CGIS and Adams Valves are co-hosting a webinar on the latest advancements in Combined Function Check Valves within the water/wastewater industry. Key highlights will include:
-Eliminating water hammer
-Enhancing system performance and reliability
-Real world applications and success stories
All right let uh I’m sure there’ll be maybe a few more trick in but it’s great to see uh a lot of attendees on today’s uh webinar thank you all for joining my name is Bren Waters I’m the VP of sales marketing with cgis uh we love to put
These on uh we try to do them uh at least monthly uh we’ve been doing it now about three or four years and it’s great to see the attendance continues to go up uh this one in particular we have uh number of returning guests as well as
Quite a few new ones so it’s fantastic to see that um this one uh at CJs um you know we uh we really try to um meet our vision of a world without valve problems valves have become fairly commoditized over the last number of years uh we
Still see that as an asset that uh when applied properly into the right application uh the right valve can uh really create a lot of uh efficiencies in the system uh a lot of trouble-free long life uh in order for us to be able to select those right fils we to partner
With the uh the world’s best valve manufacturers and uh today I’m joined by one of those uh great manufacturers Adams um and they’ll be taking us through optimizing Water and Wastewater systems with combined function checked and isolation valves so this is a very specialized product so again it’s great
To see so many people on uh but a product that Adams has done for a number of years very successfully uh to solve uh some of those problems that we see with uh using individual check valves and isolation Val in systems uh joining me today we’ve got uh
Chad Ferris who’s the regional sales manager for uh Adams covering Canada uh Chad’s been in the industry and design and Manufacturing for 20 years and he’s been with Adams for uh for six years as a sales regional manager also online uh in Houston Texas is Paul tanzig Paul is
A national sales manager for Adams uh again been selling and uh helping customers with triple offset butterfly valves and check valves for over 25 years so a lot of experience in the room um we’ll just quickly go a couple things and I’ll pass over to you so next slide
There Chad uh so just again uh one of the things that makes these webinars really successful is the feedback and the questions throughout so Paul and I will be monitoring the Q&A the bottom of your uh screen for Zoom uh you’ll see a Q&A button click on that and type away
Any questions as as you go uh if it’s relevant to the topic at hand we might interrupt Chad ask a question right away if not we’ll definitely get to it at the end of the show so please uh ask those questions um and then at the end uh Sam
Will be sending out a uh um recap of uh the session and uh definitely if there’s any other questions that you like to follow up on uh please feel free to do so at that time so with that I will stop talking and hand it over to the expert
Here uh Chad take it away thanks BR so uh thank you everyone uh for your time time uh we’ll run through this hopefully um some of this is maybe uh information you already know but uh there should be some interesting uh topics in here uh so we
All come away with this with a better understanding of Adam’s approach to uh check valves and uh water Adams is uh a German based company uh been in business uh for over 60 years now still uh family-owned and operated uh back in 1960 U Adams invented uh the triple
Offset metal seated butterfly valve which will’ll uh touch on uh a little later in the presentation we do have uh an extensive network of sales reps and Distributors uh Premier Companies like cgis that cover can Canada for us uh as I mentioned our home office is in Hera
Germany so if you were ever to go over there for witness testing you fly to Frankfurt and then hop on a train for about an hour and a half um we’ve got over a million square feet under roof there in in Hera we do have another facility in Switzerland um right there
At the the base of the Swiss Alps their primary focus is going to be on large diameter valves that are going to be in the uh Hydro electric industry pen stock fixed phones Etc and then uh oops our little shop in Houston Texas uh where we keep inventory on hand um and
Obviously house the sales uh office and have service capability uh whether it’s sending a technician to the field or uh having end users send uh product to our shop where’re almost always in some sort of a turn around for uh clients so um wonderful capabilities right here in North
America the atoms product range as you can see is uh wide ranging in size temperature uh pressure class as you can imagine um being a German owned company in business as long as we have been we meet or exceed uh industry standards U and are comfortable with uh several types of materials
Standard materials for us is going to be carbon uh carbon steel body with stainless steel trim but as you can see we have U several installations that that utilize other types of materials actuation is never never a problem for us we’re comfortable with whatever the client needs
Are and finally today um our focus is on check valves in liquids so uh I’ve got that highlighted here uh all of our uh check valves incorporate uh some form of a dampening system uh and others also include uh control capabilities skipped over there so we have the the most basic question right
Why use a check valve and it’s um the simple answer is a check valve is going to allow flow in One Direction and keep it from flowing in the other direction uh what Adams uh focuses on is smooth operation of the check valve in opening and in closing and uh unlike
Gases which are compressible obviously water is not so we place a very high emphasis on eliminating water hammer which is why all of our uh check valves have some form of damp in system which is uh have different setups for adjustability and timing we will see a just a standard
Check valve you obviously have uh the pressure will go up as as the flow increases and then uh become steady um the closing of a standard check valve is where our damping system system uh becomes critical we want to avoid that shock to the system that could damage the valve uh obviously a
Very expensive pump the piping we’ve seen uh field applications where the piping has jumped off of the the rails completely so uh we want to protect all the equipment we don’t want slamming we obviously do not want water hammer so so just a basic layout of of
Uh our damping system will include uh a a spring hydraulic piston with uh you can see those two red valves uh on the the depiction there those valves are field adjustable and that’s what gives you uh your multi- rate uh closing of the disc so that uh when a customer experiences is a
Trip the closure is smooth it doesn’t slam it doesn’t damage the disc and we don’t get watered Hammer go further here you can see because of atom’s uh High ex ecity of the disc this uh this also AIDS Us in smooth operation of the valve keeps it
From uh fluttering or jumping and and also brings it gently into the seat I believe this is once the the pump is is a activated you’ll see the hydraulic system controls the opening and closing uh but the the the valve is a free acting check valve at this point um
It it’s just smooth operation we have just a simple depiction of the the valve again closing in real time this would happen very very quickly um but the controllability of the closing keeps keeps the valve or system from getting damaged um so main lines for us uh all those
Letters are are German so if you speak German that that would all mean something to you but our rzn our gbz and rzi are going to be our our our check vals for liquids the ones on the bottom there for air and so forth and so
On wanted to touch on the importance of the triple offset incline conical seat design you can see here uh when Adams invented this design um having the the first and second offset being the shaft has been uh moved vertically and then horizontally from the center of the
Valve body and that gives this disc a full camming action uh the third offset has to do with the geometry of the seat and the disc itself so that if you were to draw a lines out to to the right from that uh those angles the point of that
Cone is an inclined cone it’s it wouldn’t be centered uh in the the valve body and this allows the disc to come into the seat with with no friction no rubbing it it just sits down into the seat uh and this is something that set Adams apart
Decades ago uh and allows us to provide the client with longer lasting valves that give them repeatable heght shut off zero leakage shut off uh and then the the seal ring you know 20 30 years down the road can also be easily field replaceable with this design one other Advantage if
I could add is versus a standard swing check where your seat is um being perfectly vertical ours being offset allows the disc to easily set in and so that helps before backflow begins to push it back we’re we’re closed gravity can pull it down and into that seat and it doesn’t
Require that backflow to push it into the actual seat so that is the other advantage of having the offset conical design in our check valve just real quick one question that came in uh on the previous slide was are these valves piggable for pipeline applications no they no unfortunately not
Okay so here we’ve got uh just a couple of pictures of our rzn and rzi uh multi-rate adjustable dampening valves uh suitable for uh multiple water applications um the uh smaller valves that are going to be in in raw or finished water will have uh an NSF 61
Coating on on wetted Parts we’re currently in the process of getting our these valves certified uh so that the entire valve is nsf61 certified uh and then for uh Marine applications uh we offer them with with a rubber lining as well you can start to see the the
Damping systems on those valves the dash pot so forth so we covered the the triple offset design Paul touched on the incline conical ceiling system uh we want to chat a bit about the uh the adjustable damping system on all of our check valves the I think there’s yeah so there we got
The so you have these the flow control valves on the damping cylinder so that the client can adjust uh the speed at which the valve closed closes and this is important on setting up uh the system so that we don’t you can see uh on this chart here that the the you have
A a first maybe yeah so the the the spring cylinder will kick in uh on on pump trip and then the second and third stage are controlled by the adjustable needle valves that have a hydraulic uh Dash pot uh many cases we will’ll use uh food grade hydraulic oil
These are going to be in INF finished Water Systems so when the pump trips the valve will the valve wants to close we we design the valves um with internals uh as light as possible for for lack of a better term it’s very sensitive so that uh it will close
Quickly but the first stage will allow the valve to close the majority of the way and the hydraulic first second stage hydraulic will kick in slow the valve so that the final few degrees of closing are although quick they’re not violent so just the facts and figures
For the uh the rzn uh the nominal pipe sizes temperature range um and pressure classes that these valves are are manufactured in uh we this is a real Workhorse for us uh very popular all over the world um city of Regina just purchased some here
So uh rzii similar to the rzn but as you can see uh larger pipe sizes uh which requires uh some extra design work for us on the damping system and uh full disclosure these valves are adjustable with a lever and and weight although I’ve never sold one with it let
Me back up you’ll see uh these check valves do have the the shaft continuing out the other side of the disc on the opposite side of the damping system uh where you you could include a Leever weight uh if you wanted to uh I’ve yet to have a customer ask for
One because they work great without them but uh let me get into more detail about the the rzi multi- rate adjustable system because of the size and weight uh of the disc uh we have sub similarities but a few extra uh bells and whistles so to speak you can see
Here you still have your adjustable valves um to get your multi-stage closure of the dis but we incorporate uh a slide arm that allows the designer or or end user to control at what point this begins uh you can you know slide it Forward backward it’s fully adjustable so that you have different
Uh controlability than you do with the rzn with the rzii you would have uh sort of a standard I guess you would call this sort of factory setting of the closure and with the you need to utilize the side the slide arm you have further adjustability uh which is necessary with
Uh if it’s a a 60-in valve that’s a lot of weight uh on that disc so uh in addition to the multi stage uh adjustable needle Valves and the the hydraulic cylinder you can further adjust using this uh slide component and now we’ll get into uh I
Guess would be kind of mine and Paul’s favorites um our check valves that also offer throttling and shut off capability all in one valve so this would be our type gbz and type AI uh you can see these Val are similar on the inside uh with the the incline
Design uh seat the triple offset ensity of the disc but uh the magic happens outside of the valve body so the AI and gbz both work as check valves free acting check valves but it gives the user the ability to control the Val valve as well we we’ve regularly put position indicators on
This these uh valves so that the user knows exactly where the disc is at all times uh they still come with the adjustable multi- rate damping system but they also offer the client the ability to control this disc on pump startup uh and and closure uh so that they they can uh use
This valve for isolation and then throttling and once the pump is running it it’s a free active check valve and we accomplish that uh by what we call a free travel coupling it’s uh a a clutch if you will and when the free travel coupling is disengaged the valve will
Act as a free acting check valve but the operator can then Engage The free travel coupling and control the position of the disc one of the questions that came in right now and I think it’s a good one in general for check fils as well as the uh
Mak triple laet is how well do these check Bells seat with debris Laden uh fluids do you want to maybe uh quickly we always want to know uh when it comes to particulates we would like to get an idea of three things and that’s going to be the size of the particulate
Uh the percentage of the particulate and then the velocity of the particulate uh these things will affect our seal ring which is a standard seal ring is laminated layers of titanium reinforced stainless steel and graphite so we have had many applications where a valve will close on a twig or something like that
And uh be just fine but we if if it’s going to be a very rough application we’ll make some adjustments with uh different types of seiling on the bearings uh adjustments even on on the packing and the seal ring design all those things uh can be custom designed
We do have limits uh if it’s if it’s a if it’s just uh a pipe sucking sand off the bottom we’re probably going to pass uh and that’s actually brings up a good point um we these vales are not a cookie cutter design these are custommade
Valves uh they are made to the standards as as as Chad mentioned to API asme standards but because they’re a lot of them are fabricated the larger you get the the the more they are going to be a fabricate instead of a cast valve and so
We can do some unique things with that and so that’s why this would definitely be something that we’ll be working with you cgis will work with you to understand the application uh and your requirements everything from your flowing media to your pump sizing so that we can get the right disc uh as
Chad mentioned we can customize the disc so it’s more reactive to your system uh we can do special face tof face dimensions on this and special flanges so um this is not going to be a I need a 12in offthe shelf it that’s not going to be this product this is definitely a
Customized for your application Val just follow up to that um I know in your Mak triple offset design that the seat ring has been moved out of the disc into the body to protect it is the same technology used in the ASI gbz or is it
In the uh in the body still so on our check valves we incorporate uh the seal ring in the disc yeah uh okay and this works for us uh because these discs never achieve full 90° right okay um got our isolation valves we’re more concerned about the ceiling being on the
Leading Edge of the disc uh for example I we sell uh isolation valves into the steam industry by the thousands um and those valves live the majority of their life fully open so as they’re expected to last for 20 years so it makes sense for us to then remove
The seal ring from the disc and have it recessed into the body uh not so much in the case of check BS so just going back to that question I know when the triple in the triple offset U butterfly design with that seat protected we are we
Normally say we’re good to four or 5% solids uh without worry uh compared to some of the other triple offset designs where the seat in the body is exposed and uh definitely debris and and um particular can can have an effect on the cability of the valve whereas you guys
Or Adams were were fairly confident with higher percentage of solids um and again being metal to metal true zero leakage isolation can maintain that uh fairly significantly so I agree yeah we’re comfortable with that you you guys uh uh up here see plenty of applications where
We’re successful in the four to 5% % range uh and still get longlasting repeatable results before you any other further I one more question that popped in um and then we’ll get moving uh the combined function check is available for natural gas sour sweet applications um I
Assume yes we are right now we’re sort of focusing on the liquid ones but uh if you looked at that uh that decision tree there yeah there’s a whole we have whole another line for for those and yes we offer these uh same uh functionality uh
In in in gases so design will be slightly different but but yes it’s the same concept right in uh refineries where they have a main air blower or a control air blower uh our valves are very popular because they can track the position of that disc they can control it on Startup
And shut down but if there’s a system trip it closes very quickly but smoothly so right and it also uh as Paul mentioned having that uh incline conical design sometimes I don’t know who who all we’ve got on on on the webinar here but a standard swing check valve that’s
25 years old that gets some wear on it may close most of the way but not all the way ours close all the way or they’ll hit the seat and bounce off and be off 6 Seven 8 degrees we are not interested in that type of Val performance here at Adam
So point of note with the combined function valve is it eliminates the need for uh a check and an isolation valve uh so you’re going to uh when you’re designing the system you can uh lower your weight space requirements are uh obviously at a premium in a lot of uh
Underground or inground vaults um and and you’re still going to uh there’s cost savings and and and pressure drop uh benefits as well we generally see one to two PSI pressure drop across our our discs U and our our check FES so this one thing I think to mention too
Is you know best practice for check valves is to have h a free run before and after the the valve the check valve before an isolation valve or an elbow or anything like that and so space really becomes a concern especially with larger valves having to get that uh five or six
Pipe diameters in front and uh and after the check valve whereas you can can find it that uh that eliminates that that one consideration exactly so uh if we’re uh new systems being designed or uh retrofitting an old system where we want the all of the the weight and space
Savings uh along with combined function this is an excellent op option for an operator we have the so yeah so there’s the gbz size range temperature range pressure classes uh you can see there it still has the the the multi- rate adjustable dashbot you can’t quite see
The needle valves but they’re there uh and then uh obviously the gear box that allows the operator if they need to to go up and open or close this valve um and then um you can add actuation to this uh many times it’s electric but U I
Think we have the there you go this one includes a a gear and motor combination uh again with the AIS similar with the with the larger sizes there uh you’ll see uh like the the the rzn it has an an extra spring on the bottom and then that go that goes back
To the just the sheer Mass of the disc so our uh combined function check valves are pretty unique to the industry in how they operate uh how well they operate how long they operate U and all the options it gives the the client uh the the functionality um on Startup shutdown uh
Allowing the free travel coupling to disengage and have a a check a check valve running smoothly that’s not going to flutter or slam um and these valves being adjustable offer the client the option down the road should process conditions change uh if the manifold changes any
Number of reasons this valve is can be adjusted in 10 years so uh a wonderful wonderful thing to be able to at least put in front of a client U that’s looking for something that’s going to be long lasting and reliable and flexible uh as Paul had
Mentioned these are these are made many of these are made from scratch so the internals will be customed to the design the face to face can be customed to the design uh the the damping system can be customized the the gear and motor combination can be customized we can
Tailor the solution cgis is one of the Premier distributors in the world uh when it comes to working with clients and getting them exactly what it is that they need question came up uh talking about that is uh valve is this valve suitable for variable speed drive or variable speed pump
Operation that question comes up a lot um you know and that’s the benefit of a variable speed pump is that of course you can slow it down more so an a variable speed pump I I’ve seen actually less issues with water hammer I could I would say because uh on as as
They can tone it down but it will work this this check valve doesn’t matter the speed of the pump because what we’re dampening is your closure so it would still be good for that in case that you do have a pump it trips instead of being a
Controlled uh shutdown of that pump it trips and you have that back flow so you would still be able uh to see the benefit of having the dampening system on it uh one of the the benefits I think is this uh is is on Startup and that’s
Where I guess maybe the varial speed pumps are maybe a little bit better on Startup if you have a standard pump that’s not variable sometimes you start up that pump and you get a very surge of flow coming in and of course that is just startup and it will slam that disc
Wide open but there’s not enough flow to maintain the disc being in the open position and it will slam the disc back closed and you get that happening that cycling as you start up you get that a rapid opening and closing for for quite a bit of time and that can damage the
Internals of a check Val with this combined function as Chad mentioned we can throttle it open especially with like an electric actuator as is shown here you can uh have it programmed to open to 10 or 20 degrees only and it will hold that disc Edge just like this
Picture it will hold that disc in that position then when you are ready for full operation normal operation you go to the midpoint on the Travel of the gear and that will put that disc into a standard check mode so it will be no longer being held by the actuator it is
In a free check mode so you have a standard check valve and then when you’re ready to shut down it can go the opposite way and force it closed if you want to force it Clos against float it can be sized that way we typically do not recommend that it be
Size large enough to close on its own against flow we would rather have have it operate as a check valow and then just have the safety function to close as an isolation bow and to hold it close um so it’s it’s very unique we do have some additional slides kind of show
How that free travel coupling works because it is uh it’s a very unique as Chad said a very unique feature for atoms to be able to uh have that isolation valve which you can claim it as an isolation valve and you can still claim this as a check
Valve because it will be disengaged completely from the actuator when it is in the check mode so I I hope that answered the the variable speed pump question um and if it didn’t we can further clarify it so in essence really on Startup then this
Valve can be used as to create the back pressure you need to the primary pumper ensure that that uh you don’t get out of control down down stream correct and and this AI specifically there are several uh applications or installations across Canada city of London uses this uh
Cardinal power uh uses these uh Vancouver Island uh the Calpine there uses these so they are installed throughout throughout Canada in service currently thanks right back to you guys and this so that was the end of this part of the presentation I I think Paul did over
Yeah keep going think there’s one more SL next slid yeah yeah so this kind of show you a little bit better how that free coupling or free travel coupling works as as we call it it’s a little harder to see here um but the green section is going to be the
The part that is attached to the actuator and the yellow is the uh the what’s actually on the disc so if you want to play that video um Chad as you can see we have it here in the in the locked isolated position um maybe our video isn’t going to play in Zoom yeah not sure why that’s happening I’ll I’ll find another slide deck bear with me for a sec so maybe the the video didn’t come over across as well uh but you can see actually if you go back to one slide there uh you can kind of see in this
Mode this would be uh the valve throttle with the gear go back one more you can kind of see where the green and the yellow how they’re engaging um yeah you can kind of see that and go back in one more slide yeah here let me um let me
Try my computer one sec I’m just gonna switch the screen the animation helps a lot more so bear with me yeah that’s all right let see if this works can you guys see my screen yes yeah okay all right there we go and you can see this explanation down
There at the bottom too but there we go we can see a little bit better now um as you can see and if you start that video go ahead and start that video again so we’re in normal check mode and then we are actually I put that backwards the yellow portion is our
Actuator the green portion is my check valve so you can see where that we turn the yellow portion of that shaft and it’s turning to then lock that disc closed to hold it closed okay you want to move to the next slide and now if um to what um bra
Umen sorry Braden was saying we can uh adjust and not open the valve until we’re ready until we have that pressure equalized across that disc we can keep it locked in that closed position and then as we see remove the yellow turn the yellow shaft so that the check valve then operates as
A check valve okay and the next one so here once again we’re just going into plain check valve mode so allowing it to be act as a check valve and then the last slide is where we’re just throttling it with the gear and we are forcing it now into a certain
Position so that the disc throttles the flow so it is a unique design um and and something that uh once again if you have the application we definitely want to come and talk to you in person to show you our our samples and to get your application so we can
Customize it for what you need great thank you gentlemen I’m able to jump to some questions um first I guess where do you guys uh what specific applications in what waste water do you see these being used most well it depends on the applications
I guess well we see it a lot more is multi uh multi- pumps we’re going into a a header system if you have more than one pump and you’re going into a header system and you want to isolate one so one comes off a line well if you’re in a
Header system all that flow is going to come back to the one you just turned off very quickly and so we see that a lot in those systems especially these combined function so you can dampen that that flow or that excuse me that speed of that disc and that that water hammer
That can affect uh your your whole piping system and then you can have the valve be the isolation for that pump afterwards so that is one of the main applications we really see this in is when you have multiple pumps in one system uh another application that we
See a lot of these go into are uh when you’re pumping uh vert up up over a long distance uh over mountains if you’re pumping vertically you don’t have when you turn off that one pump instead of having multiple pumps if you have just one pump and you’re pumping for the most
Part uh horizontally it’s going to be an okay when you turn it off you’re not going to get is a rush of back flow but if you’re pumping uphill more vertically than horizontal and you shut down that pump you’re going to have a very large head of water rushing back towards that
Pump and if it’s not dampen appropriately it you’re going to get that large water hammer and slamming effect right perfect and that just sort leading to the next question here that popped up uh can these be installed horizontally and or vertically and uh guess the answer is is yes well but for
Applications you’re going to want the the the stem of our valve is going to be horizontal you’re never going to put the stem uh vertically but but yes for on Flow it can be either direction but you got to make sure the the stem is put in appropriately okay awesome thanks yeah
All right um are they is a deping system set at the factory or is it something that you recommend on site service good uh both so we’ve uh we’ll we’ll set uh sort of factory settings uh at the factory will the valve will be manufactured in Germany uh shipped to uh
Our shop uh in in Houston where we we can then uh add the hydraulic fluid and uh bleed the system and have it set and tested but we do uh highly recommend on-site commissioning because uh as many people uh on the this call probably know from experience there’s uh what the flow
Is supposed to be and what the flow is so uh having an adoms technician on site just to fine-tune the valve is is very highly recommended okay and talking about sizing Um are they are these typically sized to the application yes um we will always want to uh we’ll say derate the trim as much as possible uh for the application because we want the valve of the disc to be uh very sensitive to to flow um so that it
Doesn’t perform sluggishly so although the the the body and uh flange rating will be u in accordance with the piping system uh we will customize the trim I think that’s one of the uh misnomers we see in the industry is that check file tend to be line sized and not properly
Sized like a control valve should be and uh um when that happens typically the um flow rates aren’t um substantial enough to keep that disc up and and stable at the flows and that’s where you get into trouble with um a lot of movement a lot of fluttering in your disc and that
Mechanical wear and so uh properly size check Val that we always recommend Adams does as well that’s yeah that’s a good point that I mean I think most people on the call probably already that but check valves they need a cracking pressure basically just to open
It to start it but everything else that maintains the position of that disc as you said is based on Flow and so um pressure doesn’t matter as much as flow on on check valve applications sounds good you mentioned you guys are doing more and more in
Seawater um so codings are one thing how about duplex super duplex are you guys uh starting to see that more often yes that’s available in product off yes we are seeing a lot of it um uh Marine applications we’re seeing a lot of it in the Middle East um harsh
Environments uh obviously saltwater environment so yeah duplex super duplex uh the coding systems all to to provide longevity of the Val they’re not cheap so we we need the last right right oh uh the last question here um standard so I think you touched on it um
And I saw some but uh are the are combined function is there a standards for Combined function checks or um they you said sort of made to made to order and yeah so we we’ll adhere to the um asme API uh standards many times we uh
We customized the valves to fit into an awwa standard as I mentioned a little while ago we are uh actively involved in the process right now and should have full certification on the valves great so that not just the coding system is in sf61 certified but the entire valve is
In sf61 certified so we’re seeing a a trend in that direction so we want to be out in front of it uh where everything around everything around the system the piping the pump everything is in sf61 cool so and I think uh Bren mentioned it earlier we do also make the uh Mak
Triple offset isolation Valves and and so what Chad mentioned about nsf61 we are also having our isolation uh butterfly valves certified to nsf61 because we are seeing more of those applications in poble water uh increase perfect sounds good I think that’s all the questions so again Chad Paul thank
You so much for your time today um for all the guests out there thank you very much for uh spending the last 45 minutes with us um if you have any other questions or interested in any of this uh please feel free to reach out to any
Of us Sam like I said we’ll be sending out a followup email um if you have any other ideas or any other topics you’d like to learn about please send those through uh like I said we try to do this at least every uh three or four weeks
Have a new topic and um feedback from you guys so uh again have a great safe day and uh we’ll hope to see you soon thank you thanks a lot thank you much everyone