Worcestershire County Council – Full Council

Morning everyone please be up standing to receive your chairman and vice chairman morning Council please be seated before the formal business of today’s meeting starts I wish to say that it’s with great sadness that I announc that councelor Peter Griffith has passed away on behalf of Wester County Council and

The people of werer I send our thoughts to Peter’s family during this very difficult time now i’ like to call councelor Emma Stokes to say a few words councelor Stokes thank thank you chairman I would never have thought that my first Duty in 2024 would be to pay tribute to our lost

Colleague counselor Peter Griffith our thoughts are sent to Marian and his family Peter was a character and that’s really where I should leave it he was on the short end of my comets many a time and I was on the receiving end of his comments this led some to some extremely

Interesting discussions on the way back from Worcester however these comments to each other United us and confirmed that we were doing the right thing as newbies to the counties because we were so passionate about our town to play good cop bad cop routine with the CMR for highways to throw traffic

Congestion into a debate for defibrillators Peter would find a way to support aliser and the 278 team in pursuing the recommendations to play a PL a tag team with counselor Matt Jenkins in a cabinet meeting to ensure that the CMR heard cross Party Support but Above All Else Peter loved IAM he

Worked for IAM enjoyed representing IAM on the County Council and he later stood uh on IAM Town Council he leaves massive shoes for any IAM Northwest councelor to fill and I hope whoever is lucky enough to be elected to his seat loves IAM and works as hard as Peter and commits with

Passion to the role so while I suggested at the beginning of this statement that it was my duty I actually pay tribute to Peter with pleasure I am just saddened that I had to do it in the first place and that for his loss to make me aware

That there are very few people I would be so comfortable playing good cop bad cop with rest in peace Peter thank you thank you very much councelor Hardman uh yes thank you very much um yes it’s great very sad day to have to stand and pay uh a tribute to Peter Griffith um

Because there’s no doubt that um his tragic passing has cut short what I thought was going to be a very promising uh second career in local government course Peter’s main qualification was of course he was an architect and there are few members that have had such an impact I think in our

Group and indeed in the council because he was very enthusiastic in everything he did he really put his heart and soul into it whether it was uh dealing with eam traffic or or particularly I mean I just remember in early December on the host meeting there the comments that he

Made he brought his personal experience of life to play into the host meeting um but he was also very challenging to uh those from the NHS Peter was an enthusiastic member he embraced you know eam and he was absolutely clear in what he wanted to achieve you know better

Communications along the a46 he wanted to see the Hampton Bridge done and and finished you know he couldn’t understand why there were the delays but his interest in life was wide ranging and reflected his enthusiasm for life so it really is tragic that he his life has

Been cut short so suddenly um by his passing because we will miss it because as I said as Em’s alluded to he was a very straightforward member because he always told you exactly what he was thinking thank you very much councelor Bo right thank you chair this is a bit of an odd

Moment for me because this is the chair I usually associate with him because we were both actually uh first elected to witch Haven back in 2019 um and I think if there is an afterlife um Peter’s probably at the moment watching this and probably thinking oh god um because our

Relationship at the beginning was was not good and it very much reflected the relationship that our political parties at wi Haven um uh were kind of mirroring and thankfully over time that did change and funny enough actually it was an oh God moment in November 21 that actually changed that relationship because Peter

Is someone who we we struggled to see ey to ey for a very long time and both of us being quite straightforward and sometimes being quite blunt um would very often rub each other up the wrong way and it was actually on an overview and scrutiny panel uh budget meeting I

Think where we found a common um enemy fly tippers um and I think it was safe to say that uh never before have two people found such a passion for making sure people are finded to the point of no return um and it was at that point we

Were able to see a little bit more of each other’s Viewpoint it the last year is where we’ve really got to know each other and actually got to spend a bot more time together and the last conversation I had with him kind of made me realize actually he’s someone who I

Was actually quite looking forward to working with and it was a bit of a shock to see that he was no longer going to be with us and really demonstrates that yes politically I don’t think there is many people who are more different than myself but actually we could find common

Ground and it is with huge sadness that I’m not going to see him in this chamber again because he’s actually someone who I’ve actually grown to really respect having those conversations with I know who I am far more because of those conversations I’ve had and I know that

He felt the same way don’t get me wrong there were times when we could probably have strangled each other and there would have been far more oh God moments and it was only a matter of time before I accidentally left my mic on and did

The same um but he took it on the chin when it happened it was good fun and I have to say I am genuinely going to miss him thank you councelor Ral uh thank you chair like um everyone here I was very very very saddened to

Hear uh that Peter passed away over the uh Christmas uh period uh not least because I was I was only with him uh about three three and a half weeks previous uh to his uh passing with um John Frasier we were going around uh eam

Having a look at a number of issues that he wanted to have a look at it was my I think it was my third uh visit with with Peter to even to look at uh issues uh in in his division he was that persistent

Um in having me go over and look at um things uh this time we were having a look at um sites around the local cycling walking in infrastructure plan and uh he took us to the Hampton Bridge um uh he took us uh all through the the

Park play area there to the um uh to the cycle uh the valad Drome think the you know the Val Park sorry um and we got to the Val Park and um we were there and uh there was a there was a moment where we

Had to get over a small fence in order to uh uh achieve it so John Fraser uh jumps this fence like a gazelle and there’s uh myself and pet are trying to help each other over this uh uh uh this this fence and um uh I don’t know if

You’ve seen The Last of the Summer Wine but it was sort of uh on on on that scale um but but but that’s that’s uh you know tribute to a man who was always happy to to to give it a go despite um uh you know if there was a challenge

There if there was a fence pet would definitely try and climb it and you know did that in his Council work uh as well the section 278 agreement um I know that that was a difficult Journey for that for that for for that piece of work but

It was Peter who was the one who came to me and really kind of brokered a Way Forward uh uh on that and and I’ll always uh uh be grateful to him uh for that um but it was every conversation it really was every conversation I had with Peter was about

Uh traffic issues going through EA persistence personified and there are things that we will be doing in ire uh that will be down to his persistence and his his work and it would be you know an honor to to deliver that work in his memory um and we really do lose a a

Valuable asset to this Council in in in in in in uh in Peter um so I just wanted to share that tribute uh to him to the great man uh that he was and he will be sely Miss certainly by me in particular thank you thank you very much does any other

Member wish to say a few words m Jenkins councelor Jenkins uh thank you chair and I’d just like to add to all the um wonderful thoughts and words I did so far I got to know Peter really well working on that section 278 scrutiny task group and it

Was yeah a real pleasure to work with him and you know I it was a real shock to hear about his passings so he will be missed I really got to know him really well during that time so my condolences to his family thank you thank you very much Peter will

Definitely be missed by this Council and the people of weria I would also at this uh Point like to mention the sadness of the death of former County councelor Cabinet member Ken Pollock now I’d like to call councelor Hart to say a few words uh thank you very much indeed Mr

Chairman and I Rise to speak on behalf of the conservative group I uh first met Ken when he was elected to was Cy Council back in 2009 for the tenbury division and indeed Ken represented that division for um three terms um before he

Uh retired um uh a few uh years ago um I think it’s um fair to say and I’m sure for all of those people that knew Ken um he was very forthright very colorful but very fair-minded um and passionate about everything that he did he was certainly

Not shy in taking on the Press uh or the media or indeed any journalist and he would be a regular correspondent with um various um uh newspapers uh in the uh letter pages and indeed he was a regular correspondent with members of this cabinet long after he had retired uh and

I I I he would watch the webcasts of cabinet and for Council and and make comments and um observations that we might like to use and um uh for those of us who are believers I have little if any doubt he doesn’t need a webcast uh

Today he’s uh watching uh over us uh and hopefully uh with a smile he um was um a Cabinet member and I I had the privilege of serving in the cabinet all of the years that he was in the cabinet and he had responsibility for for economy uh

Skills and infrastructure from 2016 and 2021 uh and um in indeed in 2017 when I became Cabinet member for Education it also at that time became Cabinet member for education and skills so I took the skills off him um and I’m never quite sure whether he’s forgiven me for that

Uh because um and I say that in G because um the the the two kind of fit in both areas and obviously education and um uh then Employment and um apprenticeships go go hand inand with W with skills but he he would always come uh to the annual apprenticeship Awards

Uh and would always make a special effort uh in um uh meeting as many young apprentices as he possibly uh could uh and um his commitment to the role and in particular the delivery of major infrastructure improvements across this County during his time the dueling of the Southern Link Road wer Parkway

Railway St ocean for example which opened in February 2020 involvement in wor 6 Business Park and indeed kidmin the railway station and I could go on and on so it is with great sadness um that um uh I um speak on behalf of the

Group uh and Ken um we we very much um miss you on the County Council uh and for those of us who’ve seen you and still um had the privilege of your comments and observations since we shall most sincerely miss you and uh hope that you rest in peace thank you councelor

Fry thank you very much uh chair uh many of this room won’t know about Ken Pollock because you’re all uh relatively new uh I first encountered Ken Pollock when I got back on muster Kenny Council in 2013 and uh uh kenned got the uh a job

Of the the tenry division which is a mighty division somewhat if you compare it to somewhere like arav valy West it’s a it’s a a mighty division also taking over The reigns from from RE farmer it was it was like a bit of a a legend

There it it’s a bit like following Alex Ferguson basically in into the Manchester United job but uh but Ken made that that role as tenur counselor um his own and and he he did a good job he he was a constantly at war with the

Labor party and the labor group uh so so the fair-minded bit I’m not sure about that because we often had a had a Chate uh is a is a cabinet responsibility and even though we agreed he seemed to find something to have an argument about however however Ken Ken Ken was okay he

Was passionate about what he did and he believed in W KY Council he believed in tenur and he believed in a better werer uh and so so so for those that don’t know it and for those that did it’s I was very sorry to hear a bar is passing

And we wish his family well thank you thank you councilor Elizabeth a thank you I I Rise to sadly to pay tribute to a good friend and fellow counselor Dr Kemp Pollock it always strikes me as curious that when a resident steps forward to serve his or her community the skills and talents

They bring with them are often forgotten by the electorate and they seem as and introduced as counselors and politicians But Ken brought with him so many skills and talents he was a retired academic that joined the BBC in 1977 to work in farming uh now named country file and

Then in 1994 as a self-employed television producer joined Top Gear Motorsport working alongside Jeremy Clarkson and it’s fair to say he was very instrumental in Top Gear’s success uh it’s been mentioned that he lived in Mar and represented tenbury from 2009 to 2021 and he bought all these talents

From his time at the BBC from his time as a self-employed television producer and really understood business economic growth the importance of attracting highly skilled Workforce uh into Worcester and the creation of the many new jobs and Marcus has talked and other people of the work he did on the

Scrutiny panel and on cabinet in 2014 he moved to cheltonham for family reasons as we did my husband and I in to cheltonham in 2016 and this meant we were neighbors so to speak uh and it cemented our family friendships and we perhaps more than most appreciate how Ken and D approached

The challenge of his cancer which was many years before and he’d been struggling with for many years he kept active and kept engaged with Affairs as as been mentioned as an academic he was always ready for an argument and uh he always had a hypothesis and he was

Always willing to challenge and he challenged a many people if you looked at his Twitter account and and and many different he always he always had the background information to present his case not always the full background information but he did present a case

And argue his side uh um and he put up a very brave face he was even volunteering in park run in cheltam in October struggling out there with his crutches and doing that work in October the end was very difficult but met with his customary sto sto sto stoicism post

Christmas and New Year he died Thursday the 4th of January at 5:00 p.m. in the company of his wife and daughters able to talk to loose his bump but unfortunately not able to meet his first grandchild due at the end of this month he will be very much missed by all of us

And our family thank you councelor Kent uh thank you chair um many people I I I spent once I was elected onto the council Ken acted in a sense and probably many of you would recognize similarities as somewhat of a a mentor to me in the way he he he wasn’t afraid to

Speak his mind and let people know exactly what he thought and uh councelor a is quite right sometimes it was very heavily based on facts because he was a doctor after all with the PHD and others it was it was um it was off the cuff to

Say to say the least but I used to even during during his reign as a counselor and always completely afterwards as well he used to send me constantly there was exchanges on Twitter and there was also emails on subjects as diverse of the rainforests in in Brazil the views of

Democratic politicians in New York and all sorts of other elements and he used to Pride himself in sending me every report he could ever find about a Tesla electric fire which I thought was really delightful of him and I used to reply with with Glee because it didn’t take me

Very long to find a BMW or jaguar or any other petrol type of vehicle that had been bursting Flames as well and particularly when a car park that recently went up we were actually exchanging that as well where the entire car park had gone so there was a a huge

Degree of sense of humor about it but he was very focused we we we jelled quite a lot because when he was working on Top Gear I was actually rallying at the time and and he was actually working at Top Gear when I was rallying in the British

And World Championship so there was a real mutual appreciation of of Motorsport and everything and one of the things I was always trying to do and I was always challenging him with the political opinion of trying to close the roads in werer for a motorsport event

When we couldn’t get a cycling one away was always an absolute challenge but that was something we we dreamed of but felt we would never get past the likes of councelor Jenkins on a Month of Sundays but um yeah so so for me he he’ll be greatly missed I I I think of

Him often on on climate change and other things we we we he he gave me book ideas and things like that that I took away and read and and learned considerable amounts on we we differed on the climate change View to a certain extent but he

Was always open to the debate and I’m going to really miss him I think the last time I saw him was probably at councelor Robert’s funeral and it does seem to be at the moment that we’re losing some very very good counselors but uh yeah rest in peace Ken thank you councelor

Jenkins thank you chair yeah i’ just like to add it’s good to know that I’m not the only person that was emailed by Ken after he was a counselors could know that basically he seemed like he emailed everyone so usually about climate change certainly got to admit um that to say we

Disagreed about almost everything is probably an understatement I think and particularly around climate change but he was always very well researched but often wrong but he went to the wrong places but he always believed he was right and probably most of us in this room probably actually

Believe we’re right but he really was absolutely certain and he was but was always open to a debate and an argument and that that was certainly that’s kind of what we’re for here and however much we disagreed it was almost it was always it was always amicable and friendly to

Me when we’d have these debates even though we vly disagreed about nearly everything it was it was always a pleasure to have that debate with him so I’m sure he will be sorely missed so thank you councelor Hardman thank you chairman yeah I mean the great thing about Ken was he fitted

So much into his life um you know University lecturer BBC producer you know Top Gear farming today country file um you know he did an enormous amount of work inside the BBC I have to say an organization that I of course work for as well and he treated with as much contempt

As as he probably treated some of us with because you know in c um Ken was driven by his own particular brand of logic um And he as you rightly say he he always loved an argument I mean he would cross the street frankly to have an argument with

Him but he was also you know incredibly impatient he always wanted to get on and do things and that was that was the great thing about him Ken was a real doer and he bought that experience of his life um um into the into the work of

Of of the council I think you know extremely well um and he was dedicated to the teen Valley he loved living up up in the teen Valley you know it used to drive in nuts where tenbury High School didn’t do better you know the roads in

Tenbury I you know I think Ken did a tremendous amount for them and he represented an area that he thought hadn’t been represented particularly well although reg Palmer was Legend uh he was pretty critical of what re re had done in the past but I mean he showed

Great strength of mind and tremendous character and I will give you one example of that when I was leader in 2011 I offered him a job in the cabinet Ken thought about it for about 30 seconds and said I think not I think I could do better for the

People of werer by being chairman of an overview and scrutiny panel thank you councelor boat right green I wasn’t planning on saying anything but I never met him yeah I can say my inbox is full of these emails and they sound remarkably familiar I can honestly say I’ve got at least a dozen

About fires for electric cars and it all started with the um climate emergency Motion in in that in July 21 I didn’t really know he was I had to I genuinely had never met him I didn’t know what was going on it was incredibly well researched um and actually was the

Result of why myself and councelor bis ended up being a bit of a spat at that debate when I mentioned the fact that I had a doctorate because he kept writing underneath Doctor Ken Pollock doctor and I was like and I literally ended up writing back I’ve got one

Teammate realized that probably wasn’t the best way to go CU like all I got them was a diet tribe of why it shouldn’t have been [Laughter] mate Fair Point fair point but then it was only when someone mentioned unfortunately he passed away I’d looked I was trying to find something in my

Inbox so I realized that I’d actually then every single email and I have to say I didn’t realize quite how many there were until I checked every single one I signed them off with see you later mate and it’s realized actually we’ve all been getting those same emails

Haven’t we and I never met him thank you does any other member wish to to say a few words I also have to add with sadness the death of former County councelor Margaret Wills I’ll will now ask councelor bis to say a few words on behalf of the conservative group following by Lind

Denham councilor bis uh thank you uh Mr chairman um it’s a pleasure to uh speak on behalf of the conservative group although there is a bit of an irony there that might experience of Margaret was in my youth and those who know my political Journey will know that I knew

Margaret through uh through another cause um I I knew Margaret uh I suppose uh something think at least 25 years ago and it may have been longer um Margaret was a leading figure at the time in the Worcester labor party uh and was indeed I understand the first female leader uh

Of uh the first female labor leader of the city council in 1998 99 uh it was a short spell uh and came to a rather bloody end unfortunately for Margaret but it was she she did have that distinct honor um I always found Margaret to be a kind passionate

Committed individual who who who certainly loved the labor party a and certainly loved Worcester um she was community-minded um she was a pretty forceful character uh she had very clear views on things um I but I always found her a welcoming cheerful individual uh and I will remember Margaret as somebody who were

Who who always had a smile on her face she was an effervescent uh character uh and somebody that uh it was a pleasure to know and over the years since although I haven’t seen her for many years but when she left the council I think we served

Together for about a year on wer City Council about 20 odd years ago um and I would see her occasionally after that in Worcester um she was always she was always the same she was always welcoming she was always Pleasant it was and uh she was uh always interested in

Worcester and where it was going so um she was a a loyal servant of this Council uh and wer City uh and uh on behalf of the conservative group I’m sure I pass on all of our deepest condolences to her family thank you councelor denim thank you very much um yes

Margaret Wills was um County counselor um for 10 years between 1995 and 2005 so there are I guess limited number of people within the room who sat alongside her um and of course during that period um the council went from being Harford and Worcester Council to becom westers

Council so she um sort of stayed throughout that Journey unfortunately um the councelor archive is off limits at the moment within County Hall behind the rack con concrete so um officers were unable to look up any sort of further detail um although know some of them do fondly remember her um understand she

Was served on the social services committee um she was absolutely dedicated in terms of her her values and and lived her values she worked for Citizens advice Bureau um and she was a court Advocate and a casew worker for them um she was involved in women’s Aid

And Sh start so an absolute advocate for um empowering women um and and lived that through she lived um cuz I actually um you know we attended her funeral and you you learn an awful lot about people don’t you at at funerals unfortunately I didn’t kind

Of record it all um but she lived in different parts of Europe for a number of years before um settling in Worcester um with her family she was um I mean she was first elected to the city council in 1981 and she represented the former St Barnabas Ward which is now become

Rainbow Hill Ward um and I think it was the same naming for the county divisions that she represented so in many ways um she’s actually my predecessor so I am County counselor for rainbow Hill division now um and in becoming joint leader of the city council said earlier this year in in May

Last year um when people were saying oh you know woman leader of the labor thing I said no Margaret Wills I remembered Margaret Wills so we never overlapped in terms of um being counselors um I absolutely remember a fun vivacious participant at every labor party social event um great fun always

Lovely to talk to um a caring community-minded counselor um she was particularly interested in decent housing um and high quality Planning Development for local people her socialist commitment was absolutely unded um she was buried in astwood Cemetery in the natural burial area so absolutely you know lived and died her

Values that was her her choice um and donations um were to dementia UK and Alzheimer’s Society so in her latter years um she she suffered from those those conditions um but yeah well remembered and and much loved in her day thank you very much does any other member wish to say a few

Words we send our condolences to Margaret’s family during this very difficult time I’d now ask if you could please stand for a moment in reflection e thank you please be seated unfortunately the Reverend Andy Browning is unwell and is unable to be with us um this morning we send our best wishes to

Andy and hope he has a speedy recovery we now move to agenda item number one which is apologies and Declarations of Interest start of the meeting I will ask Hazel best to read out any apologies already received apologies have been received from councilors Tony Miller aliser Adams Beverly neelsen Joe Monk and Craig

Warhurst thank you very much I now ask if there is any other apologies for absence of today’s meeting thank you I now call for details of any Declarations of Interest together with details of items to which they relate at this point just before I call for Declarations of interest I’m aware

That a number of you do sit on the Fire Authority um and to make things easier I just ask that you uh raise your hand if you sit on the Fire Authority just give us 10 minutes while we write everyone’s name down that’s very helpful thank you now call

For any further Declarations of interest councelor Mr chairman uh I’m the deputy police and crime commissioner for West Mercier and so under item five I shall declare an interest but having to sort advice I shall remain and listen but not participate in the debate thank you very much are there any

Further Declarations of Interest thank you counselor yeah uh agenda item six I’m employed by Herford was the fire rescue service thank you very much I’d just like to say a few words about the meeting today please remain seated when you’re called to speak and this is because the webcast won’t pick

You up if you are standing it’s important that you switch your microphone off after speaking there is no queuing system for speakers in operation so if you do wish to speak please raise your hand and using the yellow voting card and wait to be acknowledged by Hazel best who will be

Keeping a list of speakers a 35 minute lunch break will be taken at approximately 1 p.m. dependent on where we are in today’s agenda now move to agenda item number two which is public participation we’ve received three requests to speak at today’s meeting the first speaker is Melissa polton who’s asking a question

About equality and diversity she’s not here she’s not turned up for today’s meeting going to move straight on then to uh the second speaker which is Sam Amar who’s presenting a petition about the state of roads and Pavements in Grafton Cresent in bromsgrove mamar you have three minutes to present your petition thank

You thank you chairman Happy New Year I’m here to bring to your attention the deteriorating condition of grafting creson and its Pavements in charford having walked most roads in the Town Center area multiple times I can confidently say that Grafton Crescent is one of the most damaged roads in Broms Grove

Center the residents of Grafton Cresent have reported numerous Falls and accidents on these Pavements and it’s evident that immediate action is required to address this issue while patchwor Solutions May provide temporary relief it’s crucial that a long-term Sustainable Solutions implemented over the Chistmas period the road was closed for 2 days and only

About 20 M of Paving was resurfaced which actually infuriated residents even further if we add the Pavements and the road we’re looking at 2 my estimate 2.4 kilm so 20 m is really um insufficient I urge the County Council to prioritize the rep and resurfacing of graft and Crescent with solid overall

Tarmar that can withstand the test of time this will not only ensure the safety of residents but also safe costs in the long run by avoiding frequent repairs I believe there’s a duty of care towards residents of charford it’s essential that their concerns are addressed promptly I kindly request you

Allocate necessary resources and funding to undertake necessary repairs of graft and Crescent thank you for your attention on this matter Mr chairman I trust you will take the appropriate action to ensure safety and well-being of the residents of charford who have signed this which I will present to

You thank you very much indeed for coming this morning and I’m sure that your petition will be handed over to me the third speaker at today’s meeting is Jesse jger who is asking a question about the collapse of a foot path in CLS M jger you have three minutes to

Make your comments thank you thank you chair um I’m here on behalf of residen in claims uh regarding the closure of the foood path along the Northwick slip uh which Clos in Clos in March of of 2022 uh I commend our members Mel’s effort in patience in Seeking a

Resolution and I have every confidence she will succeed in find a resolution but today I feel compelled to add my voice to hers and address the questions lingering among our residents about the circumstances leading to the foot path collapse while acknowledging that the ABS any absence of evidence indicating

Wrongdoing or negligence by developers REM uh residents remain skeptical about the collapse being solely due to natural causes the perception that developers May benefit from a permanent closure providing unspoil unspoiled views of the river in the newly built Bungalows has fueled concerns as you know unless this questions circulating online are openly

Asked an answer they will faster to address these concerns I’m submitting two questions number one in July 2021 the wer news reported that a specialist engineer attributed the lands slip to a natural erosion I see clarity on the methodology and the data used to reach this conclusion and whether the engineer

Can categorically rule out natural CA nonnatural causes number two the removal of the steps leading down to the foot path was deemed an act of petty theft and no culprit has ever been found did the specialist engineer investigate a potential link between the theft and the river erosion if so what was our

Conclusion and what evidence supports it while I don’t expect immediate responses I kindly request the chair or the relevant committee and the relevant officer to address these questions in writing fostering transparency and reach out to us through our U member in the chamber thank you very

Much thank you very much indeed and I just listened very carefully to to what you had to say I don’t think some of this falls under the remit of the County Council however I will ensure that you receive a written response from the relevant Cabinet member in due course

And thank you for taking the time to come this morning thank you thank you very much agenda item number three is the minutes may now sign as a correct record the minutes of the meeting which was held on the 9th of November 2023 agenda item number four is Chairman’s announcements I’d like to

Draw to your attention the document that was previously emailed to you I would also like to take this opportunity to recognize the difficult times experienced by local members sorry local residents across worshire during the latest flooding um which has been affected within this County and uh our

Thoughts are with those during this very difficult time now move to agenda item number five which is the visit of the West Mercier police and crime commissioner can I welcome our police and crime commissioner Mr John Campion as he attends our meeting today with Alex Murray the acting Chief Constable

Thank you very much for taking the time to come and see us this morning Mr Campion will give a short presentation on priorities and local policing plans and there will be an opportunity to ask questions throughout um through the chairman with the agreement of the group

Leaders uh it in view of the amount of business on today’s agenda I intend to allocate 30 minutes for questions should time run out Mr Campion has kindly agreed to receive answers to receive any questions and answers uh in writing uh via email Mr Campion thank you very much

Thank you chairman and uh good morning uh Council I just want to start by uh adding uh my condolences around former councelor Ken Pollock um I first uh became aware of Ken uh during a tussle uh with the then libdem leader and uh I hadn’t heard of him before and I often

Thought what kind of chap he was but then went on uh to inspire me around not only the tenacity but the willfulness that has to be being how we uh elect uh uh how we uh represent the people who who elect us and the very best I think

In wer Ken often represented and if it’s any consolation to anybody else until uh within the month of his death he was still emailing me pointing out where I was going wrong uh in my elected duties so I’m obviously part of a much wider club uh than I thought I was um uh

Chairman it’s a pleasure to be here uh with the temper Chief conable to give an update I just to very briefly touch on a couple of matters and then the chief uh will touch on the more operational side of issues and then we’ll move quickly uh

To two questions uh the first I wanted to touch on uh was uh working with worcesters Shere so the Instinct of members will be to scrutinize and and ask what we are doing or an issue that isn’t quite in the right place but one thing we have done in werer is start to

Work more effectively together wer can of council myself and the police are now as part of a partnership in a stronger community’s uh work that is just getting um underway and my ask of members is how we continue to uh work together to spend the money that we have on behalf of the

Taxpayer ever more effectively on improving um the outcomes and that will be a total of 2 million over two years uh here in the county and there is a separate uh 200,000 pot uh that I’m also working uh with the district but ensuring that we join up our activity to

Deliver the outcomes for our community is a very Central priority for my uh for myself as commissioner uh the second point I just want to touch on briefly is around officer numbers uh West meria Police now has uh record numbers of police officers but it is important that

Those resources are used and indeed the benefit felt uh by our public so my focus is unashamedly on bringing offenders to Justice ensuring that the victims uh get the right get the right support when they are a victim of crime to cope and recover and lastly that the police are there in an

Emergency and are visible and accessible and responding uh to Crime um uh in the appropriate and proportionate amount of time and then very lastly uh around the voice of the victims um it is often uncomfortable in our society around some of the impact of crime uh that we feel

Whether it be some of the most complex uh sexual uh sexual related crimes or domestic abuse all the way through to some of our uh more uh neighborhood-based crime and my mission as commissioner is to make sure that I’m giving the voice to those that might not

Have one and we as a society understand the continued impact of some of the harm that perhaps that we are flicking over in in our uh weekly uh newspapers and how we continue to give voice to those that haven’t I hope the council would join with me in making sure that we

Continue uh continue to do that and as I say the chief will briefly touch on some operational matters and then we’ll move to questions thank you commissioner and it’s good to be able to answer questions from you today Council uh I work to your commissioner’s safeer West Mercier plan

Which has four pillars reassurance a victim Focus reform reforming uh West meria Police and uh making people in West meria safer I’m glad to say that that’s been my focus both as deputy chief constable and temporary Chief Constable um and I can say that over the last year Financial year we’ve seen a

Significant reduction in crime in Wester year so around 3,000 less crimes at the same time my focus has been bring on bringing offenders to Justice uh and we have seen an increase of over 400 extra offenders brought to Justice on top of the three and a half thousand that were

Brought to Justice last year so we are moving in the right space um in addition to that uh touching on certain crimes rape significant reductions and significant increases in offenders brought to Justice I know you’re welcome but we do have challenges particularly in the south of w toer around burglary

And there has been increases in burglary but at the same time increases in offenders brought to justice for burglary uh it’s been a busy time some of the factors uh uh I will raise with you affect the whole of West Mercier but um the commissioner and myself are

Rightly concerned around how we answer the telephone uh we now answer 61% in the last week of 101 calls within 30 seconds and 89% of 999 calls within 10 seconds and some of the critical incidents we’ve dealt with over the last year eam house explosion the horrible

Attempt murder of 71y old female on the River Bank uh in AER Town Center many fatal rtc’s including the triple fatal RTC including children in callow Hill uh unfortunately a fair few homicides uh over 80 online child sexual exploitation warrants in werer alone last year this this year have been um

Undertaken uh We’ve secured 25 and 27e convictions for two people who worked in barow Wood boarding school some of you will be aware of that as well as some of the critical incidents you know about like the tragic murder of Alfie steel we’re still focusing on fighting

Crime uh the Pedro line which was people in mulvin from Birmingham using County lines to deal drugs uh only in the last month have received long prison terms uh and we are focusing on also on serious organized criminality sometimes associated with the traveler communities um okay uh also under

Reassurance it’s good to know we have increased the amount of community watch schemes uh Community speed watch schemes uh and neighborhood matter deployments and as a result in Worcester sheare we enjoy an 83% confidence level from our independent survey and 89% of the community that are surveyed trust the

Police we’re not happy with that uh and the commissioner continually challenges me to do better we are focusing on ASB uh we’re focusing on Hotspot Patrol and we’re focusing on working in Partnership and working with regulatory Services has brought some brilliant results as has for example a cumulative Impact Zone

Working with uh wer Shear uh we have a number of operations this year uh operation Justice operation Forefront this is when all the force assets come to wer shear and operate under the local command to improve outcomes for the area and our neighborhood crime fighting teams that the commissioner has just

Referred to uh have had some recent excellent results uh so operation cix in redit toown Center catching robbers only in the last few weeks and operation Tasman catching jewelry related burglary offenders again only in the last week uh my focus under the safer West mer mer plan remain strong in relation to

Bringing more offenders to Justice a safer West Mercier and certainly reassuring communities thank you very much thank you very much for that update now going to call for members questions starting with councelor boat right green wasn’t expecting to be that quick um thank you and welcome back to persal

Um my first question um has come up as a result residents pointing out that there um have not been enough vehicles for police officers and that they have not been able to to get to to situations or not been able to follow up on things

Just like to get a bit of clarity there on the fact that we do seem to be in a situation where there don’t seem to be enough vehicles and cars in particular for them to get around and how that will be resolved the second one is we mentioned there’s a record number of

Police officers we also have a record number of residents in the area now as well and obviously I’ve know I’ve had dialogue before about the idea of there being a proper fully functioning police station in the area because that’s what residents want but do we actually have enough police officers um for West

Mercia at this point so fascinating uh that the councelor would go to the question about Vehicles so yes in answer there there are enough vehicles um in the system and you will recognize that West Mercy police is a is a human-based system and every penny that we spend on infrastructure uh buildings Vehicles

Equipment Etc is is less money that I have to spend on uh people delivering the service but uh a UND odd vehicles within the uh system my work with the chief is to make sure that we are using them um ever more uh efficiently and effectively but I’m happy to reassure

That there has been indeed in in in recent months I provided ever more resources on behalf of the public uh to provide uh additional vehicles um second in relation to um uh police being based in their communities so um persal has a fully functioning police station so

Suest there isn’t um is is untrue uh we have a base here for the uh local team and indeed is I’ve been in it many times and is used regularly um what we don’t always have are the ability of the police to be visible and accessible in

Their communities in the way that I would aspire to and the chief has alluded to and that’s why uh using all the aaces of uh of our modern work whether it be through technology or how we work with Partners I want to make sure that the public recognize and

Indeed uh can truly attest that they are the police officers are visible and accessible and very lastly in relation to numbers so we have the most we’ve ever had could we do more with more yes absolutely but we have enough in the system to deliver the outcomes and the

Aspirations that I’ve set as commissioner and as you’ve heard from the chief and I we are working hard to make that happen thank you councilor abbar thank you shair um when I first got elected as a county counselor roughly 3 years ago in the first packed

Meeting we had with one uh in our resident area one of the issues was regarding the drugs and the dealing uh there’s a very specific Road uh 3 years on the issue is still there every month we have packed meeting it is attended by the Poli um everybody knows about who is

Dealing the drugs but nothing seems to be done about it people are very frustrated now especially because the dealing happens at the corner of a park uh which you know makes it very easy for the dealers to recruit children and it does not give a good impression to the

Children as well uh so it’s my third year as a county counselor now um has the police now accepted this as a norm in the society now because nothing seems to be done the people are still there uh the residents are unhappy and their confidence in police when it comes to

Dealing with drugs is at the Rock Bottom thank you thank you for the question and I didn’t have time to brief you on all the offenders we have brought to justice for drug dealing both in the intermediate level so the the big drug dealers as well as the street drug dealers you

Refer to and there have been a number of investments in policing I think that will contribute to our battle with drugs the neighborhood crime fighting teams is just one and also we have behavioral detection officers which is a new uh a new sort of methodology of operating where uniform and plane close officers

Operate together often the plane clo officers watching The public’s reaction to the uniform officers to find out who is carrying drugs um I monitor the amount of offenders we bring to Justice For Drugs it is a healthy amount but I recognize that we can’t be everywhere

All at once uh and I will take your feedback and feed it back to the local Barrow Commander but thank you thank you councelor cross thank you chair thank you both for coming today and uh giving us this update much welcomed and happy New Year um a question that’s Arisen from

Discussions with local residents um uh working as civilians in the police service and um local police officers mostly from packed meetings throughout the year they’re regularly telling me that it glitches and access to the you know or availability to the numbers of vehicles um so more the access rather

Than the number of vehicles themselves the access to them are regular frustrations that impact their productivity um so for example about the it that officers spend admin time precious admin time writing a report the system glitches when they’ve nearly completed so they’re logged out they have to relog back in and everything’s

Gone and they have to retype from scratch and that this can happen several times for just one report you know causing significant admin delays which must be frustrations for you as well and it’s you know efficiency is really important especially when budgets are under pressure and when residents are

Feeling the cost of living um so I would ask really what is being done or what will be done further and when to address these issues please thank you thank you Council cross so um in relation to it and W can council is no different uh to West meria Police in

Terms of a large and complex organizations and the systems that support the work are are exactly that um one of the reasons to which I was very keen and indeed came out of the alliance with warshire is that we weren’t able to make our strategic it investment that we

Needed to for any of who’ve been involved in large organizations you have to continue to ensure that you are investing to keep your systems um up to date so over the last five years we have to have had to invest in excess of40 million pounds to uh catch up we are in

The final throws of that investment um uh coming to fruition and we are moving from the Brownfield system to the Green Field so we’re moving from one environment uh to the others and in the budget that the police and crime panel will be considering shortly is the last

Investment last part of the latest investment to make that happen so the first part of your question is we are doing something about it and indeed um there is a final part to to make uh the the current plan happen but what we have to do in the longer term is make sure

That never happens again I.E there is the constant investment to ensure that the uh that the systems are fit for purpose we were the last force in the country to get access to Microsoft c365 for example I never want West Mercier police to be the Google of policing um

Because I don’t think that we should be at the Forefront but what we should be doing is keeping up with uh with the uh with the developments to ensure that not only the productivity that you refer to but also the service that our public uh enjoy for example being able to selfs

Serve uh we can self- serve in terms of reporting a crime but we don’t have the ability at the moment for victims to self- serve to understand updates and progress on all the kind of things that we experience um in other interactions in the commercial world so therefore my

Commitment to you is yes we are catching up but also we have a a commitment that we will continue to invest to keep up councelor Josh Robinson thank thank you chair uh first of all just um with recent um Communications with the I just want to thank the police for the work they’ve

Been doing especially around in brms grve um my question is regarding uh um retail theft um some some may know I’ve worked I used to work in retail uh for eight or nine years on on Bron grve High Street um the the problem I find is that

Um a lot of these crimes a lot of these thefts don’t get investigated by the police or they just come back to be in um you know we couldn’t find the victim even though the CCTV say know we know the person’s on the high street so a lot

Of these crimes are now no longer being um recorded to the police so can I ask if there was a threshold for the amount of um death that you would need to to be able to investigate and if that’s changed recently at all thank you for the question and as

Chief I see retail crime is really important really serious and in the in bromo for example we have the highest detection rate for retail crime at around 29% that’s still again not good enough but it’s better than than most other crime types uh I hold my seniors to account for bringing more offenders

To Justice there is no threshold so when someone reports it it’s investigated and there have been a number of developments in this area we have seen an increase across the country and in the force in relation to shop theft uh when I asked my staff why do you think this is cost

Of living is one thing that is raised again and again I was able to demonstrate for the last 20 shoplifters that we bought to Justice they were responsible for over 600 crimes in their National Police National computer records so it doesn’t necessarily wash the majority of shoplifters are prolific

Life course shoplifters and it’s important that we focus on bringing them to justice and uh my teams understand that we’ve got some new facial recognition software that is helpful we’ve got new axon cameras where if you a retailer now you can send the CCTV straight over to our digital storage

Devices without having clunky CDs so there’s a lot of progress and a lot of focus from me from a retail crime point of view is certainly something that’s not ignored thank you councelor Stokes thank you uh yes firstly um I would just like to point out I’ve been

Invited for a drive around with uh PC Adam John’s in IAM later on in the month of January so yeah so so firstly firstly could you warn him that it will be me and ask him to to let me into the front rather than the back

Please um but what I wanted to point out is the antisocial behavior and you did refer that you are focusing on antisocial behavior and I believe that because only this week we have I my inbox is full of antisocial Behavior be in IAM toown Center lowlevel uh interference and lowlevel

Crime um but this week I walked past a group of gentlemen that were being spoken to very politely by your offices and they dispersed and it was that and that has come back to me on an email to say thank you because they believe that I’ve had some influence in that and I

Haven’t so thank you very much to the police force for doing that thank you so um Council Stokes you hit on one of the reasons as to why I bang on relentlessly about visibility and accessibility um the issue you just referred to in relation to discussing with those people probably wouldn’t be

Recorded anyway it’s not going to be on figures and alike is it but makes a difference um in our town centers we have 2 and a half thousand police officers in West meria the demands on them are enormous we can do more with more of course we can but we can also be

Visible and accessible more of the time um in our communities and for me um the the Relentless focus on improving productivity to allow that to happen um is at the center of mine and the chief Cal’s work and very lastly I like your aspiration that it’s a car you’re having

A ride round in I’m pretty certain they’ve got the van book councelor McCay yes thank you chair um commissioner are you seeing any improvements in the time it’s taking to bring suspects before the courts particularly young suspects and if not are you able to make any moves to try and improve that

Situation we are in a uh Democratic environment to where um you’re accountable to the public for the service which the can Council delivers and you hold your officers to account I’m elected by the public of West Mercia I hold the chief to account I’m not entirely sure who holds the criminal

Justice um to account uh I’m not sure whether they’re less accountable than AHS or more but it must be a close uh run thing so um I think the uh the performance of our Criminal Justice System um postco um has been uh terrible we’ve seen some improvements in some

Areas but we have not seen the Improvement uh that we should have unashamedly I am uh working with the force to ensure more offenders are brought to Justice I.E the point to which they get charged but I’m pretty certain that the journey that that victim of crime then follows afterwards

Um is is not a guaranteed one that is part of their Recovery West Mercier is supporting twice the number of victims that it was um before covid and whilst um wer is one of the better parts of of West Mercer in terms of uh the capacity through uh criminal through the uh Crown

Courts we still don’t have a Crown Court in Herford for example uh and and that judicial capacity and sitting capacity um is a is a barrier and for me um we cannot have a system where uh we are focused on holding people accountable if the ultimate process of them being

Judged to whether they’ve done it or not um I is is the blocker and at the moment I do not see a route uh to where we will Rec cover to a sustainable position that I think the public of West Mercia and the public of werer would recognize as

The right time uh for these things to take counc udle yes thank you chair first of all I would like to pay tribute to you Mr commissioner and the chief constable and all our police officers across West meria for the work you do in some very difficult times it’s it’s you

Are to be congratulated for the work you do in this in the problems which we have around us two questions if I may first the question I’ve recently been involved in campaigning against police closures or police station changes first of all the proposal to remove the police post

On D green which was removed from proposals last year and secondly the recent proposal for Sunday closure to the public of Wester police station uh which again I’m pleased to say was reversed are police stations in their current form and current status safe are we looking at potentially further

Reductions in provision or could we look forward to Future new provision of police stations uh in different parts of the C different parts of the county my second question is on the 101 number uh there is great amount of public lack of confidence in that service uh is it fit for

Purpose so uh the chief will touch on uh police front counters uh in a moment I just want to touch on police stations if I can now I’ve known you long enough councelor udle that you can be a little mischievous sometimes in the way that things are presented so the Strategic

Plan that you referred to suggested that the current provision in D Green in uh in your part of Worcester is is is not fit for purpose in the current building what it suggests is we would want to provide it elsewhere so the current building might not be fit for purpose

But there would be another provision within uh within that community and I’m Unapologetic to say that we can we can do better um in relation to the buildings that we provide uh police officers and staff and the accessibility they provide um for our community sharing buildings is a very good thing

Uh we we do it a lot with herin Worcester fire and we’re very proud to do so um but we can do more um how many do we share with werer cany Council how many do we share with wor city council and I think we can do more uh to support

Uh the uh the local officers getting the uh facilities they they need um in relation to 101 you are correct it isn’t fit for purpose in how it was in intended it was intended as a as a route into public service what it’s ended up with being is the uh rout into policing

And which means that there is a vast number of non-p policing matters that end up at the 101 um front door and that means at times it cannot uh cope but I would reiterate it is a non-emergency uh route there are many other routes including uh online uh and indeed uh the

Chief has a system of where all safeer neighborhood teams advertise not only their email addresses but their work telephone numbers so that members of the public can access them directly um but to reassure you around 101 my aspiration remains and and the chief is working towards ensuring that 80% of the

101 calls are answered uh within uh within 30 seconds and whilst we’re not there uh at the moment we are on a trajectory uh to see uh to see that achieved in due course but Chief do you want to touch on front counters uh thanks for the question um

Everything is a balance and when you ring 101 or particularly 999 you want an officer to get there quick the um my my desire is for us to get to people who need us as quick as possible uh and less people use front offices than ever before having said that I recognize the

Importance around reassurance that it offers to communities knowing there’s a station there or collocated in a council building I think they’re you know they’re both opportunities and that if they need to there’s someone there who can speak to them and are we have a huge value from the from those staff and

Quite a lot of our for example registered sex offenders and lots of people signing on bail use those locations as well so they offer a a vital pillar of support um and so it’s always that balance around serving the community who need an officer there quick and providing the reassurance in a

Physical location and that’s we we continue to try and make that balance thank you councelor Kent thank you and good to see see you again commissioner and and thank you for to the chief officer for attending as well um obviously I totally welcome the new number of officers and attended a

Community meeting and withle a few months ago whereby we unfortunately had to remind one of the sergeants in attendance of the numbers that you’d actually increased it by and uh the way that you were uh empowering more people to go onto the onto the beat as they say

Um my division as as as the commissioner is well aware is is slap bang up against Birmingham and uh and soy Hall and uh obviously in terms of the wide variety of areas within westers let alone West meria there are different problems in different areas and one of the things

We’ve got is a huge problem with incoming vehicle crime from gangs in Birmingham and I was I was just looking up the statistics and I’m at something like nearly 9 or 10% of the households over the last three years could have been affected by vehicle crime now the

Commissioner is more than aware that I I don’t hold in high regard the level of security measures that some of these car manufacturers have put on their vehicles and the technology that is now available to steal a car and I’d be interested in what your view is of that and how we’re

Dealing with it one of the other areas we have had a lot of problems with was burglary and we had a great Smart Water campaign in 2017 I’d probably like to go around and do that again because I do think it’s had a marked effect in in

Reducing the number of burglaries in the area and and putting people off in terms of trying those particular events I suppose from the commissioner’s comment about not wanting to be the Google of the policing industry having attended with councelor bis a couple of meetings with the police Minister recently and

Seen some of the advances in it that are going on I probably wish you were um particularly with regards to the use of artificial intelligence to try and help you in investigate and solve some of these crimes and then finally I suppose the one thing of negativity within the

Pie chart that you’ve got available on the crimes on the police UK website the three biggest ones are investigation complete no suspect identified unable to prosecute suspect another which I don’t know whether it comes to councelor Mai’s point about the difficulties with the criminal justice system in terms of

Conviction now but a lot of my residents once they see a crime they want to see somebody actually prosecuted for it and I am well aware that it tends to be in fits and starts with a couple of people committing all the crimes so sorry to

Burden you with of that but it is one of the biggest post bag items I get as a counselor thank you councelor Kent and I’ll ask Chief to touch on vehicle crime in North Woodshire because it’s a particular hobby horse of mine and uh uh very very pertinent um just um touching

On two what I think are contradictory points and I just explain my rationale as to why I think they’re contradictory around my aspiration over um Google of policing because I do want us to be further than we are now but I want the basics right and I want to make sure

That the ability of of um having uh good solid investigations good solid um response times good solid uh victim support um being at the best they can be before we become clever than perhaps we are um at the moment and that’s why um as you’ve heard from the chief in in his

Update a lot of things we’re talking about are getting the basics um writer to use a terrible uh English English phrase um because they’re not at a terrible level but they should be better than they are now we we are middle England here in this part of of West

Meria and our public um rightly expect a better basic level of service and perhaps they do get in in some instances um but what it does mean is as others perhaps use some of that technology um in Anger we can then adopt from their from their learning so I don’t want you

To think that our aspiration isn’t there uh to adopt but we just won’t be in the Forefront of how some of it is developed at this stage while that process of getting those Basics uh those Basics right um Chief do you want to touch on on vehicle crime

Thank you and uh uh operation enzyme is the area is the operation that focuses on vehicle crime associated with Birmingham and the area and with all and the area around there and much as councelor Stokes has gone out with some officers if you’d like to go out with

Some of our Ro’s policing and Firearms officers who guard that border and catch quite a lot of the car key burglar you’re very welcome um and there is uh often little difference between a car theft and a burglary uh often car key burglaries are where people come in to

Take the car keys but you are also so right to say vehicle manufacturers have an awesome responsibility that they have not stood up to and the ability to clone buy you can buy a device off eBay that will immediately clone a car key if it’s within a certain vicinity uh is is you

Know I think a dereliction of Manufacturers duties but it’s something that nationally the National Police Chief’s council is working on so operation enzyme is a high priority for us and just picking up on the commissioner’s points although we are not the Google of policing there’s one

Area we do lead the country in and that’s vehicle digital forensic so when we seiz a vehicle that’s been stolen or used by an offender we’re one of the best in the country of getting all the digital evidence off those dashboards that as you know now are just massive

Computers and track all your uh movements in a way that really helps us bring offenders to Justice um so it is a high priority for us thank you thank you very much we have run out of time on on questions however I am going to slightly extend the time um all

I ask is that your questions are to the point if you could please um councelor Wells chairman thank you um good morning everyone um John welcome back to W Shar and the County Council I remember our times when you were Vice chairman of ospb and uh it’s an it’s an interesting

That the vice chairs we’ve had subsequently may also look at a career path um in into uh the higher echelons of local politics so congratulations to you and all you’ve done and I was particularly pleased to see that you were in Morin yesterday yesterday evening and I hope you had a good

Session there we had a murder in Morin which is many people would be rather surprised to hear during the Christmas period and just reminds us that it isn’t necessarily always an urban inner city issue but it can be anywhere um specifically then the question I want to

Raise at two um I seem to recall last year in your plan U for Community speed watch um that you I think from memory you would double the number of speed watch groups or there was some figure some metrics I can’t quite remember I wondered how that was going and then

Just finally the chief Cal mentioned 3,000 less incidents of crime I think um I assume that’s recorded or reported crime which isn’t necessarily the same thing as crime um taking place I’m kind of mindful of the fact that 90% of rapes are never uh cases are never actually

Formally reported so I’m sure you’re not being um complacent so uh yes um uh your your point around crime statistics you are correct um they’ve been feted with enough by successive political governments that uh that make them very difficult to see the pertinence um of them but you are

Correct in the other point that you made uh in relation to um unreported and part of my drive around giving the confidence it was it was connected with Steve Mai’s point is that you’ve got to have the confidence that something gets done something pertinent gets done that’s not

Always a criminal justice outcome I recognize um but have confidence in what will happen as a result hence why our focus on outcomes is is really important but they will always be the opportunity for us as politicians to argue what they truly mean but I think the sense of us

As a as the political and the operational driving towards improve it is is really really important and and I just very briefly about the point and I won’t touch on it because it it is a live matter some of the most serious crime happens in our community in Wester

Here just because we are a very low crime area doesn’t mean we don’t have the most serious and that is a bigger challenge uh for places like West Mercy but what it does mean is not only do we have some of the highest um capabilities available to policing within West

Mercier police but also the effective nature of the way that we work with not only our regional colleagues across the West Midlands but also um across the country Chief you wanted to touch on thanks and uh thank you for raising that incident we don’t often pay tribute enough to our murder investigation unit

That covers the whole of uh West Mercy and if we had time I would talk through several murder trials and as you know uh there is an ongoing investigation into the homicide in morvin over Christmas 69 Community speedwat schemes uh currently in werer um and increasing and only this

Week um the commissioner and I spoke about more true cam cameras that allow our neighborhood teams to operate better to tackle uh speeding crimes in uh speeding offenses in areas where it’s normally quite tricky to catch speeding motorists and finally your point in relation to Crime I am comparing like

With like so police reported crime against police reported crime otherwise we have the National Crime survey of England and Wales that gives us the self-reported crime and we can look at both um in fact both show reductions in certain crime types and increases in others and you’ll be unsurprised to know

Crimes associated with fraud and online sexual exploitation uh have significantly increased across the country over the last decade councilor Marshall thank you chair um I was really pleased to to hear that you’ve got much better um numbers of officers now um but I wanted to specifically hello I wanted

To specifically um discuss the retention recruitments and your current numbers of pcsos I work very closely with the pcsos in my safer neighborhood teams um and also whil whil I’ve I’ve got you just wanted to say I’m really impressed with inspector field and uh because he’s really been fantastic at engaging with

Me on issues in in my award so thank you so um sorry I I lost you I couldn’t find you couldn’t find you in the crowd but you you are so the last B Point pcsos uh we have seen through a Relentless focus on getting our uplift

Officer numbers to a level because there is a financial penalty if we don’t maintain it has meant uh that pcso numbers have di slightly we see around the 20 vacancies that are being worked on by the force to uh to to fill there’s a course that’s uh either just finished

Running or is is currently currently running and those pcses will be out in their Community pcsos are vitally important to me they don’t carry crime they don’t respond to emergencies uh in that sense so therefore they are out there doing what they were intended to do uh when they started 20 years ago

Which is out there visible in our community acting as those uh Community problem solvers uh we recognize that we have seen a dip in in the numbers very slightly um uh just about 10% or so uh but there is a plan to to see it recover in relation to retention um we are

Seeing a change in in what we do in life so whilst everybody uh majority of people would join policing for 30 years and that would be it um obviously police officers work a little longer now through to some of the pension changes uh we have different aspirations in life

As well so uh young people joining a career might want might not want to do that for three or four decades um so we are seeing um some perhaps changes in retention than we would see but one thing I will draw out and it’s a question for us as policing sector not

Just in West Mercia is those uh who we’ve worked hard to recruit from communities who might not have been represented in police ranks uh the rate to which they might be leaving uh or indeed not staying within policing and I think that says a lot about the societal

Change and indeed the cultural change within West Mercier police not only around gender but also around ethnicity and background of some of those offic because I want to make sure and and the chief and I are both committed is to ensuring that West merci police is representative of the community we serve

And there is some question as to whether or not our retention in some of our communities um is good enough thank you very much we’re going to just take three more questions if that’s okay um with you both um councelor Allen yes good good morning thank you

Chair uh good morning to you both thank you for coming Upton toown Council uh and the residents have long had um a a a concern about the traffic that goes through old Street which is the a414 the main fare through Upton and it has been a long held wish to actually

Get that road changed to a b Road and have weight restrictions put upon it now every time we’ve looked at this issue we’ve been told well we’ve got to get the police on board so I can’t offer you a ride around in the police car but can

I ask you John if you will um come and actually talk to myself and the Upton Town Council with the relevant officers to actually look at a way of resolving this problem thank you so uh what I I resist the temptation to draw the chief in because I know he has particularly

Strong views about uh Upton town center and indeed how we support uh how we support vehicle movements through it but I I would suggest you there’s lots of buck passing sometimes between public bodies isn’t there we can’t do X because other organization won’t do y let me be

Clear W Count Council own the highway and they can do with it within the regulation what they like they will consult Partners around issues and sometimes Partners will say unless you do a certain thing um uh you won’t see then enforcement action as a result for example and that doesn’t mean say it

Would stop them do it it just means that it’s not going to have the intended outcome but happily come to Upton and and discuss the matter um I know there are highways officers in in the room and I’m sure um uh before then some discussion can be had as to what the

Real blocker is about the change that you and the residents want to see thank you councelor Elizabeth a thank you um chief officer and commissioner for coming to the council today I have four very quick easy questions for you to answer um in relation to vas data you were talking

About Community speed watch you’ll be aware that most Villages have now invested heavily in vas signs in relation to vast data how do you use it uh and do you use it secondly would two vas signs strategically placed on fish Hill reduce your Manpower costs uh in

This area if so would you fund 50% of them and what what would you do uh with the information from these signs if they were put up I was very nearly disappointed chairman because I thought the question wasn’t going to involve fish Hill but um

I I think I I think there are a number of points in there it perhaps might be better for an offline conversation because Council Miss of course willing to participate in any coalition to uh to solve the problem including with some resources at fish so happily have that conversation offline that’s L

McVey oh thank you chair and thank you both for coming and allowing me the opportunity to ask this question um you’ve mentioned violence against women and girls and domestic violence’s priorities so I’d like to ask what the current fun current and F future funding arrangements are for specialist organizations supporting those fleeing

Domestic abuse and coming to terms with rape and sexual abuse um sometimes many years after the crimes have been committed thank you so a super complex question as you would imagine councelor mcve so the the the important bit is more money going into it so continue to put more

Resources uh into it I won’t be able to do it justice in an answer here but if it’s uh if it’s suitable to I set out in writing all of the strands because not only is it uh funding I provide around restorative services and preventative Services services that the uh the chief

Conable delivers directly but also services that through government money uh the third sector also also provides so I can provide and do justice uh if I write to directly thank you very much I’d like to just thank the commissioner and also the chief consal for coming this morning it

Is very much appreciated uh and appreciate you’re very busy um and members that haven’t had the opportunity to ask their questions the commissioner has agreed um that he can provide answers to you in writing so please do get in contact with him thank thank you very

Much we now move to agenda item number six which is the fire and rescue Authority please turn to Pages 3 to 10 in your agenda I’d like to welcome Jonathan price the Chief Fire officer who is with us this morning in a few moments I will invite councelor kit

Taylor to present the report councelor Taylor as the chairman of the fire and rescue Authority will answer any questions on the function of the authority and the Chief Fire officer will answer any questions about the any operational matters I intend to invite questions on the report on a page by

Page basis with the agreement of group leaders in the view of the amount of business on today’s agenda I intend to allocate 30 minutes for questions should time run out councelor Taylor and Mr Price have kindly agreed to receive and answer any further questions in writing councelor Taylor

Thank thank you Mr chairman and thank you uh Council for allowing us to come here to present this report um I’d also like to um start by thanking all all the officers both in uniform and non-uniform uh they make my job very pleasurable uh and they’re very easy to work with and

They do make me look quite good every now and again I would also like the members of The Authority I’d like to thank them as well uh they work in a very apolitical way uh there are people that can ask one two awkward questions are they not councelor udal um and

Councelor bite um but it’s always in good humor nothing nasty and everything is done for the benefit of the the authority and the firefighters we’ve got 30 minutes for this item so I’ll assume you’ve you’ve all read uh the report uh I’m also um under the uh disadvantage following the

Extremely smooth delivery of John Campion uh that’s always a great disadvantage for anybody following him um you notice that we’re we’re we’re a service that’s that’s highly motivated uh and and forward moving we’ve got an emphasis on on on development of both our people um firefighters um as I say

Uniformed and un uniformed and over our facilities and you’ll notice our developments unlike hs2 are ACH being achieved um with regard to sort of the the building of our uh new fire stations and uh and Partnerships um if you Gallop through the the report you are Partnerships are a success and we are

Making a bit of a difference and our core strategies response protection and prevention are now embedded in the psyche of of our firefighters and um and I do get um residents phone me up every now and again saying how do we get a smoke alarm and I said it’s it’s on a

Website it’s on a link and that you will have a very nice firefighter coming out uh to talk to you um the Keef has written this about three times now because we were supposed to have brought this before before Christmas uh and you will notice that there is uh a section

Regarding our resource um consultation um and on the bottom is very very firmly written uh we do not rep propose closing any fire stations any review that we’re doing is for the benefits of the firefighters and of the authority and it’s a reinvesting of of of of money in

A better way at this stage I will shut up uh and um we’ll wait for your questions thank you very much starting with page three councelor Allan thank you very much uh good morning to you both um I’m over here yes well done um Upton has a uh retained firefighters and its fire

Station I I may be wrong but are we struggling to keep retained firefighters um and how much do do we actually pay them just to be available uh yeah this is is a really pertinent issue and plays very much into the resource view that uh the councelor

Has just outlined um this has been an issue uh for many many years the retention and recruitment of retained or on call Firefighters uh it’s a growing issue nationally I’m aware of about 20 Fire and Rescue Services across the UK speaking to other Chiefs who who are

Probably going to be taking some quite radical action uh far more radical than than the one I’m proposing uh currently uh they are paid it is a paid role an uncal firefighter uh they earn about 10% of a firefighter salary as they’re retaining fee and they’ll earn uh on top

Of that for hourly work at the same rate as a full-time firefighter they’re average earnings uh across the border and we have 370 Encore staff across her and wer share and their average earnings is around £6,000 that varies depending on how busy they are uh the organization

Cost is around £99,000 £10,000 per head um so it is a paid role uh the issue amongst it is is that it is uh it’s an individual that has got to have some real commitment and and the challenge is being within around 5 minutes of living

Or working in the fire station so this splits us into two areas that pose a significant issue is day cover when people are generally at work uh and the changes to the employment sector uh if you take Upton as an example there’ll probably be more businesses that are now

Uh find it very challenging to allow somebody to walk out the door at a moment’s notice it may bring their production to a stop where perhaps 20 30 years ago that wasn’t the case uh you also find a lot of businesses are running with individuals rather than teams therefore again the business would

Have to shut so these are real challenges to employers and we’ve uh I was very fortunate when I took over as the chief officer around three years ago to get full support of the authority in an invest to improve campaign of which a million pound has been scheduled and

We’re we’re partway through a program to really improve the marketing Recruitment and Retention of oncore firefighters but the evidence we have is showing us how incredibly challenging it is to recruit and retain and and some of the issues I think the PCC outlined around changes in societal attitudes and people people do

Move around a lot more now people have different jobs people have different focuses in their life around their social time therefore some of the individuals I went to see an individual in her here last year who retired after 44 years and two days service as an non-al firefighter those individuals are

Are going to get getting less and less and less um I think Upton uh will always you know every Encore station has challenges but we’re very seriously investing in making sure that those first Encore fire engines um have got the crews that they need um and and that is battling against employ employers

Requirements and and the changes of people’s attitudes really in society and their ability the one thing we have found I would say around uh 10 to 20 years ago we employed under 300 oncore staff we’ve now got 370 oncore staff but we actually have slightly lower availability uh we need to employ more

People doing Less hours those people who would have given us perhaps 100 plus hours cover a week are now only willing to give us 60 70 80 hours cover a week so so to do the same job we need more people and that very much one of the challenges that’s played into the

Resource review is the affordability of the amount of onore fire engines that we have um hence I’m trying to rationalize that and reinvest that money elsewhere in the organization thank you there be no further questions on page three going to move to page four ccor denim thank you very much um um

Interested in the cultural um improvements um pleased to see where they occur um because equality diversity and inclusion is is really really important and we’ve um been on a a a more profound than some people realize in terms of how an organization Works how you relate to customers and so on um

A couple of questions on the back of that I’m intrigued as to why it requires a specialist bespoke um training program you know there are um you know the local government Association for example has you know really good programs that um are very helpful for the public sector

Um and then the second is actually around um relationships um with the staff and with the trade unions as sort of Trade union Representatives as to how that that is sort of currently as part of the culture of the organization um to answer your first question then or or really to give a

More General answer I’m I I think members of the Fire Authority are as well we’re incredibly proud of the culture of Herford and W to Fire and Rescue service and uh just over a year ago some of the national reports that emerged around police forces and in particular around London fire brigade uh

I think it’d be fair to say horrified us uh and and for myself as a chief officer having served 32 years in the fire and rescue service in three different services including London Fire Service many years ago having been in Herford and wer for 23 years I I felt confident

We were in a good place uh I needed to be sure about that uh so part of doing our independent cultural review where we had Dr Deborah Willoughby uh C give us give us a really in-depth cultural View and she’s a very very experienced in

That area uh it it was a pleasing report and the report is published on the website I’d welcome anyone uh members to read it uh I wanted to be Keen Ure that we did didn’t have institutional problems that when uh staff do have issues and I will be honest 760 staff

Issues occur people do do uh sometimes unacceptable things therefore it’s important I know I have an organization that is is free to report it does report it and that we take the appropriate action and generally speaking the feedback we’ve had uh from many hundreds of our staff and from the Independent

Report is that we are an organization that sets clear standards has clear values and will take appropriate action uh when these things go wrong so that was a really pleasing position to be in um before those reports came out uh nearly two years ago now we commissioned

A process where it was at my request to go to an external bespoke contractor um firstly I think the fire service uh is and I suppose everybody thinks they’re slightly different but I’m fairly confident to say that when you have a uniformed organization that has a quazi militaristic background based on the

Navy uh there are some some probably Legacy cultures and Legacy behaviors that needed to be understood in order to drive our culture and Val values in the right direction um we had also tried using a number of those tools over many years and I think a lot of the tools uh

Available to help improve EDI in the workplaces um didn’t really impress me I’m going to be honest I think they’re quite stale if if I’m really honest uh what I wanted was something that really got to the heart of my staff as to what motivates them how and why they behave

The way they do sometimes uh and to do that we we we went out to Tender and have got a really high quality uh organization to come in and everybody and the Fire Authority members had a session with the company we’re using at the last Fire Authority meeting the

Senior leadership team myself included have all had the session first and foremost before it’s gone to any of our staff um and that was because we wanted to make sure we also steered it to make sure we felt it was right but also make sure we were the first ones to receive

That that training and we’ve now rolling it out across the organization and what I know I have a guarantee of by using an expert bespoke provider is I have a a superb product that is being delivered to a high standard to every single member of Staff by people who will

Objectively look at their behaviors during that training and give us further feedback as to where they think we might have some issues so I think the merits of that expenditure uh uh will will pay us back tenfold I’m very pleased about that uh relationships with the staff

Have been really really positive we have carried out a staff survey in the last 12 months um and again I would urge counselers to look at it it is published on the website we have that independently commissioned um and I have to say as a chief officer uh uh my level

Of smugness over the survey was was as high as it probably is going to be in my fire service career um the company that commissioned it also compare us to a vast number of other private and public sector organizations and we were we were tragically 1% off being in the top

Quartile of all those organizations which is actually very rare for anyone in the public sector to achieve that uper threshold we had a response rate from our staff that far exceeded the national and normative averages and actually the content of the feedback in the vast majority of areas showed a

Staff engagement and a group of Staff who were were very supportive of the service wanted to be in the organization would recommend working for Herford and wer far rescue service to other people all of that information is publicly and has been publicly available um as always

We we do have challenges with our trade unions and sometimes I think the behaviors of the trade unions uh I find very personally and I know my officers find very very challenging however on the whole we deal with a range of trade unions uh we have regular engagement

With all those trade unions um and on the whole we have a sometimes combative but but but certainly I think healthy relationships uh would be the way I would position it thank you still on page four councilor Victory thank you chairman and uh thank you for coming along this morning um I’m

Concerned that the plan includes the removal of the second fire engine at mvin fire station now I’ve been there long enough to remember at least one fire on the Hills that took hold in summer and seriously threatened houses in mulvin Wells given that more extreme weather events are uh becoming more

Frequent and that the delay in getting additional support could be fatal I’d be very grateful if you consider this very carefully when making your decisions uh around the provision of fire engines in morvin thank you obviously the resource review is is is relatively complex and again I would

Urge all councilors to take the opportunity to read the report that has been published uh which has got an incredible amount of detail on the rationale behind this to give members assurances and to to repeat uh some of the things that that that Council Taylor has said is we’re not removing reducing

Or changing or reducing the first fire engine in any of those Lo locations and actually mulen is the recipient of around a £200,000 annual uplift in crewing and Staffing in their fire engine their first fire engine which is currently being undertaken as we speak this month so they are getting extra

Staffing and extra allowances to improve the resilience and the uh number of crew on the first fire engine at mulvin uh mulvin itself uh has got I’ve got all the data available they actually attend around 200 fires in rtc’s per year and the second fire engine has relatively

Low availability and low usage um I believe uh where we have got those instances where these additional second third or fourth fire engines have very low usage and low levels of availability linked to the challenges of recruiting encal staff uh 51% uh of of residents within uh 5 minutes of Molin fire

Station are over 65 years of age uh that obviously and I’m not saying that people who are over 65 cannot be on call Firefighters but you would understand that many people at that stage of life may not wish to or be able to be on call Firefighters so that severely limits uh

The pool of people we have uh to to recruit uh so this is a rationalization and a review this is an injection of resources back into the front line to employ more whole time firefighters and to release resources and capacity to be able to support the enle fire engines um

I also probably actually I think I was a station officer in attendance at the fire you talk about on the mulvin Hills a number of years ago what I would say is two fire engines in mulvin is is a drop in the ocean you you need 10 15

Fire engines for those type of incidents and they will come from all the other stations around that’s absolutely normal when we have any L incidents and I would say uh and pay particular congratulations and thanks to the mulvin hills conservators they are a key factor

In to why we are not having and have not recently had even in the very dry summer uh of I’m going to say two years ago but that feels a bit strange in January around 18 months ago um they do a fantastic job the conservators in grazing down and managing the hills now

So the the instances and likelihood of such a severe fire up there I think is dramatically reduced and uh and and I hope they continue to do the Sterling work that they do thank you I certainly hope you’re right thank you very much there be no further questions on page four we move

To page five no questions on page five we move to page six there be no questions on page six we move to page seven councelor fry thank you chair good to see you JP any um uh as you uh will be uh uh aware of Reddit fire Stasia uh looks

Absolutely gorgeous at the moment it’s come in nicely uh in my division and and councilor Marshall’s division as well um where do you expect it going when it would be operational and and and what can how how will uh reddic be benefited by having a brand new fire station to replace at old

Friend thank you thank you councelor fry first you can I say I’m really disappointed that I didn’t receive a question on page five about my fantastic HMI result with no erors required Improvement uh I clearly fail politically not to prime one of one of the members to to ask me a question

On that so so I’m going to I’m going to take the opportunity of using councelor Fri question to to VA my my the very very pleasing result we received in December last year uh from the inspectorate having no areas requiring Improvement I may say that several times

Uh but to answer your question uh firstly uh myself and the Fire Authority I know are incredibly proud uh of the property program we have uh redich and Herford fire station have been talked about as I know you will recall for probably well in excess of 20 to 25

Years uh I pleased that we finally are the Fire Authority and the chief officer uh that is getting these projects delivered delivered um in conjunction with the police and crime commissioner we are building a very large and uh highly invested in in facility in Reddit uh it’s well underway I think it looks

Fantastic and I’m very very proud and very pleased certainly that my staff working at redit fire station will have the latest upto-date uh really high quality uh facilities I’m anticipating from our perspective the go live um is is relatively flexible because we are still in the fire station on the site

And we don’t need to vacate that fire station until the new facility so um there were some delays due to some environmental issues on the site um I’m not going to pin my colors to the mask on an exact goli date now uh I I want the building to be right and working

Properly for my staff the police have a higher level of urgency as as Reddit councilors will know to move into that property uh than perhaps we do we can we can softly move across and then eventually we will exit our station which will be demolished and handed over

Um the benefits for me will be firstly uh we always see an up uptick in the culture the behavior the morale uh of those staff working when they’re in a building that they can they can really feel uh Vue respect rather than one that I would suggest at the moment is an old

Friend but somewhat a dilapidated old friend uh I also think that uh the closer working and collaboration with the police on site there uh will will produce uh benefits to Reddit I think being able to work in the same building and socialize and discuss some of the community safety issues around my

Prevention and protection agenda will re reap benefits from that and that’s not just the firefighters that’s the officers and having the additional space there that some of my community teams can go and work out of Reddit and have that that work uh so on the whole uh I

Think it’s a really good news story I’m really pleased about the investment finally for Reddit um and that really actually only leaves a strit witch fire station from our full-time occupied sites that that hasn’t been refurbished or rebuilt and that one is on the agenda that is that is for further down the

Road um subject to Capital financing still on page seven councelor Elizabeth a just to congratulate the Chief Fire officer on his uh results from his HMI inspection uh but also to thank him for the Broadway fire station uh which is shortly to be opened and hope that that uh that

Opening would be some what of a community event uh because it may be a way of encouraging more retained officers in the area so thank you for that yeah thank you Council very very pleased to get Broadway uh a bill again that’s another station for many many

Years that was in a poor state of repair and I’m really pleased that that this Authority has managed to deliver a new Broadway fire station and and obviously publicizing it through our oncore marketing and engagement team uh as a place to come and work for residents and

Employees around the uh Broadway area is absolutely something we want to do I would point out to members that uh they’ll you’ll all be aware of the uh I think the term would be excruciating and eye watering Rising costs of building properties uh we have been hit by that

Across uh all of the builds we’re currently undertaking uh across Herer and werer uh that does have a bit of a dent in the capital program and I think you members will note that I mention on the second paragraph from the bottom on page seven about my intention to try and

Relocate our training center from drit wit to W Forest again because of some of the pressures we’ve got on our Capital program for some of the uh priority builds that may be uh delayed a short while uh but again it is all subject to the capital program thank you still on page seven

Are there any further questions moving on to page eight councilor Stokes thank you yes um this question could have been asked on page three or uh six or but I’ve chose page eight um you mentioned earlier on about the wide ranging skills that your retain fire

Officers have and how many you have but there is a reduction in hours do they have an opportunity to specialize in which uh incident they actually attend because I would imagine I I pick up on the the skills required for water-based uh or Riverside attendance so more more rescue so I would have

Assumed there would have been a different skill set for fires and a different skill set for for roadside uh Road road traffic collision so do the retained fire officers have an opportunity to for one of a better word specialize thank you yeah thank you councel really good question um I try

And describe this as best I can I suppose this was this was my realization uh when I joined the fire service the best way I can describe a firefighter is they’re they’re the Swiss army knife uh so that they’ve all got a set number of of tools and blades in them and that

Would include going to road traffic collisions going to hazardous material chemical inance and I’m sure many members in the room maybe wouldn’t be quite so sighted councilor Dorma would of course but uh many members would not be cited on the the incredible skill range that a firefighter has to have uh

And and I would pay tribute to anyone who is a firefighter for for what they have to undertake in the amount of learning they do have to as a as a base firefighter be able to go to water instance and that’s to work near the

Water safely they do have to be able to undertake Fires Road Traffic listens hazardous materials incidence gaining entry breaking in there there’s a whole range of on certain stations there will be specialist functions now water again with the support of the Fire Authority and and I would thank them once again

For this uh since 2007 when we had the severe and acute floods and I was involved as a senior commander in those floods we we’ve learned and built I think uh probably the best water response fire service in the UK and I’m willing to to have a little battle with

My other Chief Fire officer colleagues around the country about that if they so wish because they’ll lose uh we we have got we have got three boat stations Herford wer Anan we have got uh also at w at wi Forest we have Sara voluntary responders based on our fire station and

Responding from there and then we had what is in between firefighters who can work near the water and the boats there is a function in the middle which we call water first responder which is firefighters wearing dry suits that can weigh into the water and they have a

Raft and they can Ferry people out that has become the most used part of what we do around vehicles in flood water which is a particular problem I was discussing with John Fraser and we have a great working relationship with Worcester County over there um and and a number of other incidents

About going supporting residents you don’t need a big rescue boat you need firefighters that can enter the water usually up to chest Steep and go and support uh the authority has supported me in funding that every single fire station in wer and herir will have a water first responder capability the

Only other fire service I know I think that’s ever done it in the UK was Lincoln sheare um I think they thought the North Sea was going to flood the the entire County um perhaps uh but uh we’re extending sending that across to every single location we had it strategically

Located we had about 17 teams I think we we will be moving up to having 25 teams that is a specialist function but we actually become part of every single fire station not necessarily every firefighter but we have got those specialisms yes and five Uncle

Firefighters take them on in a in a vast range of skill areas sorry long answer to a short question thank you councelor Allen yes thank you um I I note you’re talking uh on here uh page eight protection fire safety I’ve had a long uh career with

Fire alarms running my own fire alarm company I’m now retired and something that’s always frustrated me is as you walk through Worcester City uh up and down the streets that you’ll find lots of pubs restaurants and other properties have fire alarms with faults on them or even dead is this something that your

Officers look at as part of their inspection process or or should somebody else be looking at at this to make sure that they actually get the fire alarm working to protect the people who who frequent these premises so so to be um to give you an

Analogy on this uh it isn’t the police Force’s job to check your car is safe it’s the responsible person’s job to make your sure your car is roadworthy safe the tires are working you have anot that’s exactly the same as a firearm system it is the responsible person’s

Job uh it’s not our role to go out and catch people find them however if it’s reported to us my officers will respond they will go out and we will take enforcement action uh equally when we carry audits out more than inspections nowaday moving away as we did 20 plus

Years ago from a fire certification process to a risk assessment based process uh we will of course uh advise people and we will be giving them the appropriate advice uh I have a limited number of inspectors and and obviously we have got tens and tens of if not hundreds of thousands of commercial

Buildings uh therefore the law is very clear of the responsible person’s Duty as I said if anyone spots it and reports it to us my officers will respond they will go out and we will take appropriate enforcement the alarm is not repaired and functioning if we believe there was

A life risk such as a sleeping risk then we would be able to impose immediate enforcement action that would prohibit the use of the building and and my officers do clearly with growing numbers of alarm systems that you would understand are pretty much everywhere now um it it it would be impossible for

My officers to keep on top of all of it uh but yeah we certainly would respond and it is the resp responsible person’s job to make sure their alarm is functioning or they are in breach of the fire safety act councelor McVey thank you chair and congratulations Chief there is much to

Be celebrated in this report um my question is um around climate change and I’m pleased to see climate change referenced in the report and the operational um approaches and adaptation of appliances and equipment is being uh instigated so my question is how will you ensure that uh your future fit in

Terms of reacting to The Climate emergency thank you so it’s in our community risk management plan but I I personally I’m very passionate about this and and I see it from two stances the first one is referenced earlier in the paper as a public sector organization uh with the

With over 25 base locations across two counties spending taxpayers money it’s our job to to have to minimize and reduce our in our impact on the environment and you will see that upt to one 7 and T fire station have now moved to all electric and we’ve used grant

Money and we have a process in place in our environmental sustainability plan to improve our impact with regards to waste water and and carbon footprint and other other areas so I’m very passionate we pursue that clearly it’s difficult for me to get away from 18 ton lorries I’m

Afraid so I I just have to do the best I can on those at the moment uh and I’m sure somebody may ask about electric fire engines but can we take that discussion outside of this room it’s not really a viable option right now um with

Regards to to to to the impact you’ve already seen one example there the response of making every fire station and have the water Force responder capability is a response to climate change we recognize that flooding is more frequent around our counties now uh we also are very fortunate we’ve

Invested very heavily in improving our capability around wildfires uh a number of years ago we we invested very carefully in making sure uh you’ll see quite often I refer to four-wheel drive vehicles and and I am doing an interview with the BBC this afternoon who took

That to say we’re going to have off-road vehicles everywhere actually this is about maintaining a road-based capacity through severe weather events flooding and snow our fire engines are very resilient around being able to respond uh through snow in particular um so we we’ve looked at all the kind of weather

Phenomenons we’re likely to face uh and we’ve invested heavily in all those areas I’m very fortunate to have an officer that transferred in from greater Manchester who is a national lead on wildfires as well which has been really helpful to the service uh I would say the demographics and the farming nature

Of our service we are actually quite less prone to wildfires than perhaps some of the bigger mland areas um but I feel we’re well prepared I feel we are are we are focused on it as a fire and rescue service um we’re very well versed in flooding sadly across Wester here and

Herford here uh and and that’s kind of second nature to us now uh we just need to keep an eye on the rest of the changes and the frequency and impact of weather events and make sure that your fire and rescue service can respond as you need us to councelor

Denim thank you very much yeah my question relates to um fire protection and building inspection um within my division um I have the former Meb building in blackpole um which is now residential um and it’s my understanding that it’s got the same cladding or very similar to grenal Tower um which

Obviously is is a risk in itself um I mean how many uh potential kind of grenal tower type buildings do we have in Worcester with regard to high to my knowledge one and it’s the one you’ve referred to uh the others don’t fall into we we were very very clear on post

Grandell reviewing and looking at those premises uh I would say that the the building you refer to is highrise I would say just it’s six stories it isn’t highrise in in in my in in the true sense although it does qualify the other thing uh the two mitigating factors with

That building is it’s twin staircase one at each end therefore that enables residents to escape very quickly from either end we’ve done a lot of work with the residents to make sure that that the plans are in place and that the building is being managed effectively uh and actually what’s interesting with that

Cladding on there is it’s intermittent it’s not solid over the whole building it’s in panels therefore the the spread would react we behave quite differently to a Gro scenario but obviously the legislation and the uh process around managing replacing that isn’t a fire service issue that’s that’s to do with

The building owners and local Authority uh I’m confident that we have everything in place we need to we have a potential increased attendance if there was an incident there um and I I’ve see lots of scaffolding up around it so I wasn’t sure recently whether it was being being

Removed but I I could be wrong on that having just driven driven past not too long ago um I know that many buildings around the UK are obviously receiving some of the remed remedial action but uh we we only have uh 10 high-rise buildings across the whole of Herford

And Worcester which is which is very very small and I think three of them are scheduled to be demolished in the not too distant future um I’m no Richard not yours I’m pleased to say uh I believe in the kidderminster area uh but yeah we’re well versed with that what I would say

Is the the effect of insulation and insulating panels is wider than highrise so because we have proportionately to many other Farm Rescue Services very low amounts of highrise we have started to do some work to explore um how insulation is being used and and that’s a national issue about the fire service

Being able to keep up with changes in technology which is what they are for all the right reasons we want our buildings well insulated we need to as a fire service work out and that’s very rapidly change in how we respond and our part in that and particular in recycling

Industry that’s a challenge for us councelor bis thank you Mr chairman um um John I’d like to ask about um uh Fords uh in my Division I have one one of these rather unusual Antiquated um Ford Crossings shellford in my case um which people continue to try to uh uh

Navigate during High uh water incidents and floodings U and which continue to uh to lead to No Doubt to uh your your officers having to attend and rescue people what would is there more that we could do as an authority do you think would blocking them uh in some

Way barrier in them uh at times of high high water rise be a an option that would provide greater safety to uh uh because they they continue and tragically you have seen in in Herford and worcester’s case over the years uh we have had deaths in in uh forward

Crossings do you have a recommendation or thoughts on what we could do to make them uh safer for uh the traveling public yeah thank you councelor my laughter at the beginning by the way was not the the tragic incidence and the tragedy afford but as councelor bis is

Aware uh I didn’t force him to but my deputy chief now lives within about 300 yards of that Ford uh so I’m not sure I can do much better with regards to to response and Protection cover than put my deputy chief on duty over the Ford uh

How however as I would say uh I was discussing this earlier uh uh with John praa um yes I do I I do honestly think we can do better I I think within uh Worcester sheare I think we can identify those risk areas and I think we can

Permanently lock gate and close them during periods of flooding uh I think the time has come to seriously consider that uh I know highways may have some concerns and considerations around permanent infrastructure I’m really comfortable that the fire and rescue service can work with highways to manage

The Locking and closing similar to a snow Gates effect I don’t think we’d want lockdown across our roads CU clearly there would be be some roadways that um farm machinery can get through in the flooding but cars cars can’t and if you were to lock that road that may

Impact on agricultural industry however I believe the forge you talk about is is a great example where when it is uh close to uh you know six seven feet deep in water and we still have got people trying to drive through it um it is another fatality waiting to happen I’m

Afraid I think where we know where those hot spots are it would be a really good opportunity for Worcester County to to select a couple of areas we don’t need to go go go crazy and pick lots and lots of roads and I think some permanent infrastructure there similar to a snow

Gates philosophy to be locked during times of flooding uh would definitely reduce uh the the drain on fire and rescue rescue resources during extreme flooding and I would comment that that cars in roadways and flooded uh cars being um washed away in roadways is probably I’d have to check the data is

Is probably one of our highest instances that we go to now during flooding uh so much so that all the firefighters who are walk First Responders go to a facility in Cardiff where they’ve actually put a car in Rapid flood water for my my staff to train on because we

Know we’re going to go to so many cars in flood uh in flood water and it is a very serious risk to to our communities and it does seem to be in modern times now uh people are unable to change their habits and if they drive on that road

Every day I think they still feel they can continue to do so when it’s submerged in water and I would strongly recommend against that but thank you Council yes I do think we can do more and I do think we should take a couple of those Brave steps to to put some

Permanent fixtures in to to shut down those areas when we need to councelor Chris thank you following on from a discussion on Fords I’d like to have a discussion on uh Teslas as uh uh some of my residents who uh who are looking towards electric vehicles are concerned

About uh some of the publicity on electric vehicles Catching Fires and I just wondered whether there has been any uh issues within weria and uh uh and whether that should be something that people take into consideration ghost to coun PO yeah this is this is an interesting one nationally

And I’m going to take it a little bit wider than I certainly wouldn’t pick on one manufacturer uh there there are many electric car manufacturers what you’re talking about there is lithium battery thermal runaway as it’s termed um and I would say the risks at the moment I

Believe there was a media article in the ear about 6 this morning to do with London fire brigade and some of fatalities they have suffered through uh battery thermal battery runaway uh I would argue perhaps uh electric scooters uh certain other thermal uh lithium batteries in smaller amounts that we

Have in our homes uh that we charge with W with various qualities of charges and quality of batteries we actually have them by our bedside I would argue that perhaps those batteries are the ones we should be slightly more worried about than the vehicles parked outside um cars

Have always caught fire I’m going to be really clear about that I started my career on the edges of West London where the the number of carire incidents we were going to off the M25 was was you know multiple times per per shift sometimes so all cars Catch Fire I I

Would not highlight electric cars as being the particular culprit of this all cars Catch Fire the recent incident in veder that was referred to earlier um I don’t believe the car that ignited of that to start with was an electric vehicle I think it was more of a

Traditional style of vehicle so all cars Catch Fire And there are some wider implications to car Parks now with cars having higher fuel loadings uh plastic fuel tanks that melt and will obviously spread quicker there’s a number of issues where legislation is behind the curve on this and that’s that’s

Affecting everyone in the UK with regards to electric cars yes when they do Catch Fire they do pose a particular issue because it is a lithium battery that is a runaway fire there’s absolutely no doubt the severity and the issues of tackling that fire are much

Much harder um I think the fire and rescue service in its entirety we are being uh challenged more and more it would be very easy for me to uh be negative about the issues that an electric car fire causes us but I do take a strategic wider issue about the

Benefits of electric vehicles in society and and the country’s demand to move to more environmental and more sustainable approaches to transport um and the fire and rescue service shouldn’t be a barrier to that however it’s only right and proper that we advise people of the challenges and we put safeguards in

Place uh recently we’ve been working with counselors across werer around battery energy storage system they pose a very similar issue around lithium runaway fires and we have been advising and put on our website some of the things that we think need to be considered uh not as a barrier but need

To be considered around that but yes an electric car fire uh will cause us a lot more challenges we’ll burn more severely but I would say cars have always caught fire in my experience um it’s just electric ones will be a little bit more severe uh and potentially spread quicker

More quickly sorry uh and that is just another challenge uh I would also point out many of the large incidents that we’ve attended in recent years um a couple recently in kinster and many around the county of wer around the recycling industry again that doesn’t mean recycling is bad uh but with this

Emerging technology comes challenges around fires thank you very much unfortunately we have run out of time for questions on this report and I have already extended it by 10 minutes um I would just like to um thank um councelor Taylor and also U Mr price for coming along um this

Morning it is very much appreciated and could I just take this opportunity to once again on behalf of the County Council thank yourself and all of your officers for their hard work um over the recent months with the flooding incidents that we’ve experienced across the county thank you very much I now ask

Council to note the report thank you very much we now move to agenda item number 7A reports of cabinet matters which require a decision please turn to Pages 11 to 12 of your agenda I’ll now invite councelor Simon G leader of the council to introduce the report and move the recommendations in

Paragraph one councelor gerti thank you Mr chairman good morning Council and I’d Echo your words in terms of the the thanks to all of our staff across the county particularly those in uh in eii but I know in other areas that have had to respond to uh uh flooding recently

Over 200 premises across the county have been flooded and obviously I’ve gone out myself to um thank our staff to see their work uh in all hours uh and uh in all conditions but also to visit premises whether they residential or business premises they’re being affected by by devastating and more frequent

Flooding so uh their thoughts are with us today in terms of this report Mr chairman I’d move uh the recommendation has set out uh little one uh which is a variation to the capital program reason being that the capital program needs updating to reflect uh new money that we received additional funding particularly

In relation to schools and the basic need Grant and high needs provision Capital as and6 is there’s a whole list of schools there where we’re increasing our provision and um one of the previous speakers talked about uh the the eyering cost inflation in terms of uh some Capital schemes and we’re seeing that

Across uh all all elements of society where we’re building things but also uh where they’re being offset where we are re-evaluating need uh for um additional uh build or capacity um being able to mitigate that so uh mainly Mr chairman and colleagues uh this is in relation to school builds

Uh funded there are a few other uh alterations in terms of the capital program listed in little six but I would suggest that they’re relatively minor uh in terms of uh resources so I so move those uh additions and changes to the the capital program thank you and a second for that

Council onow thank you very much chair and good afternoon Council um yes uh very happy to Second as the bulk of the spend is um in my area of education and as my husband would attest I’m very good at spending money so thank you chair very happy to

Second thank you very much now going to open this item up to debate councelor Ott chair thank you um yeah obviously with the recommendation it talks about paragraphs 4 to six which are fairly clear um but with reference to the updated Capital program in appendix five

Um I’ve just had a look at appendix 5 and I can see the revised budgets for 20 for this year um and for the next three years and the total of those sums but I can’t see the original amount so what I just would like to know is what was the

Original capital budget for 2324 what is the variance compared with the revised and the same for the current year plus the the future three years if possible thank you thank you councilor gerti thank you Mr chairman uh we can provide that and we provide a written answer in terms of

The the various changes but what I would draw members to is the substantial changes are as listed because for open transparency reasons we if we were uh making major changes to the capital program we’ always list them in terms of those other ones will be about slippage

Across the years so not a change in commitment but a change in in spend as a result of a particular year but uh happy to provide all those because they will be published thank you councelor denim thank you very much um I mean unfortunately the nature of public

Sector Finance it’s somewhat opaque to the uninitiated or the inexpert um we have a we’ve got a report here that’s got a number of words in it the the key question is now that this is an increase in proposed capital expenditure as far as I can understand um are we borrowing

Money in order to deliver those Capital schemes and what is the revenue impact on that of that borrowing that’s the go to thank you Mr chairman and uh a fully revised Capital program will obviously come part as as part of the budget and so to answer the council question Lynn’s question uh

Directly the uh we’re making some minor adjustments as a result of additional income so I just want to specify that additional income from basic need Grant and high needs Capital as well as 106s and so we want to deploy that uh as part of the program uh there are some savings

And offsets uh which are in uh little five uh which we relate to because the capital program is always changing if you got a capital program some 372 million it’s always going to vary and adjust but I’d want to uh give that commitment that uh the overall uh thrust

Of the capital program is one that we deal with a budget setting and so decisions about deployment of capital uh be roads Pavements environmental features etc etc those would all be dealt with as part of that these are relatively small uh in the grand scheme of the capital program with 372 million

Additions or subtractions the capital program uh funded uh by the sources that are uh proposed basic need being in import important element which is is money we receive from government so that’s a a welcome addition all developer contributions 106 is uh that uh our planning committee uh members

Many of members on the this Council will sit on other councils that make decisions about planning applications uh and rightly think about education as part of that make allocations as part of that we want to utilize that uh for the right buildings and spend them within the right time because obviously 106 is

Sometimes come with a time limit in terms of develop contributions thank you there be no further speakers on this item councelor G do you wish to sum up I don’t think it’s required but I’d want to assure members that a full review of the capital PR has been undertaken for

Exactly the reasons that Lynn and other councils will will uh uh think and allude to um and that will be presented as part of the overall budget so the overall Capital program is an important aspect of the overall budget and that mix of funding and its relationship to

Borrowing is again something we all members will want to see as part of the final budget uh this is not in any attempt to uh to circumvent that it’s these are all schemes that were in the program and they’re they’re they’re changing their total slightly thank you very much now going

To take this to the vote all those in favor please indicate thank you that is a clear majority and the recommendation is agreed now going to move to agenda item 7B this report deals with decisions already taken by the cabinets and is on pages 13 to 20 I’d remind you that

Specific questions may be asked about items in this report this is an opportunity to ask relevant questions not make speeches on matters which have already been decided the report will be taken section by section and there’ll be no returning to previous sections questions will be restricted to a

Maximum of 2 minutes per item per counselor so please ask your questions clearly and concisely questions will be taken in batches of three if necessary written replies will be provided by the leader or the relevant Cabinet member starting with local nature recovery strategy being no questions moving on to the resources

Report there being no questions the new Fox lyot first school SCH there be no questions the expansion of car park at wers ship Parkway railway station councelor boat right green having used the facility I can safely say that I you know welcome the expansion of the car park but also from

The other side of it I also don’t want to drive there I’m actually quite Keen to use public transport I’ve had a lot of complaints from residents in pers about this in that we can often get there but can’t get back if we decide to

Drive or vice versa so is there a way of looking at integrated travel as part of expanding the car park because one of the things that people have raised is the idea that we actually are struggling to operate as a as a holistic kind of site where we’ve got the trains

Obviously we’ve got the car park and we’ve then obviously got the potential for the buses as well and at the moment it just feels like we’re almost being forced into driving and many of us would actually not want to councelor Udall no he’s you well I’m not

Sure I can answer that question but um just for clarity I’m doing questions in batches of three how you thank you um the the the Norton sorry the expansion of the car park at por Parkway rail station uh will the park park car park can be adequately priced to encourage

And enable park and ride into wora from this St something which was initially envisaged when the station was first conceived as a possibility uh something which would be certainly welcomed by a lot of people who would want to travel by train into the city center especially forget Street

Uh something which can’t possibly be done at the moment because the price is is actually being priced to prevent this from happening thank you there be no further questions on the expansion of the car park with SH Parkway councelor bis uh thank you uh Mr chairman um uh Park and

Ride why are we not standing anymore no they won’t be able to see your face they can’t see you on the thing thank you councelors councelor bis you know when your friends are they only say nice things about when when you’re dead here they won’t be saying it for a while

In my case I hope right uh can ride from persal interesting one of course because you can get on the the the train at persal if you want to go if you want to go to to uh and change at the uh at The Interchange that’s why it’s there I

Suppose um I I understand the point you’re making and I I yes it would be uh ideal to have a an interchange and we do have bus facilities clearly at the Parkway station so uh I I’ll look at any specific comments you’ve got around timings of those and happy to happy to

Look at those uh in terms of parking prices uh clearly uh this is a a discretionary activity and therefore uh in order for us to be able to afford to do this it’s not something that c many in fact this is one of we are one of the

Very few councils in the country who’ve invested in the to the scale we have in our in our transport uh uh train infrastructure in order to do that we have to make enough money to pay back the investment so it is a delicate balance between uh the affordability of

Parking and being able to afford the borrowing to be actually to able to improve the facilities Parkway itself is a is a fantastic achievement uh it is running at uh well well in excess of its uh its business case we’re looking at expanding the park car parking now uh uh

Uh in year three when actually we thought we the business case was based on a 50 this being the usage being at about year 15 so it’s a victim of its own success but I will look carefully at what we can do around pricing but I look forward to your continued support

Councelor udel on this on this measure normally you tell me we’re doing the right thing just in the wrong place so um I I I expect to for once you to be able to agree it was the right thing and it was in the right place than thank you very much moving on

To the developer funded highways infrastructure scrutiny report there been no questions moving on to adults prevention and early intervention strategy CC denim thank you um I mean I absolutely agree that prevention and early intervention is absolutely critical um on that basis why has in the past um this Authority taken money from the

Public health budget or expected savings to be delivered by the public health budget rather than actually fully investing in prevention thank you there be no further questions councelor Hardman well that’s an interesting accusation that we have misuse of Public Health ground I completely refute it thank you moving on to adult social

Care sorry councelor May sorry chairman I couldn’t wave my arms good afternoon um Council so the public health ring fence Grant is actually what it has on the tin we have around 31.8 million pounds of Public Health ring fence grant that has to be used for the outcomes of

Public Health across the whole of the county and is very closely monitored by public health England in terms of how we invest that money for the best outcomes and the enablement aspects of it so just to clarify that point thank you very much indeed thank you very much for that

Clarification moving on to adult social care strategy councelor Ott chair thank you um and I trust this does fit in with the strategy um I recently became aware that across the county um we have obviously have various Care Homes and nursing homes and a blend

Blend of both um but for people who are on low income and are struggling and are unable to provide any top up or other funding um to put relatives into care home I understand if they come to the council there are only two providers one

Is in Kitty Minster and the other is in stport and and I appreciate that adult social care there is similar to Children’s a lot of money is spent on the small percentage of the population but I just wonder with the current strategy are we are we sort of enabling

Our residents much Choice um because obviously if you live in the south of the county traveling to Kitty Minster or stort is a long way and if there are any plans to change that in in this strategy or whether that’s an ongoing situation thank you thank you very much there be

No further questions councelor Hardman um the basic as I’m afid to say I I we might be currently only using two two providers but we do review the whole range of providers we are because we’re determined to give the right service to the right individual at the

Right PR and so it is not a blanket policy but it is what is correct for the individual that drives us now admittedly I’m afraid and you know councelor um Allan has raised an issue where with me where people are having to travel long distances but it is the right place I’m

Afraid to put them thank you very much indeed moving on to Fair funding for schools 2024 sl25 coun abar thank you chair just to declare an interest my wife is the training teacher thank you thank you there be no further questions moving on to visit werer destination management plan councelor

Udor just a quick uh question chair uh does this plan include any opportunities for us to attract TV and film industry to werer to enable us to use and promote werer as a destination in film um broadcasting uh I’m aware that projects where films and televisions uh broad uh

Have been made in elsewhere has generated enormous amount of money for the local uh economy uh and this could be something an opportunity to encourage the industry to visit westshire and use it as a destination for their online filming thank you very much there be no further questions can councelor bis um

I’m surprised he doesn’t know the answer to this one we already have a werer uh film office which is promoting our beautiful uh County and its assets uh to uh both domestic and international uh uh producers and so yes absolutely it’s already H happening you will see us increasingly on the

Screens thank you very much thank you counselors thank you we’re now going to break for a 35 minute lunch break and we’ll be back here at 10 1 thank you e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e

E e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e

E e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e good afternoon Council we’re now going to move to agenda item 8A which is the political balance please turn to Pages 35 to 42 of the agenda papers that were sent

Separately I’ll invite councelor Simon gerti to introduce the report and move the recommendations in paragraph one councelor GTI thanks Mr chairman uh it’s a report following a change of one member uh Bill Hopkins who’s left our group uh to uh take his seat as an independent uh and uh obviously is

Entitled in terms of political balance to rain two two seats on the council so the proposal is to stay as as we are in the sense of changing the political balance but in terms of the seats appointed that bill would remain on the uh committees that he’s on planning

Regulatory and waste credit and governance uh so I just move that particular aspect of the the recommendation Mr chairman thank you very much councelor Hart uh thank you very much indeed Mr chairman I’ll formally second that recommendation and reserve my right to speak should it become necessary thank you very much now going

To open this item up to debate is any member wishing to speak please raise your hand there being none councelor G do you wish to sum up I don’t think it’s required Mr chairman nice and easy councelor heart you reserved your right to speak how long have I got Mr chair

Nothing to add 30 seconds thank you very much uh now going to take this to the vote all those in favor please indicate that is a clear majority thank you very much now move to agenda item 8 B please send to Pages 36 of the agenda papers which were also sent separately

Councilor gy thank you Mr chairman uh this is the appointment of uh member to the r IRP panel uh as members will remember back uh at the last meeting we appointed one uh new member of the panel but we weren’t able to complete those uh obviously the appointments are formally

Made by Council but on the recommendations of officers uh members can see the the terms of panel members uh and there’s uh one person following the uh selection process that has been put forward and recommended uh Paul Stefan novic uh and uh I so move that we

Appoint him to the panel to the 30th of November 2027 um we will be undertaking some new recruitment of panel members and I just want to assure members across the chamber that uh we very much and I spoke to Paul and officers afterwards about how we redouble our efforts to have a

More diverse panel I think it was Lyn who made the point last time so we will need to do that in terms of recruitment of uh new members but obviously we have a member that very much in terms of skills and experience the officer cor Fields can under take the role and uh

That’s why I’m so moving in terms of this recommendation it is also important uh that we do get going as a panel uh the IP does need to meet and it does need to produce a report uh in a relatively short period of time thank you very much and a second

For that recommendation councelor Hart uh thank you very much indeed Mr chairman again I’ll formally second the recommendations and reserve my right thank you now going to open this item for debates en I just have to say I mean there are there’s not a single qualified woman in the county that can

Fulfill this role I really don’t believe that’s the case no this is not a representative panel that represents the population of wor sure nor represents you know it is about independent remuneration of members um and we have much di a greater diversity of membership than there is on this appointment

Panel thank you are there any further members wishing to speak on this item councelor G do you wish to sum up yeah I I covered off that point in terms of the officers inform me that they obviously uh interviewed uh uh Paul uh I think Paul was the only applicant so my

Point is we do need to go out as far and wide as possible in the recruitment uh which will take place actually in the next year for the two other panel members and uh I think the the points made by members across the chamber are well noted by Officer colleagues in

Terms of the need to make sure that the future panel is diverse as possible uh without in any way imputing the person that we’re just about to appoint I would say um because uh I’m assured that they’re a perfectly capable person undertaking this role with a diverse range of skills and experiences

Themselves so uh that’s hence why we we’re suggesting to appoint them thank you councelor har you reserved your right to speak no thank you we’re now going to take this to the vote all those in favor please indicate those against and any extensions thank you that is clearly

Carried now going to move to agenda item number nine which is notice of motion please turn to Pages 21 to 22 one notice of motion has been received by the assistant director for legal and governance members are reminded that a maximum of 90 minutes will be set aside

For all discussion on notices and motion and I therefore ask that your points are made brief and concise should any amendment to any motion be moved the allocation allocated time set aside for motions will be paused until after the hard copy of the amendment has been circulated around the council chamber

And the Mover has read out the amendment councelor Denham thank you very much chair um this is I think an important motion about the functioning um of this Council and about democracy um that scrutiny is an essential part of um local and national government um and unfortunately since

The closure of the upper floors of County Hall and the due to the reinforced autoclaved air8 concrete otherwise known as rack um we haven’t been able to access the council chamber and in fact there’s been no webcast um of meetings since that time um scrutiny is essential um um and I’ve actually looked

Back to check so the last council meeting that was webcast was the 14th of September um the the meeting that took place in Bron grve in November that webcast is not available online on the website I don’t know what’s happened with it the last um ospb webcast was the 6th of

September um and there’s been no webcast for cabinet or for any scrutiny meetings since as far as I can find um we are democratically elected to speak up for the residents of westers and they have an expectation possibly even a right to see what we’re saying um to hear the

Discussions and the decisions that we are making on their behalf so the lack of availability of webcasts is a problem it means there’s no record there’s no opportunity to check back as to exactly what has been said and what the the wording was um it means that local

Journalists are unable to pick up stories and it can be a challenge for them you know to find um the right time for the meeting to work out what location which room and to travel to where that room is um the recent um children and young people’s scrutiny meeting on special educational needs

There was a huge amount of public interest in that item but extremely difficult for parents to be able to get to that meeting um if know virtually impossible when you’re dealing with school AG children and you’re factoring in travel um I would remind colleagues that the Health overview and scrutiny

Committee is a statutory committee um and it has the remit to scrutinize health services at every level within the county again a lot of public interest about the difficulty of accessing NHS Services um navigating the correct service new Services being developed but the public are not able to

Listen to these meetings at present or to understand what these new services are what the winter plans are it also means that stakeholders and Senior managers who might not be directly involved in in a meeting but have an interest in it have to travel to be present because there is they can’t keep

A weather eye on the screen as to what’s being discussed they’ve got to be where that meeting is is taking place um and yes there are published minutes and officers do very well but it is not the same um and doesn’t capture the detail of the debate and the personal anecdotes

Which actually bring policy alive so as a council we have the technology for virtual meetings and that is in place in Key Parts of County hall or indeed in a huge number of other public mil buildings within the the county within Worcestershire so why can’t we use this technology for

Making cabinet and scrutiny public available that’s what this motion is about and I don’t think it should be too expensive um a thing to achieve thank you thank you very much and a seconder for that motion councilor Ott chair thank you I’d like to Second this motion

And excuse me I reserve my right to speak until later thanks thank you I now open this item up to debate councelor Kent uh I’d like to bring forth an amendment please e thank you councelor Kent would you mind just reading out the um Amendment just

For the webcast yes thank you very much chair um the amendment reads as follows this Council believes that scrutiny is essential to democracy in the cabinet system of local or national government we note that since closure of the upper floors of County Hall due to risks from rack reinforced autoclaved arated

Concrete in September 23 there’s been no webcast of either cabinet or scrutiny committees available to the public Council therefore requests the cabinet member with responsibility brings a report to scrutiny to consider how we can provide access to online recordings of all public Council me meetings within our

Buildings thank you very much we will now restart the time if you’d like to um speak to the report yes thank you chair um apologies to councelor Denim but this meeting is actually being webcast so your your points and everybody else’s are being done because obviously the

Means are within this building to be able to do it as we stand and as we sit um whilst very sympathetic to the base of the motion um obviously the circumstances facing us with County Hall are unprecedented um we’ve brought the amendment forward for mainly technical reasons and factual ones um I’m totally

As I said sympathetic to the actual point of the motion um the first is the request to reinstate access to online recordings of all public Council meetings without de delving deep into archives I don’t think all public meetings have ever been recorded Council and cabinet meetings were for some time

Prior to the issues with County Hall and this was recently extended to the overview and scrutiny meetings which were moved to the council chamber to accommodate it’s worth pointing out this time that we are fully meeting our statutary duty to allow public access to our public meetings and indeed we have

Seen recently welcome public attendance at several meetings in the lake review room although I do take councelor denim’s point about giving access to the wider public um clearly we cannot force owners of other buildings outside of our control for example our district colleagues to provide equipment for the

Recording of our meetings so whilst today’s meeting is being recorded other buildings under other people’s control will not have the Necessary Technology and I think somebody referred to Broms grve District Council for a recent meeting the links this links into another reason why we cannot just accept

The motion as read and is ironically down to budget scrutiny if we were to accept the motion as put it could see a spending an inordinate amount of money that has not been scrutinized and may not even be technically possible within the logistical challenges of the rooms available the amendment therefore

Requires me to bring a report to the corporate and Comm scrutiny panel to allow them to consider the options available and at what cost however please do be assured I and the rest of the group are as Keen as those put in the motion to come to a satisfactory

Solution and i’ therefore hope all will support the amendment thank you very much in a second for the amendment councelor Rouse yes uh thank you chairman and uh good afternoon Council um I’m pleased uh to see this motion uh before the chamber today because it’s a topic that um kind

Actually ignited my my interest in politics in the early 2000s was access to public uh meetings I would uh often attend the public Gallery at centry uh city council at um their Council house and several flights of stairs bolted on uh to the side of the um uh chamber uh

And the reason for that retrofitting was because it wasn’t until the uh public bod’s admissions to meetings Act 1960 uh that enabled uh the public to actually see what was happening in council chambers all across uh the country if it wasn’t uh for uh that um act then um it

Would uh be very difficult and I wonder how long it would have been before uh public were allowed to peel back the curtain and see how decisions are made in uh public life in places uh like this uh that uh Act was a bill it was a

Private members uh bill at the time and uh it was introduced by a member of Parliament therefore who also went on uh to uh Pioneer television broadcast from the House of Commons in the 1980s um uh as as well so I do welcome uh particularly from the labor group

Members their embracing of uh Margaret Thatcher’s uh Legacy as the introducer of uh uh openness and transparency uh for uh Council meetings and I wonder what further thatright proposals that we can uh look forward to them in the future and if they do so they will uh undoubtedly be well supported certainly

By this uh Factor right um so I’m happy very happy to uh second my colleague’s uh Amendment which isn’t a huge uh departure uh and and um although I may gently needle them about uh uh uh Margaret Thatcher I do uh support the point uh that they’re being May they’re

Making and um do think it’s right uh to have scrutiny take a closer look at this and just uh make sure that uh the appropriate solution is put in place what I would say scrutiny has done a good job on this and has a good record around this because actually it was

Under this Administration under this uh scrutiny regime uh that the webcasting was expanded to include more scrutiny panels um whereas previously the the sub panels weren’t uh uh live streamed at all so I think there’s a a solid record uh on this I think the amendment is in

The spirit of the uh original uh uh motion as well and just just helps us to to to move the issue uh forward in a tighter way so I hope it will be well supported thank you thank you very much we now open up to debate but only on the amendment

Outlined by the Mover councelor Stokes yes thank you um I’d just like to make several points actually relating to the um to the notice motion and the subsequent Amendment relating to the public webcast um sometimes it’s a case of the members of the public attended a corporate and communities panel actually

At the the County Hall uh to discuss the libraries provision and they spoke very well they weren’t inhibited because they weren’t uh aired and they were they made their points extremely well so it was as a pleasure to actually receive public to a public meeting because that is what we’re there

For that is open democracy again whilst I uh enjoy the benefits of local uh um journalism I’m not here to assist lazy journalism okay and I’m also note that you don’t impune our own Minute takers because their minutes are excellent and they do record the statement of fact as it happens but

My other point is and it’s quite quite funny really because what one would have to do is to ensure that all members were present and that would be a particular issue when we do look across the labor board at this particular moment and there’s none there apart from your own

Self and I would actually suggests that they don’t attend the uh panel meetings in the first place so if it improves attendance by having a video then please do so thank you very much councelor art chair thank you um I just I note with the amendment the the real change

Is the word consider surely we we just need some basic technology to be able to to uphold the filming and I’m thinking about the earlier item with capital expenditure um there were some small Capital tweaks um and obviously they were so small they didn’t need to be

Reported separately at Council so in the spirit of this we could buy some new technology capitalize it and write off a small amount each year um and I just think it’s delaying it is putting off isn’t it what we don’t need to consider we just if you look at the seven not the

Sorry the seven principles of public life you know openness holders of public office should act and take decisions in an open and transparent manner information should not be withheld from the public unless are clear and lawful reasons for so doing um so you know if

It’s such a problem for us to to host at a County Hall perhaps we should sort of rotate around the county for all of our scrutiny meetings thank you thank you councilor cross thank you chair uh this proposed amendment loses uh the sense of urgency of the original motion

Um and I would suggest as if there is a budgetary problem that argues against uh video um being reinstated um would audio recording be a cheaper and sort of halfway house interim option thank you thank you councelor Jenkins thank you chair uh just quick Point again about the amendment I think

Maybe don’t want to amend the amendment but it would be nice if we could have some kind of idea of time scale of when you’d get a report cuz yeah you get report coming in it could take a year it would be nice if it was as soon as

Possible so if maybe if there is some clarification about if you could give a kind of a time scale of when I suppose ready for the new Financial year you know so if you can get report in the next couple of months that would be ideal thank you councilor

Bis uh thank you uh Mr chairman I I I wanted to speak in in favor of the amendment I think it recognizes and I personally absolutely believe that um the filming of our uh our meetings and webcasting of it is is absolutely desirable and something we should do I

Think the the amendment see seeks to understand the uh just the the cost of that and the council is cognizant of that when making a decision and I think that’s what this amendment is doing I’d hope that it would be Speedy as well so that we could return to um to recordings

And uh uh because I I believe that in that as a principle I believe that Parliament being broadcast is is uh was a absolute step forward all those years ago without filming we wouldn’t know for instance that Ed Davey was missing from the House of Commons yesterday at disc

When they were debating the post office and his disgusting role within it and without TV we wouldn’t know that no lib Dems try to speak at all during um prime minister’s question times yesterday for the same reason so I think transparency and openness are absolutely

Um uh uh a Paramount and so yes having having those um uh opportunities for the public to see what we’re doing uh as quickly as possible but that the council is cognizant of the cost when they agree to do so thank you councelor denim thank you I mean thank you for the

Uh support to the principle of what I’m trying to achieve I’m not accepting of the amendment because it does kind of remove any level of urgency um and appears to just know potentially just kick the can down the road if I can put it that way or there’s no assurance that

It won’t I think there are some um wrong assumptions within it um when I talk about um reinstating access to online recording recordings I wasn’t meaning to go back to meetings that haven’t been recorded are meant to put recording in place again as we have had in the past

Um and to say that we can’t aford force others to provide um facilities again is completely coming at it the wrong way it’s about cooperation and working together so presumably you know a a dialogue has taken place here and I hope that this webcast will be available um particularly for smaller

Meetings the Guild Hall in Worcester is very well equipped to be able to do um recording so you know those things could actually be put in place extremely quickly without spending much much money so I am concerned that no it’s it’s putting delay in rather than working positively

Proactively and the urgency of of make getting back to open democracy thank you councelor Boatright green I won’t go into the details but just as a a correction there I know of at least one liberal Democrat MP that did put in a question yesterday at pmqs but wasn’t Chosen and Davey was looking

After his disabled son after daycare was actually um unfortunately withdrawn and you can pull faces all you want but unfortunately these things happen thank you very much councelor Allen yes thank you chair um I look at the motion and then the amendment and and it seems to be the

Question is urgency and then spending our taxpayers money and what I’m really concerned about is perhaps the urgency should go into getting a report on the rack and getting us back in the chamber that’s possible and not spending more money on equipment that we might only

Need for a couple of months so I I’m not sure I’m prepared to support either the motion or the amendment because I think it’s the wrong question we’re asking today thank you councelor Taylor uh thank you Mr chairman I’m very glad I just followed that the council is speaking before me because he

Is almost answering the same question as I am I think the the amendment which I’m in favor of um adds a certain realism and pragmatism to to this uh to this motion I mean the the the word the wording to consider how we can provide access to online recording B public etc

Etc there might be rooms that we can’t so so we need to find out whether there are rooms that we can’t do it and against what rooms we can do it um and again if we can’t do it would we be chucking money at equipment to enable us

To do it for as the council prior to myself sort of said just for for for a couple of months um I also um agree with councelor Emma here I mean it’s a case of prior to any webcast or anything like this the public actually turned up to

Meetings if they’re that interested they would turn up if a journalist is that interest they will turn up so I while whil whilst I’m absolutely in favor of this this amendment we do have to have to inject this realism and pragmatism into this motion but the and the amendment does exactly that thank

You Mr chairman thank you very much there be no further speakers on the Amendments I now call councelor Kent to sum up thank you um I’ve listened to carefully to what all the council said I’m a little bit disappointed really because there is no intention here at

All to delay that’s not in the remit or whatever I enjoy seeing my face on the webcast and as many of you who follow me will know that I regularly post them of myself and others and there are many victims and many successful stories around that so delay is not in my

Interest it’s it’s as much a pain to me as it is to everybody else but I think councelor Taylor summed it up it’s prag pragmatism and budget scrutiny I can’t p i was involved in looking at the potential procurement of a replacement system for County Hall and we’re not

Talking tens of thousands of pounds we’re talking hundreds of thousands of pounds so I have to be extremely cautious about what we commit to in a council meeting based on a motion without knowing all the information that’s in front of us so from my point

Of view I’m more than happy to bring it to the first available Corp and coms screwy committee I will make that that promise now that that will be done and um we can’t do NE we next week’s because that would be suicidal for the officers probably and I really wouldn’t be very

Popular and it would alter the agenda that’s already gone out but from my point of view I’m absolutely determined to see this through I will say there are a huge number of variables that have to be considered and I think some of them been brought out here it could well be

That the question is where are those overview and scrutiny meetings held do we move them to areas that have already got those facilities but I think that is the proper Forum within that scrutiny committee to consider them and potential cost options as well so I would really

Implore everybody to support this in the spirit of what it is I’m absolutely determined to get this through I want it back but the motion did say all public Council meetings which it wasn’t previously so I had to sort that out in terms of the technicalities of it but in

The spirit of everything I want to see it happen as well thank you very much we’re now going to vote on the amendment all those in favor please indicate those against and any extensions that is a clear majority thank you than you now going to open up the debate on the substantive

Motion please indicate if you wish to speak councelor Robinson uh thank you I just want to uh quickly U clarify a couple of things PRS Grove District Council does have the ability now to film and broadcast Council meetings so I’d love to know why that wasn’t isn’t

Available and if we could be provided with an answer for that uh that would be great um that that’s mainly my point I just want to I think more people need to be able to come I think everyone agrees that to be able to to view

Um U meetings on online um and the fact that currently they can’t people say that there might be able to turn up but I think we’re I we’re taking a backward step if we we’re going that way again um but thank you thank you very much there being no

Further speakers councelor denim do you wish to sum up um I think we’ve probably covered the the range of issues it is about um Public Access um and yes there is more than one way to achieve that um without spending a lot of money on equipment um

But it I think it is important that we have have the recordings and that those recordings are publicly available thank you very much we’re now going to vote on the substantive motion all those in favor please indicate those against and any extensions thank you very much that is a

Clear majority now going to move to agenda item 10 which is question time question one councelor Allen Brad thank you councelor Hart sorry I was nearly standing up then um thank you very much indeed uh councelor Allan you’re absolutely right that um 12 months ago this Council

Unanimously voted in respect of a notice of motion in respect of armed forces and veterans in respect of um bus travel across the county uh and indeed as part of that um debate um 12 months ago we indicated that we would um look to bring forward uh any proposals as part of the

Budget process um as you will of course be aware cabinet met yesterday to um uh consider its um uh initial uh budget and we have kickstarted the consultation uh I can assure you that I’m working uh very closely with um the cabinet member for highways councelor Rous um whose um

Budget this actually sits in as we are uh working through actively uh what the uh cost would be um to um the taxpayers of westshire for us to provide uh such passes I have to say um the um latest costings are substantial and not insignificant which is important when

One considers the budget um perspective overall um as indeed the cabinet highlighted that we still have a 20 million pound funding Gap um as uh I speak uh and uh therefore uh we haven’t made a final decision on our proposals uh and cabinet will be bringing forward

Their final proposals um to Cabinet in a month’s time and of course Council will get to debate uh that um Financial allocation uh for Council in February thank you councelor Allan uh thank you um and will you also be um taking into consideration providing the bus pass uh for the worshire on demand

Buses as well councelor hard gosh that’s probably it a question for my learned colleague on my uh on my right I I’ll ask him and I’ll come back to you later thank you very much moving on to question two councelor OT CH thank you as R thank you councelor bis

Um uh I’m always a bit confused how when we talk about videoing these meetings if we don’t read out the question how the people watching out there will ever know what the what the answer related to uh you know we don’t put it up but uh I I I

I I I I’ll read it for you so how many uh so the question was what is the time table for ltp5 from development of the draft document commencement and stakeholder consultation to final cabinet sign off of the plan the answer is the Department of Transport were due

To publish some guidance on the development of future ltps which has been considerably delayed once this is published we will develop our timetable to reflect their requirements thank you councelor art chair thank you I would just like to comment that um it seems to be protocol

Here to sort of say as red quite often hence why I was um felt like a slightly immature rebuke but um thank you for the response and yet again um government are delaying and not not helping the council move forward thanks thank you councelor bis I wasn’t seeking to rebuke the

Member I was simply pointing out that we just had a debate about the importance of people watching in and being able to understand the debate I think reading out the question at least or providing a summary of it provides some opportunity for them to do so councilor

Denim thank you uh my question is how and I always and I always read mine out thank you how many cases has werer County Council had referred to the local government and social care Ombudsman in 2022 23 year and how many of those were upheld and then how can local people access this

Information thank you councel Hardman yes thank you very much indeed councelor denim for um as always a a very helpful question I do enjoy your question because they they’re often you know quite challenging and make one think and that’s surely you know one of the great advantages of of question time

Is that you know as a Cabinet member for adult social care and of course in many ways I think there is some degree of confusion of course in your question sadly because um I’m no longer leader of the County Council I am in charge of social care but your question refers of

Course to all cases that have been uh submitted to the local government and fairly recently tacked on social care onm for the entirety of westers County Council functions so I’m delighted to be able to report to you that in 2223 there are a total of 24 four

Complaints were made against WCC and of those 22 of the complaints were held up uh members of the public can access information on werer uh by a very helpful link to the local government and social care omnism website uh which will take you to the W County Council page and there you

Can see uh all the the complaints that have been made um and of course you know there is a link that we put on the County council’s complaint process uh towards the end of it which indeed you can follow yourself if you wish to make a complaint about any Council uh Services

Which probably include this answer I suppose um but I’m not sure the local government on would investigate it um but you can always try so um the other thing that is little known of course because of your interest in adult social care every week you can get the local

Government onon as he does to me send a list of solely social care decisions but currently they don’t separate them out so you get a a weekly uh email from him saying you know I’ve made all these decisions and of course I look to the all with interest you know and degree Shen

Frud quite often when I look at gler and warshire who seem to have more uh decisions in Social care made against them than we do thank you councelor Denham um I’m not sure does your answer relate to social care only I I sent the question into office well the answer to

The question is now of course CU that’s not what you asked that’s absolutely fine because she was suggesting that maybe the question was misdirected I took the guidance of officers as to where was the most appropriate place to direct it to so just to um it I mean it

Does sound like a lot and of course the um local government and now social care Ombudsman is about um investigating concerns about systems and processes in local government um if you search the County Council website our website the only information is as part of the complaints procedure at a recent

Um presentation adult social care scrutiny about complaints there was no detail given about Ombudsman cases and the officer said well you can look it up for yourself so I have um and you know the Ombudsman sends an annual review letter to the head of paid service that’s got some level of detail within

It um why is this information not routinely presented to any of our scrutiny committees and why isn’t that letter on the County Council website thank you um Council Hardman I don’t know if you can add anything I appreciate that um scrutiny chairs and their panels decide what goes to

Scrutiny Council Hardman do you wish to add anything well chairman you are so clever and and perceptive because you absolutely anticipated the answer I was going to give Mrs denim which of course is that she should take it up with the chair of of the adult social care SCU

Panel the excellent counselor web and I’m sure that councelor web being such an obliging councel will will make space in the agenda for her to be able to consider this in in some detail um why we don’t put the annual letter on um well so I’m looking across my colleagues

And they I’m just going to seek some clarification which may be of of help here so the information is published um I’ll ask the uh the chief executive who doesn’t mind following this up um directly with you if that’s okay councelor denim thank you going to move to question four councelor Boatright

Green thank you chair um on behalf of residents in the center of persal is it time to start talking about the feasibility of a southern bypass for persal councelor bis that’s um thank you Mr chairman um proposals for significant new transport infrastructure will be considered as

Part of the development of the new ltp uh and we are we will have to assess against criteria from government including their environmental and uh uh impact and the availability of funding the Department of Transport were you to publish some guidance on the development of ltps which has been considerably

Delayed once this is published we will develop our timetable to reflect their requirements thank you councelor Bo green I like the way a lot of people kind of saw the potential problem with this one um this is this is basically come from a series of conversations as a

Result of Bridge Street and and the High Street in particular where it’s a 20 mph Zone there’s very large Vehicles going through and obviously persal is a very dense very small town and it’s something where I think a lot of us have had these conversations about what the solutions

Would be in terms of trying to get lores off of these roads but it’s absolutely impractical the one I just I almost as a throwaway comment said well it’s a bypass then isn’t it which obviously would have huge environmental and funding impacts but is there actually

Any way that we can look at whether there is a feasibility to reduce the traffic through the High Street because it is an incredibly dense area with an incredibly difficult set of circumstances thank you Mr chairman I am absolutely confident that my colleagues will make sure that their residents know

In the surrounding area around BW that um c c Council boat right green is Keen on a on a potential bypass to the South and on on the environmental impact that that will have and I’m sure he’ll get I’m sure his postbag will reflect some views on that um the serious point is

That we have sub as this Council as he knows this Council has substantially invested in improving the transport infrastructure in and around persal over recent years years uh I he was there at the opening I believe as well as myself at the of the northern bypass uh the uh

The Upton snowbury um um traffic lights predate him and are the you know were a contribution from his predecessor as well um the sorry the pinvin not p s me pinvin uh uh and we’ve made significant improvements in the transport flow but this County Council never rests on its

Laurels and we’ll continue to look at ways in which we can improve traffic flow across the whole of Wester in the years to come thank you question five councelor boite green I’m already regretting the length of this one um at the council meeting in January 2022 I hope councelor

Hardman asked for asked a question about the highways issues faced in eckington with a developer repeatedly causing traffic congestion as they worked on the highway in the answer to the question the former Cabinet member of Highway suggested the Council was investigating the potential to charge companies for

Working on the highway after 2 years can we get an update on whether this is feasible and when we might see some changes thank you councelor Ral well if um if you regretted the uh length of the question um so as we are uh recording uh I think

It is worthwhile and for the benefit of couns and people at home just to just to touch on briefly what a lane rental uh scheme is terminology that would be unfamiliar to a great many people and it is um where in English uh different Arrangements in different nations um an

English Highway Authority charging uh any uh Works promoter carrying out any registerable Works uh in the street for the time those Works occupy the highway uh charges are focused on the very busiest streets at the busiest times uh charges applied to Works promoted by both utility companies and highways

Authorities themselves for any work work that they do so our own schemes and works would fall uh in line for charges as well the power for highways authorities to implement and operate a lane rental scheme in England is subject to approval by the Secretary of State uh

Who would need to see that the authority is running a uh well-run permit scheme for example uh permit fees that are proportionate discounts are offered for joint Works uh compliance with with uh permitting regulations and guidance uh schemes fully supportive uh the delivery of national infrastructure uh uh

Projects such as in our case a38 bre improvements uh broadband and full fiber uh roll out as well so we are supporting uh roll out of national infrastructure priorities and that’s that’s controversial in in in in some parts uh particularly in rural uh areas as well uh incentives for high quality

Performance uh particularly the right first time uh reinstatements um the charges are there to incentivize work outside of peak hours uh they’re waved for any joint work so we don’t get anything if there are joint Works uh that go on caps are put in place uh for Major Works to

Install and replace apparatus so that these works are not unfairly penalized and delayed schemes are trialed for a period of time before going live and reviewed annually to ensure charges uh remained proportionate and applied to the most congested did roads uh in the consultation that they did in Kent uh

And the trial that they did there it was only around 5% of the network the busiest um locations uh in the W County Council uh uh context we have uh been advised that if we want to start looking at this the first thing we have to do is draw up a

List of traffic sensitive streets uh as one of the first requirements so therefore in order to fit that 5 Cent uh requirement um we have to look at the busiest roads and the busiest locations they will exclusively be in Worcester that’s that’s where where the

Congestion is is the worst and and so on so this this policy of Lane rental um I have to say to members across worcesters share is not something that would be a benefit uh to you unless you wor now you can take a view as to

How fair that might be but that’s the scheme that the DFT um have have put out uh so it certainly wouldn’t include um the b408 in eckington uh for instance or anytime in in in the future um so we’re also waiting for legislation to be announced around uh plan for drivers

Which was announced by the prime minister in October 2023 suggesting changes that will ensure Lane rental schemes are made more attractive to local highways authorities the original legislation came out in 2012 only Sur County Council and West Sussex County Council with their strong links to transport for London uh applied to the

Secetary state for Lane rental the hesitancy across the rest of the UK uh appears to be due to the risks associated with local highways authorities own Works programs and those costs then being uh distributed to the private sector utilities via Surplus Port through bids for technological advances to Street Works activity

There’s an indication that changes will be made to legislation in the near future to allow local highways authorities to bid to the Surplus plot for highways uh Improvement Works thereby reducing the risk to local highways authorities um turning to his point about uh eckington uh poor works

That were undertaken by Al Hey Limited in August 21 and November 21 on behalf of spit fire homes uh led to a suspension from working on the Wii County Council Network Al he limited have now served a suspension and have subsequently returned to work on the network and undertaken further Works in

Eckington to an improved standard with better organization we now issue warning letters and suspensions as standard practice to improve compliance we also have developed AR improvements to introduce standardized charges for developers to make roads space booking from March 24 with Major Works being charged more than minor or standard

Works we’re now also seeking Master plans from developers as a way of viewing and reducing the number of incursions into the highways Network I’m not finished thank you very much councelor boat right green I’m seriously regretting asking be quite no actually can I first of all can

I just ask for that in writing because I got some of my notes down but I I do feel like I missed it I know it be nice to have a written I feel like it’s probably written down that’d be useful um so if this is not an option then I’m

Assuming then what happened with aington where kind of bands were used that would be more where we have to lean towards especially on minor roads rather than heading down this route is that right in my understanding yes I mean if you want me to read it do it again slower

Then um the the yeah for elsewhere out to of of worest uh then it it is about the regime uh that that we put in place and having a a a a Tor regime uh but I want members to be very clear that there’s a lot of uh pressure on the road

Uh at the moment for Road Works we’ve got uh seven Trent water for starters has been been told that they’ve got to uh improve their Network they got to reduce uh sewage discharge they got to improve the uh the efficiency reduce leaks and so on and so forth so they so

They want to uh open the highway uh Broadband providers have been told we got to have gigabit Broadband for every man woman and child so therefore they want to open uh the highway the gas network has been told they’ve got to improve their Network so that we can

Reduce dependency on foreign input so they want to open uh uh the the network as well uh have have I missed anyone um electric yeah that again to improve for Ev charging points air source heat pumps ground pumps and so on so the electrics now wanting to open the highway as well

Uh and then there’s ourselves as as the highway wanted to maintain uh and improve uh uh the highway so there’s a long list of of people that are just waiting to get now we try and you know bring it all together but there’s nothing more frustrating that you know

We go along and resurface a piece of road and then you know two weeks later seven TR water come along and open it all up and um uh don’t reinstate it to the to to the same uh standard we are ever Improv proving on that and getting

The inspectors and what I would say is we need local communities and counselors to work with us on that as well because we can’t be everywhere or at all times we do send inspectors out uh we have got uh we got motorcycles for instance got a couple of motorcycles that inspectors

Will go zooming out on on the motorcycle and um uh uh uh to have a look at the the state of reinstatement works for instance and just for our our green party colleagues over there yes I have asked if we could have ebikes introduced to that Fleet as well so they can go

Cycling around uh uh uh wora to to to respond to and has been positively received uh as as well so um it is about how we get out there and inspect and make sure that the regime is put in place but yes it is also actually about

A bit more of a stick approach there as well in that in that if uh uh we we are finding problems with developers people who are doing Works uh we do need to uh get tough on them as well the caveat to that obviously is the long list of

People that I mentioned uh have a statutory right uh to be able to uh uh open high so is very difficult uh in particular with seven Trent uh water I I may add uh I’ll end there because I may become somewhat undiplomatic in my remarks about s TR water thank

You thank you moving on to question six councelor Denham thank you chair mode shift stars is an accreditation scheme supported by the department for transport and active travel England and funded by Wester County Council the scheme rewards schools over five levels green bronze silver gold and platinum for increasing the number of

Young people who regularly walk wheel cycle and use other forms of sustainable transport to get to and from school what communication has there been with schools in the county to promote the scheme thank you councelor Rouse yes uh thank you for for a question uh appreciate that so uh Moi stars and she

Set out briefly what Moi stars is uh all about and um it falls with the highways development management team uh and what they require is schools to register with Mod shift stars to create a suitable travel plan aimed at promoting sustainable modes of travel uh and reduce uh use of car and that’s

Something that we are very keen uh to promote I’ve said in previous meetings and in public that uh schools can be real uh sort of Transport interchange Hub if we get it right um improving active travel bus and so on and it feeds into our work with bip and the enhanced

Partnership as well as our active travel and minor infrastructure uh works so uh in terms of the communication with the schools we only work with the schools the trigger point at the moment is around pling applications so that’s when it’s our opportunity to go in there and

Start talking to them about Modi Styles um but obviously appreciate that not all schools will be putting in planning applications all of the time what we very mindful uh of is is that there’s a lot of communications to school that are you know specifically centered around the education of the children all of

These updates that they get from the DF the school funding agency and so on they all getting the um a very very busy uh inbox um but what we can do is uh liaz with colleagues in wi holdon first um for instance to make sure that that

Service is promoted uh more W widely so yes we can work with with Partners to to to push that a bit more um however it’s worth pointing out that as say with that busy inbox the resources in the schools themselves at the receiving end are very

Limited in terms of being how able to have the bandwidth uh uh to to look into this um but if they do uh as an individual School pick up on uh uh Moi star they’ll be able to take uh advantage of the resources uh on offer to promote travel planning and the

Benefits if you have got any schools where you’re listening and you think ah that could work well for that’s speak to Highway’s colleagues outside um at the end of this meeting during the break or come and see me on another occasion uh and we can try and make sure that we

Specifically work with you and a local school because I think it’s also important that local members uh can help us with this as well to ensure that the uh the school in the community is able to give it the uh due attention thank you thank you councelor

Denham thank you um it’s a really really interesting answer um there’s if you do mode shift if you do a search on the County Council website there’s absolutely nothing visible to the public um and there’s been absolutely no awareness amongst the teachers or the police or others that I’ve talked to

About it um what you’ve said May partially explain that because they’ve not put in a planning application um no and it may no within Worcester City there are two schools signed up um and I’m aware of this information from that worest the city council active travel Trel officers

There’s only two schools signed up at the very bottom level um you know the benefits of active travel to school are enormous you know potential to reduce childhood obesity to increase health and well-being and of course to reduce congestion um I mean what what what what will you

Do to actually sure you know there is County funding here um and at the moment it’s not helping wor your children take the active route to school what can you do to improve that please councelor Ral yeah thank you I take the challenge in the in the spirit

I believe it’s intended and um what I would say as well is is is uh we must remember bikeability as as well we are actively engaged uh in schools uh and I do wonder where we do have those conversations around bikability um and I think there’s there’s a greater

Question there around uh what are we also having a conversation about mod shift stars as well at the same time is that an opportunity for us to to hook in there it seems like a natural symbiosis um we have the active travel stakeholder Forum as well and I think

There’s an opportunity for us to uh invite uh representatives from education to be part of that as well I don’t think we’d have room uh to accommodate a representative from each school but I’m sure we can find a mechanism uh to make that happen uh as well uh take the point

Regarding uh the website and of course that’s something we can go away uh and take a look at as well uh as I said I’m very keen to work with all members uh on this you know we are a very proactive travel uh uh Council here and in particular uh around schools because

That is our opportunity to set um positive uh uh behaviors and travel habits that then stick for life um so absolutely recognize that it’s essential uh we work with this because there’s a lot of practical Dimensions around it as well you know if you’ve got a family

That going you knowy to school and the parents on a a bicycle uh what do they do when they’ve then got to go onto the onward journey to to work that’s you know many miles away what do they do with the bike they got to cycle home get

In the car and so so there’s there’s practical things that that that could be improved at school sites as well um so I think there’s there’s there’s there’s Capital conversations to be had there as well I do work uh very closely with Council enlo on this as as well as the

Education CMR um she recognizes um uh the importance of this um in in terms of education and um uh best start in life for for young people towards as I say those healthy active travel uh habits so very happy to to take some of those points away and and look into them and

See what we can do thank you thank you unfortunately we have run out of time um for the final question however I do just wish to offer some clarification in relation to question three um from councilor denim um the information um that she requested is available um on the local government and

Social care umman website um and there is a link under wers County County Council on there and we’ll make sure that the link is sent across to you so that you’ve got that with due respect I mean thank you for that answer um it’s not available on our website so what

The so the information is on the website we’ll make sure that the link is sent over to you after this meeting today thank you thank you we now move to agenda item number 11a which is reports of committee starting with audit and governance committee please turn to Pages 25 to 28

In your agenda I will now invite councelor Nathan Desmond the chairman of the audit and governance committee to present the report and then I’ll invite the council to note this report councelor Desmond will answer any questions if necessary councelor Desmond thank you Mr chairman and good afternoon everybody um good afternoon

Let me uh start Mr Chair by formally moving uh that we note the report as printed which uh as members can see is a very uh straightforward uh report but if I can use this opportunity just to update Council very quickly on our final accounts which were signed off uh on the

15th of December last year with a unqualified opinion uh and uh importantly we with a first yes the first County Council in the country to sign off our accounts which was absolutely uh fantastic so let me go on record uh and formally thank uh our 151

Officer uh Mr Phil rook and his team uh for their excellent uh work and their professionalism over the last uh 12 months um and what I would say Mr chairman is we have been knocking on this particular door now for at least a couple of years um which shows that we

Have a first class Finance team and an excellent processes uh and systems in place uh so with that I formally move that we note the report as printed thank you very much and I also Echo the great achievements um that Phil and his team have done in in getting

Those um signed off um are there any questions I ask Council to note the report thank you we now move to agenda item 11b is pensions committee please turn to pages 29-32 I will invite councelor Elizabeth a the chairman of the pensions committee to present the report and then I’ll

Invite the council to note this report Council Elizabeth a will answer any questions if necessary councelor a I present my report and as you see the first part of my report covers the wonderful work of the of Phil C Phil R the1 officer and the chairman uh in in

Getting the being the first in the country on their audit uh you have all had time to read this report and I’m sure every one of you go on the web and look at all the information there’s so much information about the pension scheme on the web and I’m sure you read

That cover to cover right and I’m ready to answer any questions thank you very much councelor Arts chair thank you um obviously it talks about pension investment and the pension fund um I would just like to ask how much of the wer pension fund is invested directly into fossil fuel

Companies thank you councilors thank you I don’t believe it you asked this last time and got a very good answer you asked it to the leader and the chief executive quite recently and got a very full answer but other people haven’t had the answer so I’ll give them the

Highlights okay but you know the answer because you got such a detailed report from everybody and I’m sure you have looked at the climate risk strategy on the funds website and the climate risk report and the climate related Financial disclosures I know you’ve done that because you’ve asked the questions

Anyway thank you for your question which is so similar to everything else and uh the full response and I just want to say the fund does not directly investing companies the investment is via fund manager or even fund of fund Investments indirectly therefore the fund does indirectly therefore the fund does have

A small for carbon footprint but its focus and our requirement to all our fund managers is responsible Investments environmental social and governance issues properly taken care of and better managed risk and sustainability longterm the fund has developed a climate risk strategy which is on the fund’s website which everybody should be reading it’s

Published an annual climate risk report together with a climate related Financial disclosure and I urge everybody to re read read these our direction of travel is definitely to improve the the fund’s carbon footprint uh the carbon’s footprint of total equities is 30.1% below Benchmark 13.63% of the reduction is between 20 20 and

2022 in November 21 the fund transitioned out of a very carbon intensive passive Equity Fund and invested 200 million in a climate multifactor fund so we’re doing all we can but remember we are fiduciary responsible for the 60,000 plus people who who rely and we have to cover our

Reliabilities so we’re doing it in the right way and I’m sorry to bore you all when you all want to go home but this is such an important part of the uh provision in this County by the pension committee pension fund which is separate from the County

Council thank you very much are there any further questions can I point of order point of order which where about in the constitution does your point of order fall Place well it’s just I have on the 7th of December wire forest district council overview and scrutiny committee public document it says what

Your pension fund is worth more than 3.5 billion at least to my question thank you that’s not a point of order and now going to move on to uh ask the council to note the report thank you we now going to move to agenda item 11 C which is the report of

The planning and Regulatory committee please turn to Pages 33 and 34 in your agenda I will now invite councelor Ian Hardman the chairman of the planning and Regulatory committee to present the report I will then invite the council to note this reports councelor Hardman thank you chairman I can hear the feet

Shuffling so my report is as printed thank you thank you are there any questions there be none I kindly ask the council notes the report thank you very much and that is the end of today’s meeting thank you