Borja, for example. We run near home, just the two of us, because he always keeps me up to date on everything. He’s like an episode of “Memories of Fish,” but you can ask him questions, interact with him, and all that. The thing is, I don’t know if this is obvious, well, yes, everyone who sees you knows it, but you run really fast, and he pushes me to my limit at 170 beats per minute. And of course, on top of that, you have to keep up with him at 170, drafting behind him and telling him about the latest news in Ukraine, you know? I mean, but he does it, saying that you’re in your prime, that you’ve improved a lot, and that you’re going all out with your sport, right? You should set yourself some goals for next year, since you’ll be in Gijón a bit more focused and all that. Hey, we could do a challenge. We could do something together, you know, if we leave a realistic idea in the comments. Don’t ask us for a Titaner or anything like that, but because Borja is going to join the cycling scene, by the way. Yes, it’s true, I’m really looking forward to it. As soon as I go to Gijón, I’m joining the group, the BTI cult. It’s a cult that’s hard to leave, you know? I’m warning you. I’m already part of the cycling-watching cult, you know I swallow everything. I mean, but you’ve been doing it your whole life. I’ve been swallowing everything my whole life. Now I’m going to be one of those who also practices it. A big fan of Javier Ares, Borja. I mean, a huge fan, an extreme fan. I’d love to meet Javier Ares, just to thank him. Yes, yes, yes, but just to thank him for the countless hours I’ve spent consuming his content on YouTube and also his, uh, broadcasts. Of course, Javier’s age really surprised me, I mean, he’s older than I imagined. He must be in his late fifties, right? No, 70 and 70, and well, I’ll have to check, but they told me and I just swallowed it, oh my god. Yes, yes, like he could already be retired, but yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, absolutely. I mean, just imagine, it’s going to be tough when Javier Ares retires, imagine if he’s been doing it for years, huh? I don’t know, he’s passionate about what he does. Who would you say could be his replacement ? Who do you like? I like him. Mm, good question, huh? Let’s see, I really like the duo of Fleche and Contador, I always have a great time watching them. A few stories, huh? Yes, yes, I like it I’m really into the cycling news, but I don’t really know who’s on there. Well, mostly Juan Clavijo, and young Asturian too. CLJ Clavijo does a great job, but I don’t know who else outside the Eurosport ecosystem could be on there. I really like this one on Spanish Television, right? Uh, I’m more of a viewer, I watched a lot on Spanish Television, but I always watch Eurosport, to be honest. Um, why are you laughing? No, I find it funny. Look, I’ve been with Perico and I’ve spent many hours with Carlos too, but it’s true that I prefer the current lineup on Eurosport. Now that we’re talking about cycling, I’m going to take this opportunity to introduce you to a friend, well, you probably already know him. Well, Chente, the great Chente García Costa was the third guest. You know, I like to connect you all somehow? I’ll try to connect you with the next guest at the end of this chat. I’ll tell you with a story about Chente. Let’s see. Hm. When my parents took me, uh, I must have been about 11 years old, to Bayonne to see the Tour, and I remember he waved to me. I mean, we were there near the finish line with the cyclists. Of course, I wasn’t a kid, and I remember he went by 80 and waved to me, man. You see a kid and you wave, you know? That’s what stuck with you, and I ended up with Chent. He’s a phenomenon, you know, and I could tell you a thousand stories about when I’m with him, with the team and all that. It must be hilarious, you know? I mean, when he starts telling you stories, it’s not just the story itself, it’s the way he tells it and conveys it. Chente’s an idol. Yeah. Sometimes when I’ve gone to see you and he’s been there, it’s been laughs. Yeah, yeah. No, no, totally. So, what does Chente say? Well, the thing is, he wanted to send you a message. Okay, you’ll have to come up with a couple of questions for the next guest, but I’ll tell you about that later. Let’s get started. Hello, bon vivants. Hello, Borja. I’m Chente García Costa , and I’d like to ask you a question. Since I have two kids, two teenagers, I’d like to know what investment you would recommend to young people. Investment for young people. Wow, I’m glad you asked me this question, aren’t I? Look, above all, obviously the best investment for a young person is their education, right? But since we’re talking, uh, I don’t want to fall into the trap of dodging Chente’s question. Being young and having someone explain to you how investing works, and especially compound interest, is the best thing that can happen to you in your life. The most important thing for a young person isn’t so much what to invest in, but creating the habit of investing. In the same way that from childhood you’re taught to brush your teeth, to eat well, to exercise to be healthy and to have a much better and healthier life, the same applies to financial health. You need to develop a series of habits that require almost no effort, are very easy to follow, and with them you’ll be better off than most people and money won’t be a big problem in your life. Okay? So, what would I do if you were in my son’s shoes, for example? Like what I did for my nephews, but what would I do for my son? Well, I’d open an account with a broker, any broker. What’s a broker? For most people, a broker is a platform where you can invest, right? It’s like a bank specializing in financial products, such as investing in stocks, ETFs, index funds, whatever. What’s important about brokers? Why am I saying a broker and not Banco Santander? Well, because brokers are companies specializing in investment, and therefore the commissions and everything else are much cheaper. So, okay, I would open an account with a broker and make regular contributions to that account. When I say regular contributions, I mean, well, either every month or every quarter, a very small contribution. Let’s say €50, okay, every month. And I would invest that, for example, in a diversified product that has historically yielded a long-term return of, well, between 8 and 10% annualized. For example, an ETF, an index fund of the S&P 500, right? It’s the S&P 500, the 500 largest companies in The United States. Why the S&P 500? Because it’s diversified, right? There are many sectors represented in the 500 largest companies in the United States. And then, besides the great thing about the S&P 500, it’s also geographically diversified. And you might say, “But how can it be diversified if it’s just the 500 largest companies in the United States?” Well, because within those companies you have Google, Amazon, Coca-Cola, McDonald’s, and as far as I know, those companies have exposure all over the world. I mean, you drink Coca-Cola in Spain, in Mexico, and in Australia, right? And the same is true for most of the companies in the S&P 500. So, I would do this: make regular contributions. If the S&P 500 falls, I continue making regular contributions . If it rises significantly, I continue making regular contributions, and over the years, you’ll see that the results are extremely surprising. Anyone can Google ” compound interest calculator,” input their savings and initial capital estimates, and see that it’s truly amazing what happens when you invest steadily, like an ant, and of course, never sell, always reinvesting the profits you make, right? Borja, I’m really surprised by what you’re saying. If I hadn’t heard you mention this two or three years ago in our group of friends, or at university (having studied two different degrees), or in high school, or anywhere else, they wouldn’t have talked about it. It’s not just a taboo subject, it’s practically nonexistent. It’s as if it doesn’t exist. Why isn’t there financial education in universities? Until now, financial education was practically nonexistent, but now there’s a movement, isn’t there?, of educators focused on these topics, bringing them closer to ordinary people who lack this kind of knowledge. And fortunately, more and more people are becoming interested, right? Because before , you’d go to the bank, say to the bank teller, “Hey, you know about this stuff, what should I do with my money? Can you move it around a bit?” And you had to trust the bank, and generally, the bank didn’t have your best interests at heart. The bank would push whatever investment products suited them, right? Fortunately, now education, information, and access to information have become much more democratic, and anyone can open an account with a broker from home, transfer funds with a couple of clicks, and buy an S&P 500 ETF. It’s easy, and for someone who doesn’t know much about it, who doesn’t want to dedicate more than five minutes every three months, it’s an investment with the best risk-return ratio you can find. Something that strikes me as a bit odd, not having much knowledge about investing and all that, is how everyone seems to be investing in the S&P 500 now, right? Like, you hear absolutely everyone talking about it. I wish everyone would invest, but can’t it be counterproductive? Like, you always hear the same thing about cryptocurrencies when they were all the rage —I mean, when that initial boom happened, right? When you hear about it, it might already be too late if even your neighbor is investing in it. You know what I mean? Exactly. You say, if everyone suddenly gets caught up in the S&P 500 investment frenzy, can’t it turn into a bubble? Well, if bubbles have taught us anything throughout history, it’s that they’re cyclical, right? And in the end, the price ends up following the real value of the asset it represents, right? For example, um, let’s take the dot-com bubble as an example. The dot-com bubble existed in the year 2000 because the same thing happened with the internet as happened with artificial intelligence. When the internet appeared, there was suddenly a frenzy of people wanting to invest in the big internet companies, even though those companies weren’t yet profitable. So a huge bubble was created. The bubble burst, and just as quickly as it rose, it fell again. Then, as the years passed and those internet companies started to have real businesses, the likes of Amazon emerged. Google, right? All those things, that’s when the price went up, backed by those companies’ results, right? So, if you notice, what I’ve been saying is, if I were to invest, like for Chente’s kids, I’d make regular contributions throughout my life. Why throughout my life? Because by making contributions throughout your life, you ensure that, okay, maybe you’ve caught the bubble and then it’s crashed, but your average price will always be an average price because you’ll buy high, you’ll buy low, and in the end, you’ll follow the evolution of the results of the best companies in the world. And why are those results always increasing? You say, “Okay, and why does the S&P 500 always go up?” Because despite World War II, the Cold War, the oil crisis, the 2008 crisis, 9/11, Afghanistan, Iraq, Ukraine, why, despite all that, has the S&P 500 always gone up, right? It’s fundamental. Because ultimately, the S&P 500 is a way to always be invested in the best companies in the world, and as technology advances, and humans become increasingly efficient in their production processes, companies—the biggest companies in the world—use all that technology to be more efficient and make more money, right? So, as long as humanity progresses, it’s normal for the S&P 500 to be positive in the long run. Wow, what a masterclass you just gave us in a moment, girl, it’s great. It’s a very simple explanation, but yes, well, I’m sure you’re helping a lot of people behind the screen. Yes, if anyone wants to learn more about this topic of ETFs, the S&P 500, and so on, in “Shark Memories,” I have videos dedicated solely to this subject. No, no, they’re really great. We’re lucky in our group of friends that Borja insists on an investment talk every Christmas when we get together in Gijón . Come on, join us! And that’s how I’ve been investing for a year now, because Borja explained it to us in a very clear way. He explained the devaluation of money, what happens if you keep it in a checking account, and a lot of other things. The most important thing about investing is understanding what you’re doing, because there are a lot of people who think, “Well, I’ve been told this company is going to do well, so I’ll buy it.” That’s like going to a casino. You’re not investing, you’re speculating. You’ve been told about a company you don’t even know what it does, you haven’t looked at its accounts, you haven’t done anything, and you’ve simply been told it’s going to do well, and you say, “Okay, I ‘ll invest in it.” That’s like going to a casino. But what happens when you buy a company you don’t know what it does? When that company’s stock price drops and becomes very cheap, you’re going to say, “This is a [ __ ]. I’m selling it because I’ve heard it’s doing really well, but it’s doing terribly. Are you selling at the worst possible time?” Because this only happens with the stock market: people get nervous and sell when it’s cheap. If someone offered you 100,000 at your house and then the next day offered you 50,000, you wouldn’t sell it to them for 50,000 because the price is falling, right? It makes no sense, but well, it happens with stocks, but it’s because people don’t know what they’re ultimately getting, you know? So, a lot of people do that, thinking, “Since I don’t know what I’m investing in, if it drops a lot, I’ll sell it, and if it goes up a lot, oh, this is incredible, it’s going up so much, I’m going to buy more when it’s expensive,” right? It doesn’t work like that, you know? So, if you understand the S&P 500, as I explained before, why it will always rise in the long run, even though it won’t rise straight up. It will rise with its dips, its downturns, its cycle, but the underlying trend is that the returns tend to be positive for the reasons we’ve explained. So, if you understand this perfectly and you understand the logic of making regular purchases throughout your life, and you know that this can lead to exponential gains over time thanks to compound interest, then ultimately what happens is that you’re doing better than most people, even better than many people who know much more than you, because discipline and psychology are the key to good investing; it’s not so much about knowing everything. The last number on a company’s balance sheet, right? No, exactly. And besides, it’s what you were saying before, if you start speculating a bit with the compound interest calculator and all that, the results are incredible. They’re incredible and they really open your eyes, right? To what you have to do. And especially our generation and those coming up behind us, well, what they have to keep in mind is that the population pyramid in Spain is inverted, which I wanted to emphasize is inverted, and therefore we might not have the same pensions as our parents did, right? So, I strongly recommend that people get serious about financial education and investing and always have a very long-term horizon. And a very long-term horizon could very well be the horizon of retirement, right? Don’t put too much faith in the government because by then it might not have as many resources as you think. But that’s pretty serious, isn’t it? Because these days, young people are in a really precarious situation. I say this mainly because we’re paying taxes, and they’re increasing. I’ll ask you about the self-employed later, but that’s also been a bit of a nightmare. And the worst part is that we’re not guaranteed anything despite everything we’re paying in. It’s true that we enjoy healthcare, education, and many other things that we pay for, but something like peace of mind when we retire, if we even get to retire, is something no one guarantees, and that seems pretty harsh to me, doesn’t it? Well, these days, the big problem in Spain, or rather, the root of all of Spain’s economic problems, is the aging population. It’s the fact that very few of us have to… no, sorry, support… or bear the burden of an ever-growing number of elderly people, if you’ll excuse the redundancy. Okay, there’s the big problem, and it’s going to get worse because life expectancy is increasing and because the baby boom generation, which is huge, is about to retire or has already started to retire . In fact, by 2050, the largest population group will be those between 75 and 80 years old. Just imagine what that time will be like. It’s a real tragedy. Okay, absolutely. So, the problem with older people is, well, there are so many of them, and they’re going to vote much more than young people, right? Because older people have always been like that, they’ve always voted more than young people. And then, besides voting a lot, they have much more homogeneous interests. Older people are generally interested in two things: that their house doesn’t lose value and that their pension is as high as possible. Aside from the advantages for a politician, always from a politician’s point of view, the good thing about older people is that they’re very easy to reach because you just have to use traditional media. You go to TV, radio, and newspapers. It’s very easy to reach them with a very simple message, and on top of that, there are more of them and they’re more likely to vote. Okay? So, if you were a politician—and a politician’s job is to win elections—who are you going to target? Who are you going to try to favor? Older people or young people, who each want what they want, who have to get on TikTok, do the dance, and who are fewer in number? Well, obviously all politicians are going to be incentivized to keep older people happy. That’s why there isn’t a single party in Spain today, not left-wing, not right-wing, not far-left, not far-right, not centrist, that includes anything in its platform to improve the situation for young people. All they’re proposing are band-aid solutions, which is really just giving us a handout, isn’t it? So what’s happening here? The situation for young people is only going to get worse because they’re going to have to pay more and more taxes, since there ‘s no indication that anyone is going to touch the well-being of the elderly. And in the last 20 years, the only population group that has increased its purchasing power is the over-65 age group. The rest of us have less. Purchasing power is much lower than it was 20 years ago. But that’s really serious. I mean, you think about it and you say, how can this be? And especially since you don’t see a solution, as you’re saying, because no political party is going to be interested in implementing solutions or stopping this, right? I mean, what’s actually being done today? Uh, where are we getting the money for pensions? From two places. One, we’re borrowing money, that is, we’re taking on debt. And two, the other thing we’re doing is raising taxes. Right now, the self-employed social security contributions have been increased, and an intergenerational equity mechanism has been established, which also ultimately means more taxes for workers. In short, what’s happening is that the working class, younger people, are being burdened with taxes, and on the contrary, all that money being collected is going to improve the conditions of pensioners, right? That’s also happening, of course, you know, I think it’s called, if I remember correctly, the Afer curve, which tells you that raising taxes increases revenue up to a certain point, because there’s a point where raising taxes discourages wealth creation so much that you actually don’t collect more, but rather you start collecting less, right? Right, but that has to happen now, for example, with the self-employed. It’s a complete demotivator, isn’t it? I mean, what motivates you to earn more income if you’re not protected, you don’t have unemployment benefits, you have absolutely nothing? And on top of that, income can also vary from month to month; if you have a bad month, you’ll still have to pay your social security contribution . So, that’s why many people don’t start their own businesses and prefer to work for a multinational corporation, a government ministry, or become a police officer—things that offer much more stability. Because these days, to be self-employed, you have to be very sure it’s going to work out. Besides, being self-employed has other drawbacks, like, well, if you get sick, it’s not the same as if you get sick while working for someone else. In short, there are many things that make being self-employed a risky business in our country these days . But it’s curious because other countries outside of Spain seem to reward it, or at least give you support, or simply don’t put up barriers. And here in Spain , it’s the opposite. I mean, how can that be? The mentality is strange, isn’t it? Well, what’s happening is that it’s an electoral calculation. It’s, uh, who do we prefer , uh, uh, to put it bluntly, we prefer the self-employed or the pensioners. Anyone who messes with pensioners knows they won’t get elected. Anyone who messes with the self-employed, well, yes, but in the long run, there could also be a lot of resentment from the population, and they have long memories, right? For all of this. But that’s the point. I mean, the first thing is that there isn’t any party saying the opposite. So, you say, “Well, [ ] this is party A, the PSOE, for example, which is in power, and it doesn’t favor the self-employed.” Well, but party B is going to lower pensions so they can lower contributions. At the moment, it doesn’t seem like that’s going to happen. Uh, so, well, then there are the smaller parties that know they’re not going to get into power, and so they make empty promises, like, “Oh yeah, we’re going to lower taxes a lot or we’re going to give out so many subsidies,” and then you see that these programs don’t have a financial plan to back them up, to actually do all that, right? Yes, I know where you’re going with this, I kind of get it, but I find it really shocking because, look, I ran into a neighbor the other day when I was going up to do the shopping. Yes, she’s a retired lady, she must be in her seventies, and they have the apartment we live in. I live in Chamberí, in a central area of Madrid where rents are expensive. Let’s say. She has her big apartment, three bedrooms, street views and all, and she has the one next door, the one to the left and the one to the right. And she rents out the one on the right by the rooms and so on. A young person, for sure. No, no, all young people, all people like that, a bit from my profile. I’m sure it’s not cheap. Rent, too. No, no. Rent, I’m telling you, it’s not cheap. I mean, I have my little place, I live alone, but those are similarly priced. The thing is, this lady, in the end, has—she probably earned it and all—but she has her pension, her apartment, which must be worth something incredible, and she also gets some extra income as rent. Young people are paying her pension and rent, and then she’ll probably complain that we don’t have Netflix and we travel a lot, right? Of course, that’s what’s happening, and look, I don’t blame the pensioner who’s defending their pension, because we’re all a little selfish here, and we all want what’s best for ourselves. And hey, if they can give me 2,000, I’d rather they give me 1,800. Nobody’s going to pay back the 200 in cash, right? But I’m not complaining about the mentality of the pensioner who’s defending their pension. I’m complaining about a system that’s perversely set up to always benefit one age group at the expense of another, and because no one with any sense of national responsibility is doing anything to prevent this from becoming a ticking time bomb in the long run. That ‘s the problem right now. And what’s the worst-case scenario we could face if we look 10 or 15 years ahead? What do you think? Well, looking 10 or 15 years ahead, it’s not just this problem multiplied. I mean, what I think is going to happen is that taxes won’t keep going up. We’ll keep paying more taxes, and then, pensions, for the moment , are legally tied to the CPI, meaning pensions can’t be touched unless that law is changed. That law is going to be changed? I highly doubt it. So, this is very important to understand. You say, “Well, we’ll just go into debt.” Well, then, let the rich pay, and so on. Okay, pensions account for 42% of the state budget, right? To give you an idea, defense accounts for six percent. Wow, okay. Between defense, education, and healthcare, it doesn’t even reach 15 percent, I think, and pensions are 42 percent. If we add the debt interest payments between the two, that’s already 50 percent, right? So, if half, practically half of the budget goes to pay pensions, no matter how many ministries you cut, politicians’ salaries, and so on, it’s a tiny amount. I mean, with what you save, you could pay for an hour of pensions, you know? So it’s very complicated to deal with Spain’s economic situation without touching that. There is a lifeline, which is a sudden increase in productivity, that suddenly , productivity per worker, thanks to artificial intelligence, robotics, or whatever, rises a lot because there’s been a technological shift unlike any other in the world. If that happens and 10 million workers produce as much as 30 million do now, well, okay, it seems we’re saved if that happens, but it’s not clear that it will . And from my limited understanding, artificial intelligence is more of a threat to many jobs than a strength, right? I mean, in that respect, it could be counterproductive, I mean, what you’re saying. Well, no, it’s true that some jobs could disappear, but artificial intelligence is really going to make us all much more efficient, isn’t it? For example, I think of a journalist who used to take 8 hours to write an article and now can do that, right? So I think, well, it’s true that there could come a point where the robotics and artificial intelligence combination could destroy a lot of jobs, but for now, that’s more of a long-term scenario . No, you haven’t explained it very well, but even so, I see it all as very bleak. It’s really bleak because, and then, on top of that, we’re not only saying they’re raising taxes on workers and young people, and on top of that, young people are living in precarious situations and facing exorbitant housing prices. It’s also that the rest of the public services are deteriorating because, since so much has to be spent on pensions, the extra money spent on pensions is taken away from healthcare, education, infrastructure, productivity, and R&D. So we have a huge problem, and it’s all perversely set up. And you might ask, “Why?” “Why was this system designed this way?” Well, because this system dates back to the 1970s, when the population pyramid was actually a pyramid, when there were more young people than old people. So, this system, of course, now it’s inverted, now it’s a cylinder, it’s going to end up being inverted, but at the beginning it was a real pyramid, like the one in Egypt, right? With many young people at the base and few old people at the top. That’s what it works for, because as there are more and more young people, there’s no problem paying pensions. The problem is when that’s no longer the case, when the generation that’s now retiring hasn’t had enough children. It’s true that even the origin of the crisis, let’s say, is there, right? But well, I’m not going to get into the issue of them having few children, because it’s true that, interestingly, this is studied in sociology, and when a country develops, and it does n’t matter if it’s in Asia, in Africa, whether culture or religion plays a role, as long as… As a country develops, the birth rate automatically drops. This happens because, initially, in a developing country, parents have many children so they can put them to work early and take care of them when they grow up . There’s also less access to contraception and other resources. When a country develops, this logic is disrupted, and the desire shifts to having fewer children and providing the best possible life for each one. New leisure options become available, access to contraception is improved, and all of this contributes to the lower birth rates. By the way, I’m going to share another detail, a curious tidbit. Let’s see what you come up with next. Do you know about the baby boom? Why do you think there’s a baby boom? Why does it happen? What is a baby boom? A baby boom, as the word suggests, is a boom in birth rates, right? Like people are having more children than usual. That’s not it, that’s not it, that’s not it. Everyone thinks that suddenly, when Spain developed, people started having more children because they had money. In a big way. Well, that’s not it. The number of children remains the same because , as I said, in fact, the birth rate is even decreasing slightly. What’s decreasing is the infant mortality rate. Ah, if before, in a less developed country, 100 out of every 1,000 children born died, and now suddenly only 10 die, there are many more children. But then it’s poorly reported in some news reports because I remember times like when Spain had the World Cup and all that, they talk about a second baby boom, like there are peaks, right? Like those peaks, those peaks are… I mean, on a macro graph they’re not noticeable, they’re just isolated incidents, right? Like the day he scored that amazing goal, people were so happy they went crazy. It was an example, I don’t remember if that’s what it was, but it sounds like… But no. It’s really true that, for example, during the years of the housing bubble there was a slightly higher birth rate, but within extremely depressed figures. Yes. Yes. And this same problem, of course, in the end we’re very egocentric or we only see what’s happening in our own country, in Spain and so on. This is something that also occurs in the rest of the developed countries of, well, developed countries in Europe in general. Of course, it’s a problem common to all developed economies. In fact, for example, China, which isn’t such a developed economy per capita, has the same problem, even more so because they don’t receive immigration, right? Because here at least the population pyramid is somewhat flattened thanks to the arrival of many young people from other countries, but for example, that doesn’t happen in China. But what does change from one country to another is how you deal with this situation, right? And how do they do it? Because, of course, where we see this situation being dealt with best is where the pension system isn’t a pay-as-you-go system, but a funded system. And what does this mean? Well, a pay-as-you-go system is what we have in Spain, which is what’s being paid now; what you pay as a worker goes towards paying People’s pensions these days, okay? And a capitalization system is when… What you earn wasn’t invested in Denmark or some other country. That’s Norway, the sovereign wealth fund. We’ll talk about that later. And then a capitalization fund is when your money, yours, the money you’ve contributed to, is kept in an account. That account invests that money , and so when you retire, you have what you contributed plus the investment returns. What we’re saying is that Chente’s children have to do it privately because the state isn’t going to do it for you. Of course, that would be great because it can’t be done. It’s very difficult, I imagine, but imagine implementing that, right? Hey, taxes, how many children do you have? Plus, the distribution, bam, bam, it could be done, but one, there’s a lack of political will. And two, it’s a very complex process to transition to, because at what point do you stop, right? At what point are some being paid, but others not? But it’s something so obvious, and it’s like a small solution. Hey, let’s not make it black and white, but let’s make it something that can be navigated somehow. I mean, I have no idea, but it seems like a point that would make sense. I really hope someone in the government takes note of this. Explain the Norway thing to them, please, because people are going to love it. Norway is really interesting; for me, it’s the perfect economic model and the perfect model of how an economy with a large state—that is, a strong state with high taxes—can develop and provide a very good life for its citizens. Okay? It all starts with Norway being a fishing country. It didn’t have much, not much industry, not much wealth, and then at one point they discovered oil in the North Sea. You think, “Damn, they were so lucky to discover oil.” Well, we, for example, in Spain, have tourism or lots of sunshine, which could be the renewable energy of today, which was yesterday’s oil, right? So, what does a country usually do when it discovers oil? You know, when it discovers oil, what it does is start extracting oil like crazy, sell it, and so on. And in the end, since the money is tied up in oil, my whole economy revolves around oil, and then when the price of oil drops, my undiversified, oil-dependent economy suffers greatly, it has a crisis, and it ends up like Venezuela, right? What did Norway do? He said, “No, no, no, no, no, no, no. We’re going to extract oil. Yes, but first of all, the state is going to extract the oil, and second, it’s going to extract more than x barrels a year. So we’re going to have oil revenues. We’re going to make some money from it, but the rest of the economy is going to continue developing, well, like any other developed economy, like Sweden’s, Denmark’s, with its industries and everything, okay? And then the government says, well, we have this oil here, and we’re making quite a bit of money from it. Come on, let’s build a good education system, good public services, good healthcare. With that good education, the other sectors do very well because they have a highly skilled workforce. Hey, let’s make sure people see, right? That we have oil and we’ve made some money from it. And there came a point when , well, Norway had very good infrastructure, good education, an interesting entrepreneurial culture , and so they said, “Well, from now on, all the money made from oil is going to… ” Go into a government account, a sovereign wealth fund, and that government account is going to start investing in things.” In what things? In the biggest companies in the world, in the companies in the world that are, let’s say, connected to Norwegian values. So, suddenly you have every Norwegian, because of course, they’ve started investing, investing very well, well, they’ve invested in Google, they’ve invested in Meta, in Nvidia, in the best companies in the world. In fact, they have seats on the boards of directors of many large companies, therefore , they also have political influence in those companies, and maybe, well, if I’m making this up, uh, I’m making this up completely, but maybe if Nvidia is looking for where to put a data center in Northern Europe, put it in Norway because we are, uh, we are such and such. So, well, On the one hand, there’s that, and on the other hand, there’s the fact that all those companies are growing, just like investing in the S&P 500. So, for each Norwegian today, that fund is worth two trillion euros, which is 2 billion euros, 2 million million euros, and I think each Norwegian receives about €300,000. So, what happens? What does Norway do when there’s a crisis or when it has pension problems, whatever? It sells a little bit of that fund. During COVID, it sold 1 or 2% of that fund. They didn’t have a crisis? I mean, that’s how Norway works extremely well. But why? Because they’ve had the vision to invest for 50 or 100 years and do something long-term that’s sustainable, unlike us, who are heading towards something unsustainable. Borja, it’s so obvious, and so many people here in Spain understand numbers and all that, seeing a model that, okay, we’re late, but it’s better to start now, like with each of our investments, than to start in 10 years. You can’t do that, right? Well, I’ll tell you why. Look, they tried to do that in Spain back when I think it was Aznar who first proposed it, and then Zapatero who implemented it more fully . It was the pension fund. Ah, that rings a bell. The pension fund was created when the population pyramid wasn’t so aged and pensions weren’t in deficit, meaning more money was coming in than going out. They created a pension fund. They did the same thing. Okay, so the money people are contributing to social security today, we’re going to put it into an account that this so-and-so is going to invest. What’s the problem? It arrived so late, and then came the 2008 crisis, which was very hard in Spain, and during Rajoy’s government, it was all wiped out. What had been saved over a few years was depleted, and now, of course, why am I saying it can’t be done? Because the system is already running a deficit. So, if every year, imagine, right? Uh, what you’re saying is, if you earn 10 and spend 50, what’s the point of putting two of the 10 in a piggy bank if I’m actually spending 40 more than I should? Yes, but wouldn’t that be putting it in a piggy bank? Yes, but they’d be invested, I mean, even if it’s just a little bit at a time, yes, but they’re invested, at 5 or 6% annually. I mean, the numbers don’t add up, they don’t add up, it’s a pittance, right? In the long run it makes a lot, but we don’t have a long-term plan because every year we’re losing billions, well, losing, we spend billions more than we earn. So, what do we do, Borja? I mean, I’m already lost, I mean, because, what do we do? What do we do? It’s complicated, isn’t it? Well, for me, the key to all this, for me there are four keys. One is to try to increase productivity as much as possible so that each worker produces as much as possible. Okay? That’s one of the keys. Another key point might be what you were saying: if someone is earning thousands and thousands of euros in rent because they own apartments, because of what they have, it might not make sense for that person to have a public pension of €2,000. Sure, but at the same time, it would also be a selfish mentality on our part, because, well, the woman will say, “Hey, I earned it, you know? Like, I’ve been doing this my whole life, I’ve paid my dues, I’ve done my part, and you know, the money she earned in her life wasn’t just put in a box and now it’s hers. The money she earned in her life was used to pay the pensions of that time, you know what I mean? Because, yes, the woman might think that, but the young person might think, ‘I ‘m earning it and I’m not going to receive it.’ The feeling is that whatever is decided or however we act, someone is going to be harmed and dissatisfied. I agree. But what What we’re doing now is placing the entire burden of the demographic transition on young people, and I believe that burden should be shared. It shouldn’t all fall on young people ; some should fall on pensioners. I believe in solidarity. What doesn’t make sense is for a single age group to shoulder everything, just as it wouldn’t be fair for pensioners to have their pensions drastically reduced so that others can pay less tax. I don’t think so. It must have been complete ignorance on my part, but given how obvious it is, and considering the need to find a balance that will affect the largest segment of the population—the largest voting bloc, as we were saying—the elderly, there isn’t a single body within the government that could say, “Hey, let’s all pull together, regardless of party affiliation, left or right, we all have to move in this direction to improve things.” It’s called a state pact, which is when all parties agree on something, but what all the parties agreed to in the Toledo Pacts is that pensions are untouchable. How can that be? I mean, it just doesn’t make sense to me because that’s what gets votes, so nobody wants to break ranks. Of course, of course. But like I said, it’s like, is there a body that can force them to do something, regardless of whether they’re left, right, or any other party? There’s no body that can do that. No, no, there’s no body that does that because the one in charge of doing that is the Ministry of Social Security, which is controlled by the government, which is controlled by the PSOE (Spanish Socialist Workers’ Party). So, if the PSOE does it, the blame will fall on the PSOE. And don’t worry, as soon as they do it, even if they change to, for example, what we were just talking about, which is another solution, which is to gradually change from a pay-as-you -go system to a funded system, what we were discussing, right? Okay, don’t doubt that the day the PSOE does that, if they do it, or the day the PP (People’s Party) does it, if they do it, the other party is going to give them all the [ ] they can, even though they know it’s the right thing to do. Ugh, that’s just how it’s going to be. Politics is politics, what a war, huh? It must be incredibly difficult to be a politician. It’s very complicated. It’s very complicated and very poorly paid, especially the top positions. We’d talked about this before in our group of friends, and the president doesn’t really earn much, does he? I mean, yes, he does earn, I think it’s €80,000. That’s pretty high, isn’t it? There are no hidden fees or catches on that salary, right? No. Well, then he gets a series of allowances and such, but it’s not like being president of the government makes you rich. Sure, but in another podcast, I don’t know, I don’t remember exactly which one it was, I don’t know if it was Spicy Fortuna or something like that, he said, “Look, in the end he’s the president, you hear him as president, but he’s still the CEO of a company that is Spain. Yes. And the maximum budgets he manages are incredible, unlike the CEOs of large companies and others who have salaries that have nothing to do with that. That’s why not much talent is attracted to politics, because there is talent, you know, but I’ve known some very capable politicians, but that’s why generally the people who go into politics aren’t the brightest people in the country. Harsh statements, huh? It’s not true, there are some very good people, and I know people, like I said, politicians, that I’ve met personally, and I think, wow, what a brain, what a character, but I don’t know if they’re the norm, or the exception. Would you like to end up in politics at some point? Absolutely not. Absolutely not. Completely out of the question. Out of the question, because you’re terribly paid.” And two, uh, everyone hates you, everyone says, “Politicians are all crap,” and there’s no distinction between those who do well and those who do badly. It just so happens that they’re all terrible, period. So, what’s the point? With everything you’ve just told me, or rather, everything you’ve just told us, I think we’re really destined to be freeloaders, you know? I mean, the situation is complicated, the way you ‘re making it out to be. Well, the situation is already complicated. I mean, from the moment that, right now, whether you do well in life or not, being young, almost depends exclusively on whether you’ve inherited or not, that already creates a huge inequality from the ground up. And then, people are struggling to pay rent in big cities or to buy their first apartment, that’s a fact. I mean, people are becoming independent later and later, people are buying their homes later and later, people are saving less and less. Well, it’s true that we have many Good things in modern society, we have many ways of Having a good time and all that, but people are having trouble even starting a family, right? So, well, it’s complicated. It’s complicated, and we’re already seeing the problems with this. Like I said, the increase in self-employed social security contributions they announced is just a direct consequence of the pension problem. It’s like a vicious cycle, a negative one, you know? When life expectancy increases, when the population ages, because for all those people who are getting older, it’s not just the pension, it’s the long-term care, the hospital, the medications—it’s a huge expense for the state, isn’t it? Borja, I’d like you to help me with a personal situation. We’ve talked about this before, but since I know there are many people here who can relate to a similar problem, which , well, it is a problem, not a terrible one, but I see it as difficult to solve, or I don’t know how to deal with it in the short term. As you know, I’m in Madrid, I pay rent, and I have a decent income, not huge, but decent. The thing is, I save every month , and I put part of it into investments, like you suggested, and I try to keep the rest in a checking account, which I’m not sure is a good idea. So here’s my question regarding the possibility of taking out a mortgage, because you know how it is with 20% for the mortgage, 10% for expenses, it’s all a bit complicated, isn’t it? Ideally, instead of just keeping the money in your checking account, you should at least put it in a savings account. Okay, okay. That’s the first thing, right? But it’s good that it’s 2%, good, good. But at least you’re protected from inflation, because we all know inflation is the rise in prices , and well, your money in the bank buys less and less, right? Because then it’s a way to protect that 2% from inflation. Okay? So you want to use the down payment you’re saving for on a down payment for an apartment, right? Yes. The thing is, you know, the temptation is sometimes strange, like, I see the money just sitting there, I see how much the money I have in the brokerage account is growing, and it’s a situation that overwhelms you a bit, you know? Like, I don’t know if I should put it all in the brokerage and then withdraw it when the time comes. Because in this case, if I remember correctly, you invest in the S&P 500 and some stocks, right? And some individual stocks and the Nasdack. And what happens? Those long-term investments are good investments, but in the short to medium term they’re volatile. So, it can happen that you suddenly want to make the down payment on the apartment and you’ve hit a bad market and you have less money than you put in. So, what I recommend is that whatever you have to spend in the medium term on the down payment or to invest in the down payment, keep it in a savings account. Anything you won’t need in the medium to long term, that can go to the broker. Also, when buying an apartment in Spain, with mortgages currently around 2% fixed interest, always, always, always borrow the largest amount you can. The loan-to-value ratio is better than 80% if possible, and 30 years is better than 20. Okay? And then another important point, and I’m going to explain this because it’s very important; I always explain it to everyone around me. It’s actually fun because you’re giving them a lecture, not just to a group of friends, you’re having a chat, so welcome to the group. It’s not that important to pay back even a single euro early. Not a single euro early . There are people who, as soon as they have €10,000, say, “Oh, I’m going to pay off my mortgage.” I mean, my parents just did that recently, and I kept telling them no, that if he finds out he’ll kill them, don’t do that. Don’t do that. Why? We’ve said that mortgages are currently around 2%, right? Inflation is also around 2%. Okay, I think everyone here understands that if you leave your money sitting in the bank, that money loses value, right? But when you’re in negative territory, that is, when the bank has lent you the money, it’s the bank that has the money in your account, so to speak, it loses value. They lose value, it loses value for them. That debt depreciates over time, and if it depreciates at a rate of 2% annually, which is inflation, then the money is already costing you 2%, they’re giving you money for free, okay? So, for that reason alone, it shouldn’t be repaid, because they’re giving you the money for free. But I think that’s part of the lack of financial education we have. Absolutely. Absolutely. But there’s more. If instead of paying those €10,000 back to the bank, I invest them, imagine if the S&P 500 yields 8% annually in the long term, or between 8% and 10% annually, and the only thing I’m going to save on that money is 2%, it’s much better to invest it for that 8-10% annual return I’ll get, on the one hand, from inflation, and on the other hand, from whatever I earn on that money invested elsewhere. Therefore, when you have the capacity to pay off your mortgage, don’t. Invest in something that will give you a higher return than what you’ll lose with that prepayment. It’s another thing entirely if you tell me that this doesn’t happen in Spain, ugh, my mortgage is at 10% interest. [ __ ] then yes, that’s where it pays off. But as long as it’s below 2, 3, 4%, it’s not worth it. [ __ ] Well, thank you very much. Uh, I think that both me and the people here behind us will benefit greatly from all these explanations you’ve given us, and they might, I don’t know if they’ll clarify the future a bit, or make us throw our hands up in despair, but then keep one thing in mind, when you buy a property, okay? Roughly speaking, a property in a typical Spanish city, if you bought it at a normal market price, will appreciate in value. That is, it will be worth about 4% more each year, more or less, okay? Between three and five percent. I’m amazed at how much data you have in your head. I don’t know, I mean, you could be spending three times as much. I know you’re not because I know you, but if you rent it out, the return you get is another 4% extra, okay? But let’s stick with the initial 4%. Of course, if I have, imagine, right? €40,000 in my bank account. If I invest it in something, okay? I don’t care if I invest in treasury bills, I’m going to get 3-4% on €40,000. However, if I take out a mortgage and buy a house for €200,000, that 4% I get on the house’s appreciation isn’t really what I’m getting on the €40,000 I put in; I’m getting the €40,000 I put in plus the money I borrowed. In other words, I’m leveraging myself and, in a way, I’m getting a return on the money the bank lent me. That concept is interesting, isn’t it? It doesn’t change your mindset, I mean, yes, yes, yes, yes. It’s knowing four things that are really logical, and if someone tells you them, suddenly all the pieces fall into place and you start doing things logically. [ __ ] Brutal. Borja, I think it’s time for you to take the “freeloader test.” Wow, I love the “freeloader test.” It sounds great. Okay, I’m also open to suggestions like, “Hey, change this question, okay?” Yeah, right? I mean, it’s kind of to wrap up the chat, so people can get to know you guys a little better, short, impulsive answers, you know, take vertical clips, then for the rest of the networks, you know what I mean . Okay, Borja, let’s get on with the bon vivant test. Who’s the biggest bon vivant you know? The biggest bon vivant I know is probably you. You’re serious, right? Okay, okay, okay. A place to escape to and disconnect, huh? Gijón. The biggest treat you’ve ever given yourself. Probably the fish tank studio. A piece of bon vivant advice you’d give us. Um, stop working on compound interest. Ideal party buddy. Man, you’d have a great time with my science communication group. No doubt about it. The investment you’re most proud of? Look, I’m very proud of the bargain I got with my house in Madrid, but what I’m really proud of, what has filled me with pride when I saw it, is my broker’s portfolio. How would you like to see yourself in 20 years? Well, really being 100% in control of my own time. And finally, a bon vivant is someone who, yes, look, a bon vivant is someone who can dedicate their life to what they’re passionate about. How lovely. Yes. Sir. And then he indulges himself. That’s also very important in the life of a bon vivant. It’s very important to understand that one thing is doing what you’re passionate about, and another is having your moments to spice things up. I agree. In the end, that’s the essence, isn’t it? We’re just passing through, and we have to enjoy it. Borja, it’s your turn to work. Come on, let’s go. Two questions you have to prepare for the next guest, who is none other than Sergio Turulpi, one of the biggest running influencers in Spain. A long-distance runner, right? An ultramarathoner. Ultra, ultramarathon. A machine. Since you already mentioned that I go running and that I’m at a point where I can more or less handle things a bit better now, look at the screen so he can also have the video later, you know? Sergio, Sergio, a quick question because this is a topic I find difficult. How do you manage to fight against your own mind for so long and, uh, enjoy the suffering? If there’s a little trick to, hey, thinking about the shopping list or whatever, give us some tips to keep our minds occupied and excited while we run. There you go. And the second question, because of course, there were two, Borja, it was the same one, right? Okay, the second question, right? Another question that interests me. Tell us about some exercises that those of us who don’t run as much as you, or who, well, are real beginners at this, uh, can do to improve our warrior technique. There you go, uh, there you go. Fish Memoirs, Borja Fernández Zurrón. Your name isn’t talked about much. We’re working on your personal brand, Borja. Well, uh, it’s not really necessary, is it? Yes, no, we have to work on it, we have to work on it, but we’re getting there. Hey, little by little. Now we’re really getting there. To wrap things up, give me some advice, you who have achieved incredible success on social media. This is a new format for me, and I’m still getting used to it. Besides, you’re not really seeing it today. Well, you might have noticed it in some shots that didn’t work or something. That’s because Borja has it all set up really well here, and I have this little device that I use to switch between shots. Everything is recorded in one take; I don’t have to edit it later. Okay, click me, click me. There, there, there. Hey, hey, hey, hey. Wow, what class, man, what class. The thing is, you’ve achieved success, it’s a format you’re comfortable with, you speak so well, I mean, it’s incredible how much information you have in your head, the way you narrate, the way you communicate, you change your tone, like I was saying, I mean, you’re an expert. I would really appreciate any advice or suggestions from someone like you. I was going to tell you about consistency, but you’re the king of consistency, so I have to tell you something else. Um, I think the most important thing is, on the one hand, being natural, and on the other hand, trying to contribute something, whatever your field is, trying to give the user something so that when the video ends, they say, “Wow, besides being entertained, look, I’m taking this away from here. Look, I’ve learned, uh, I know, hm, I can tell my friends tomorrow that, wow, look, I learned this here.” But of course, in a podcast format like this, the guest also contributes a lot, right? You know that in the first episode, for example, I did that kind of challenge . The guest contributes, but the one who really gets the meat out is the interviewer. So, you also have to ask questions and pay close attention to where I’m going to get the interesting information, right? Good job, good job. Good job. The guest is the ship, but you’re the captain. Wow, he’s so classy. The way he speaks, huh? The way he defines things, it’s a pleasure, man. Well Well, guys, we hope you enjoyed this chat. It’s a completely different concept from what you’ve seen in the previous ones, which were more related to influence and sports, but having someone like Borja here is a real treat. I think you’ve learned something, for sure . And I hope you put it into practice. I hope I haven’t bored you too much, and well, keep following the ultimate freeloader because, honestly, it’s not just because he’s my friend, but he does an incredible job. What you don’t see behind the scenes is… It’s crazy what she wears, and she always does it with a smile, which is really appreciated these days. Amazing. Well, thank you so much. Subscribe, guys. Bye.
15 Comments
SOMOS VIVIDORES !!
Espero que lo disfrutéis… Capítulo en el que todos podemos aprender mucho!!
Esto es tan fácil como que cada uno analizamos las cosas según el lugar donde se está , si estuvierais cobrando una pensión probablemente vuestro pensamiento sería distinto, yo he sido autónomo con trabajadores y he sido y soy actualmente trabajador por cuenta ajena y todo tienes sus pros y sus contras , un trabajador tiene que tener un sueldo digno y unas condiciones dignas y a la vez no todos los empresarios se hacen ricos explotando a los trabajadores , también se echan muchísimas horas y hay que lidiar con muchos problemas.
Madre mia Borja vaya cerebro…..increíble…..Gente así deberían ser los que dirigen el país.
Otro neoliberal con altavzoz
Vende motos liberal, vividor a tope y lo enfrentar a los jubilados con los trabajadores muy mal.
Hay otros economistas que opinan diametralmente opuestos.
Aprender poco vendiendo la ley del más fuerte
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂si el problema son las pensiones no la corrupción 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂canal para cuñaos 😂😂😂
Me da una risa que con la capacidad que tiene este tipo, super inteligente y estudioso en tantos temas y aún así aparecen fachos de derecha que en su vida se han terminado un paper de cualquier cosa a opinar que Borja no sabe nada 😂😂😂😂.
Hola Pablo, gran tipo tu amigo Borja, da gusto escucharlo, se expresa muy bien y es un vividor😂Un saludo Pablo
Lo malo de Noruega es su sociedad, ahi el gobierno se roba/secuestra a los niños y la gente feliz de la vida.
El problema son tus padres y tus abuelos.
Patéticos.
Veo peceras de memorias para ponerme al día y después me paso a ver a Pablo Ordorica para relajarme un rato y ahora juntos, esto es una maravilla 💪💪
1:20:25 ahí ahí, agravando el problema de la. especulación inmobiliaria
Borja veo un poco contradictorio que incentives el ahorro y luego quieras penalizar a la riqueza acumulada, que obviamente va a ser mayor cuando mayor sea la edad
Que buenos consejos , vamos a intentar seguir alguno …