This week we have Mark Swier who lives in Brooklyn, NYC and rides with the New Jersey Randonneurs. He did his first brevet in 2016 and completed PBP 2023 in a time of 85:39. He rode much of this Paris Brest Paris with Arvi Sreenivasan (PBP Story #47) and offers his side of the story on being penalized 2 hours by a police officer…
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Paris Brest Paris: PBP Stories and Tips
Join Peter Curley (PBP ’19, ’23) as he interviews the riders who have completed (and DNF’ed!) Paris Brest Paris, the most famous (and oldest) endurance ride in the world. Learn firsthand what to expect and how to give yourself the best chance of a successful PBP.
Paris Brest is a long-distance cycling event with a rich history. Established in 1891 as a professional race, it has evolved into the premier amateur endurance cycling event. Every four years, thousands of cyclists from around the world attempt to finish PBP’s grueling 1,200-kilometer (745-mile) route, within the 90 hour time limit.
10 PBP Stats (2023)
Participants = 6431
Finish rate = 76%
Average age = 51
Oldest female & male = 69 & 79
Youngest female & male = 17 & 17
Female participation = 7.24%
French participation = 29.03%
Charly Miller (56:40) = 12
Adrian Hands (88:55) = 62
Club with most riders = San Francisco Randonneurs
I think Harvey gave a good account just in terms of like it’s the Brooklyn and the Bay Area kids just doing our head check we’re cleared not even thinking twice you know just like and then you know right away the like you know big pink face like with with the safety vest on and you just like and um and I I just we kind of like I was just what the hell is going I just you know kind of like what is going on right now. And thankfully, I mean, RV’s RV’s friendship is really good. So, I mean, that was
it would have been a different experience if if I was dealing with that on my own.
Um, and but yeah, we he wasn’t able to talk us out of it. So that’s
we were just like it it you know and like again like Harvey said I think it really crystallized like
everything just came sharp out of the you know adversity sharpening our our focus sharpening that you know
I know you had so to to kind of rally against isn’t that right? Um, yes. Tell me, did you did you understand like what he was the penalty he was going to give you or you then had to ask Arvy or Arvy then told you that guy just gave us was it a two-hour penalty?
Two hours. So, yeah, that I I understood and you know, I was
Yeah, my my French comprehension is better than my my verbal like my speaking, but I I was able to, you know, I I caught the gist that we were
Yeah. Like you guys are on these beautiful steel machines. You’re used to people just admiring them and then you meet some guy who
he’s not really into the whole thing.
No, no. And he’s just, you know, he’s paid to do a job and
and he did it and uh this week we have Mark Swear who lives in Brooklyn, New York City and rides with the New New Jersey Randurs. He did his first purvey in 2016 and completed PBP 2023 in a time of 8539. I got Mark’s name from Arvy who wrote with him PBP 2023. Arvy talks a lot about Mark in glowing terms. So I don’t want to be disappointed, Mark. Okay. All right. I want to hear your perspective because Arvy gets everything wrong. Okay. Uh first question. What does PBP mean to you? Thanks, Peter. Um, I I think PBP was like a an unprecedented in my adult life exploration and investment in my own sense of adventure and curiosity and boundaries. So, I sort of thinking about it in sort of high high at a high level. Um I I kind I became a parent in 2009, you know, and and so I had some younger kids when I first started, you know, when I wrote my first purvey, the kids were a little bit younger and and so I was just like trying to figure out how this phase of my life could be compatible with this interest and dream um that takes up a lot of time and is a big investment of not only my my time but of my loved ones. and the the people who I’m accountable to.
So yeah, just that that this experience showed me that that was some that that this kind of adventure was possible for me in my life and that um that I can advance like my hopes, my dreams and interests while still being the person that I want to be um for my loved ones. So yeah,
Mark, I should have actually asked you this, but my research is always very poor. So, um, what age are you now? And what age were you when you did PBP? 23,
right? So, I’m 45 now.
Okay.
And so, what I was 43. Yeah. You look good, Mark. You look very young to me. I was going to say 30s, but Okay, that’s good. Okay.
Thanks, dude. What What did the finish line feel like? Oh, what a Yeah. So in those in in light of that sort of what it meant to me, it was just like this just incredible rush of emotion and just all that was present for me like with I was present with all the people who extended themselves to support me in this endeavor and this accomplishment and with all that I had put into achieving it. And so it just so just overwhelmingly humbling and emotional and like pride in a in a in a way that for me and
and like this little slice of this moment in history in my life and the people around me that like um
was quite incredible like quite unprecedented and just uh and overwhelming. So yeah, I don’t allow myself like a lot of pride, but like just regularly, maybe not enough,
but this was a moment I was just like, I can’t believe it, you know, just like and we came in I can say I’ll say more about this, but we came in in the morning like the way our our start wave the way things panned out. Came in to a a sunrise like just that last 50 miles in was just glorious.
Yeah. Remarkable. Great. Okay, so next question. Let’s just take a step back. Let’s talk about your background in cycling. Maybe your earliest memory on a bike. Why do you ride? How does it feel? A lot of different questions there, but you kind of get the gist. Yeah, I grew up grew up riding. My my dad always rode as a commuter and and and for joy and pleasure and and dragged us around in um the 80s on early Burley, probably one of the first Burly trailers in growing up in Grand Rapids, Michigan. And and then I I I remember like learning how to ride and I got a handme-down um it was like a Diamondback BMX bike all ched out and I think and then I left it outside the candy store and it got stolen and that was very formative and my dad and we were you know
searching the neighborhood for the culprit and it didn’t come just like formative you know like bicycle uh memories. But yeah, like my my dad was always a rider and then my um my uncle was really into cycling and he passed like during COVID and he had a couple years prior he had told me about this story about his and my mom’s great great maybe greatgrandfather who was a carpenter in in western Michigan and was hit by a car was killed by a car while riding.
Wow. Um, and so I like had this interesting like, you know, I didn’t I hadn’t heard that story before and it was um,
so it it’s been in my family and and it was always, you know, a way that I think having adventures as a as family. I have two younger brothers and a lot of times on the bike.
Mark, you were just telling me um, just before we started that I think your all your grandparents were from Holland. Is that correct?
Yeah. So Dutch Dutch immigrant family. Um,
yeah. my my dad’s mom was born in Compen in the Netherlands in and uh and then their the other sort of side both sides of the family either were were sort of their parents were born in the Netherlands and immigrated.
Yeah.
Um and do you were they all like that’s what we always think about when we think of the Netherlands, right? Everyone’s on these high bicycles dressed up on their way to work. Were they did they kind of bring some of that from the Netherlands or they weren’t really cyclists?
I I wouldn’t say they’re part, you know, particularly like that that that it was that deep. You know, they were educators and farmers and and workers.
Yeah. And caregivers. Um but you know, bikes were always around. I think that that process of you know, Americanization and assimilation, some some things come through and some things
don’t come through. Um but there’s yeah I think there was a strain you know there was a strain there was a thread to pull on when it when it came my time. So
yeah like it’s unusual your father used to commute everywhere brought you guys on that burly that’s maybe I don’t know something happening in his uh his jeans there who knows.
Absolutely. Absolutely. It was it was sort of unusual at that time in the 80s uh you know grown up to to be dragging around that that burly trailer at that time.
Yeah. And in more recent times, um, why do you ride? How does it make you feel? That kind of thing.
Yeah. I I um I started really riding at like when I became a parent, I was kind of like I don’t I was having to take care of a fleet, you know, and I had sort of ridden around, you know, practically. I hadn’t really started joy like riding for pleasure. And I was just like, I got to learn how to take care of these bikes. I don’t want to have to bring in a bike to a shop um to change a flat or to to dial in brakes or um you know um any any just deal with any mechanical stuff. So I started learning and tinkering and and um
and then I started riding and just kind of like really started to enjoy it. I had always been a soccer player and and that was starting to um wear and tear after sort of 30 years of of playing soccer was was catching up with me and so I was looking for a way to
kind of um
you know just push myself and and and and have adventures.
Yeah.
Um and that’s that’s sort of like early it I think 20 2014 15.
Yeah.
And were you already living in New York at that time or not?
Yeah, I moved to Brooklyn in 2005. Okay. Well, let’s talk about the Brooklyn Viking scene because that’s kind of fascinating. So, Prospect Park, is that what you all do? You ride around that in circles or how does it work?
Yeah, there’s a lot of that. That’s the whole scene. I think as a randoner in Brooklyn and and in the burrows like well on this side of the the East River, it’s like we can we can go out to Long Island or we can cross and you know do the route up to Nyak and that gets us out of town takes you got to ride a ways to get to some real hills etc. But I I’ll ride I’ll ride in the loops but I like to ride down in Jamaica Bay. There’s some perms that were growing all the time and um one of our one of our local folks who’s part of the New Jersey club uh Will Sherman just became the RBA for Long Island and so excited to support him and growing out that um that region um and that infrastructure and just come up with more cool roots out on Long Island. We hosted the first um well NJR New Jersey crew hosted the first bravade since I started that was like started and finished in central Brooklyn at Grand Army Plaza. So that was two weekends ago. Um and went out the north shore of Long Island. There’s it was like 5600 feet of climbing on a 200k. So it was you know it’s it gets nice some nice rollers very PVPesque rollers on the Northshore.
Um so that was that was great. And then there’s another uh burbet in two weekends that’s starting in Gowanas, Brooklyn of all places at Principal’s Coffee Shop, which is owned and operated by a local Randon who’s um she’s cool.
Yeah. So there’s a there’s like a a building kind of growing effort to to make I think randoning more accessible in in the sense that like
I don’t have to drive a car to a place where I start a ride at 6:00 in the morning in New Jersey which has been a lot of my experience. Um so hopefully that you know continues to build. looking forward.
I lived in New York for two years and I live in the upper upper west side and I had this old Gary Fisher mountain bike
and I used to ride across the George Washington Bridge and you know I I really enjoyed the experience. It was fun, you know.
Yeah. If you’re if you’re uptown or in the Bronx like you can get out pretty easy. I like to make routes also like with my kids to to like take the train up to Westchester and then just get out do some camping or whatever. You know, there’s New Yorkers. Yeah. There’s so many like in the bay there’s so many different ways to ride and and um
but for random nurse I think um there’s increasing increas it’s becoming increasingly accessible and I’m I’m I’m looking forward to to that growth.
Yeah, it’s cool. And so you did your first bre I think 2016. Maybe talk about that and also h how you first heard those three letters PBP. Yeah. Um, so I had uh when I started like to be serious more about learning about bikes, I was, you know, heavy blog era. So I like started nerding out about like what type of cycling is interesting and
I wasn’t a racer. I wasn’t a messenger, but like oh this I I found, you know, through probably through Sheldon Brown or Bicycle Quarterly or and I I found like Mary Gerson’s chasing mailbox’s blog and and Faler Faler’s blog. I know you talked to them. I haven’t got to watch that video yet, but um
yeah,
you know, it was a pleasure to, you know, so I’d read all their stuff for years and and just was like, I maybe I can maybe I can do this. Maybe I try this sometime. And that was a huge accomplishment just to get to the place where I was going to have my first breet.
Yeah.
And that started at the that was an NYC 200 that starts uptown near the entrance to the GW to the George Washington Bridge.
So it starts there and then and then you go up uh towards Bear Mountain and um and so that was like easy kind of like like it was an accessible start starting point for me.
Yeah.
Yeah. Can I can I ask you a quick question? Like, you know, the stereotype for someone here from the West Coast thinks Brooklyn and um
maybe just like biking is a it’s about the equipment and and all that kind of stuff, which I personally that’s who I am as well. Just so is that the case? Are you more are you like big into bikes in general? Is that right?
In general. Okay. I I have a I’m lucky to live in an apartment building that has good parking in the basement.
Nice.
And so I’ve taken over a whole corner. I got a couple of tandemss. I got a cargo bike. I got all the kids but is probably, you know, I’m not going to say a number because
Okay. Yeah. I I don’t want to make it hot. Yeah. I have the exact same setup downstairs where I’m in San Francisco and uh Yeah, there’s quite a few bikes in there. So yeah, let’s go.
Yeah. And you know Yeah. But it I’m I’m still Yeah, I’m a little bit I’m I’m reaching my threshold. I’m I’m not fully like N plus one, but I’m like just like
Yeah. trying to trying to I think people people are there’s all you know like like I in the bay like there’s like all types of scenes like there’s a huge gravel adventure cycling
y
you know scene that people you know people are really getting out exploring the castills doing stuff in it’s it’s like it takes a little bit of work and planning but it it’s totally possible and I suspect you were kind of drawn to the randuring biking as it like the actual equipment itself self. Is that right?
Yeah. Yeah. I liked how access like you know just the like learning about the machine just like really learning about how to fix and service and like
you know tearing you know that part of working with my hands the mechanical part and like feeling like capable and confident. um dealing with all the drivetrain issues, dealing with, you know, I know RV talked about the the sort of um the the the the French cosplay, the the sort of steel steel random nerve bikes and and I think part of that is like Yes, absolutely. And part of the the accessibility of like steel machines, mechanical brakes, rim brakes, like the reasons people take to that whether in the US or elsewhere is is at least resonant for me in terms of like I can fix this. I can, you know, I can figure this out in a way that some of the new stuff that’s more tech heavy or
like I I’m just kind of like, ah, it’s a little too much.
Um, okay. So then let’s talk about your first um bre. You said you could do this. I’ve read everything about this sport. I know everything. So, yeah. What was it? What was it like?
Yeah.
Yeah, it was uh it was a lot of work. It was a good good great challenge, you know. It was like
I think that experience of like just all the distances. Yeah. like finding, you know, so Ren and Ernie is so much about like just figure out a way to have like a goal and accomplish it and like and you know whether you get a trinket for it or not or it’s like in your head and in your heart it’s like I think building the miles to be like oh I can ride 50 miles. I can ride 70 miles. I can I can probably ride 100 miles. I think just the buildups that was amazing. And then and then on that on that ride I got taken under the wing by this crew of this mly crew of hilarious veteran weirdos called the fist of Xanax. So, I got to shout out the I gota shout out the fist and and yeah, they’re like, you know, everybody knows about the fist.
The fist. Yeah. The fist of Xanax.
Self-described randuring.
Yeah.
Crew. Uh, and these are old heads like they’re they’re veterans. They’re OGs. And Gil Lebron took took me under his wing. Christoph Beckler who’s now in back in Germany um was here, Mike Gorman, Chris Sloum and folks, they they Will Sherman, they they really were like, you know, it was like a good fit like
clowning and then just pacewise, but also serious and and determined and um you know, I’m not I’m sort of middling. I’m like not fast and I’m not the slowest and but I have good like you know I have good u I think troubleshooting patience and good relationship to suffering and uh
healthy one yeah
and if that doesn’t work just take a xanax that’s why they like you obviously
that’s right
they they dragged me along and said you got this and they you know like waited for me when I flatted and got me across the finish on my first py and
yeah and it was Yeah. Yeah.
And Mark, did you you just were curious about doing a bury that you had no intention of doing a PBP at that time? Is that correct? Or you didn’t even know much about it?
It just felt like pie in the sky. I think I read about it probably early because of I think I started really I think I started subscribing to BQ pretty early and I was just
just kind of like, oh, taking it one step at a time.
Yeah. And I thought, you know, oh my gosh, someday like if some, you know, someday I’d like to do this like and it just felt like
that’s so cool.
Couldn’t imagine.
Yeah. Yeah. And it was a couple of year it was a few years where like I think I even wrote another bravet and then yet let alone got to think the next it might have been 19 might have been 18 or 19 when I even wrote another brevet in terms of where my where life was at where my commitments were at and um and then it was really in the leadup I think you know the year after coming out of co and then really in the leadup the two years lead up to to PVP that I really rode my first Siri like my first series and and got started um thinking about maybe I could do this.
I I always ask u people this just generally. Did um co all that stuff change your biking behavior? Yeah, it did. I mean I I I think I’m not the most consistent. like it helps to like the PVP leadup like really helped me have the structure to like build and build and and really grow, but I don’t like I’m not like religiously out riding the track three days a week or like doing like the repetition thing is it just doesn’t
work for me and how I kind of live my life and and and that that COVID period really threw it off. I started riding out and doing some rides like for like at a certain point, but I never got like I think the ways that people were trying to self-organize around like on train like doing burbays on trainers or like um the stuff where it was like I you know there was there there were actually things try being attempted that I didn’t necessarily plug into until we were out of the out of the woods with co
Yeah. So then um you did a few more bases, the sickness started evolving and then you said I’m going to do PBP. Is that correct? I think at a yeah at at that point I was like I knew it was coming up. My kids were a little bit older. I think our like division of labor with parenting was in a place where I I I thought that with the inputs and outputs I could find a balance um around uh training and and doing a series and um
yeah so early on I talked with my partner and we we just kind of think it made sense and and so I was like okay let’s let’s do it. And then how did you kind of formulate some kind of strategy for PBP itself? I uh I had wanted to do I I intended like two the season be before PBP year so 22. I had intended to do like a series and then ride at least like a thousand or or even a 1,200 which I hadn’t done before. I hadn’t run written a full series before and I hadn’t done uh one of the higher distances and um and so the series was series went well and um and then and then the I think there was a th00andk plan for September or late August and it got cancelled.
Okay. And and so that was my intention. And then I started I was reading more stuff and asking talking to people and I think the the approach that is kind of like ride the series. You don’t have to ride the full amount before you do your first 1200 whether it’s PvP or a different one, but like ride the series really. I think like especially in the 600 and and really work on being you like your orientation to sleep as much as possible but but that that it is a sound it’s a sound strategy to ride a series and then work on speed and hills in the like six weeks out six to eight weeks out. Um, and so that’s what I ended up just gambling. At a certain point, I had to really be like make um make my peace with like I can give it this much. And I can see that like if I g if I was able to give it more where that would get me in terms of my strength on the hill like on hills or my speed.
Yes.
Um but like this is what I can give it. I’m giving it everything I can. Um and I had to sort of and you know that was sometimes a struggle but um generally I I had to I found some level of equinimity with with that.
And did you know others from um other clubs nearby clubs that were going? Like did you have any friends that were going or this was kind of a solo effort? Well, I got to ride I think the 300 um I rode with DCR with in DC and I got to ride with Mary for a little bit and that was meet them for the first time and that was really
that’s great.
I was like got to fang girl out with with them and just like kind of get dusted by them as their tandem
climbed the first hill, you know, just get dropped. But it was great, you know, and then and then and then and then like the the New Jersey folks, bunch of folks from the fist and like
Yeah.
Let’s get back to the fist. That’s my real
Let’s get back to the fist.
Okay. Were the was the whole fist crew doing it or not?
Not the whole, but like the majority like I think and and folks are there these guys are doing all kind of stuff. There’s different representatives of the fist all over the world riding 1200s at any given time. There’s like it’s just like and it’s you know this weird assortment of people you might find in a major city like everyone from like urban planning types to surgeons to engineers to like community organizers
um who are just doing this thing together that has nothing to do with whatever the hell else you do in your life. Um, but there’s some people with a lot of time and money to burn and they’re like, you know, doing Yeah. people are riding le this this summer and people riding in Italy and
um and so there was like a crew that I think it was like I know VM Vadim Gritz was out. Um Chris Sloum was out and I don’t think Gil or Will or Mario wrote No, they didn’t ride 23. they had written
um the the in in 19 um and they one of their things one of the lessons that I always gleaned from those guys um and Bill Olsson is kind of the elder statesman. He’s got like big big numbers in in Rousa. I think he’s got a three-digit ID like but he’s um he’s he’s kind like one of the things that they’re just have no problems with is dnfing, you know, like it’s like that’s part of the game, you know? I early on for me I was like I can’t I’d be so I’d be so devastated if I couldn’t you know and that’s just like that was always I think just kind of all the pitfalls all the potential like
you know roadblocks problems ways that things can go wrong are just natural uh you know they’re naturally a part of it and we can’t get too worked up about it and that’s kind of an ethos of this um set of set of folks that I really appreciate. So then Mark, you decide you’re going to fly to France. Any kind of thoughts about the logistics. You’re on the east coast, so maybe not as bad, but it’s still challenging. Like I would imagine with a family, you didn’t have a huge amount of time.
One of my friends told me who’s a she’s a pediatrician. um she when she traveled with with her family um I saw her like earlier in the probably in the spring of 23 and she told me about this app to sort of start sleep training and so you start to sleep earlier go to sleep earlier and wake up earlier you start to get acclimated like in the two weeks prior you don’t start it much maybe in the 10 days prior I forget the name of it now but I think there’s several options for this but I actually was like that seems good and I did that it really was consequential in like five days prior where I had to like really change kind of change things. Um but I that I think that was a good approach around sleep. Um I like you know I got a good bike box. I invested in a bike and a good box instead of doing cardboard or whatever. I think that’s obviously always part of it and just um but one of the things that was challenging for me was like I had had a built bike built for me by our local keeper of the flame Johnny Coast in uh the the winter prior and there was timing timing around that. I was not smart about the timing around that. So, one of my lessons big time was like um like just like and reflections was like I think I didn’t have everything dialed in with my machine where it needed to be in time. You know what I mean? So, so like I think figuring out all that stuff as far in advance as possible as many veteran redditors will tell you like is is was for me like uh absolutely true and it was a was important lesson I learned to my to my detriment. Um um so getting there and and like I I think I I think I flew on Wednesday and you know we my start time was Sunday like 6:45 p.m. Lwave and so I like had a day you like fly in Wednesday night, Thursday morning, build the bike Thursday, shake down and then I had like all day Friday to kill. And so I just rode into Paris. I stayed in um I stayed in a small town like I think two train stops out from um Rambuier and I’m forgetting the name right now. Yeah,
I’ll remember it in a second. But um I just wrote it was like I did a 50-mi loop of Paris and just saw everything, ate everything, like just kind of bombed around with no set schedule. I like went to like on some pilgrim, you know. I went to cycle sec and I went to Alex Singer
and they were already they were they were already gone. They were already in with their tent set up unbeknownst to me. But I got to just and then I saw the touristy things and just um had a just a lovely time in a way that I
I never get to do you know in my like just completely have a day riding around a beautiful uh city. Yeah. And you know, I remember um because I like you arrived a few days early in 2019 and also 2023. You have this kind of building nervousness in your stomach and you don’t know where it’s coming from. Like and then you realize, oh my god, like somewhere deep in there, this is a big deal, right? Is that right?
Absolutely. Like buzzing, you know, completely. And then then you kind of like what do I do with this energy? So, so it’s good to just got to I know some people went out like further a field
at the hotel, you know, just that’s where I met RV and Brian White from Portland. We kind of were just, you know, we were nerding out about steel bikes,
um, augling each other’s machines and
weird. Yeah.
You know, and that was totally just wonderful part of of that.
Yes.
Couple days uh in the leadup. Um,
well, let me ask you a quick question about your bike then. So, built by Johnny Coast. I like that name already, by the way. That’s cool.
Yeah.
And what were your kind of requirements? Yeah. So, I I wanted I’m it, you know, pretty pretty uh kind of traditional like 4630 double um handlebar bag. I really like am into like you know I just uh RV and I found each other for a reason. It was like oh you’re into some stuff that I’m into and uh
it was kind of it was kind of a a meet cute that involved steel bikes not actual the humans meeting. It was just the two steel bikes meeting. Okay. completely completely and um and at that point I didn’t one thing I didn’t have in dialed in was my saddle issues so that became that was a
an issue. Yeah. Okay.
That became an issue and and um you know I I thought I I got it as close as I could. I got things in place but um but I think um so at that point I didn’t have you know leather saddle. It was like, you know, pretty pretty traditional kind of randoner um setup.
Um I was running like a including like I I think I was running I was running Mayfacids that I e gotten from French eBay and then I I refurbished myself. And I did I built the bike myself and um and then I was running these these TA cranks that um ultimately like didn’t play nice with my IRD derailers and that also became an issue. So again was just like
nice some foreshadowing a lot of foreshadowing foreshadowing and I and I went for the like classic build but like didn’t take enough time in the leadup to ensure like one
1,00% that everything was as dialed in as it could be. So yeah, that that turned into issues later.
So let’s talk about then the start line. How did you feel prescribed a scene?
Yeah, I mean it was electric. It was just like I think watching the 80 hour I I I went in to Vambooier like early in the day. So, I had a 645 start and then that was that was one thing like for that like if you’re starting later in the day, it’s maybe nicer to stay close to if you can get a hotel closer, you know, cuz I had to sort of like check out and then be in kind of just hanging out all day as well.
It was hot. Yeah. and and and then and so I think just some some planning around what you’re going to do with your energy and and trying to rest and just relax in the the time before you start. But, you know, I I I got to watch the you know, I watched the other waves and just kind of soaking up that energy, making sure I was fueling up um and staying hydrated and um and Mark, were you were you riding with anyone? Was that your plan or you just going to, you know, take it as as it came? So, I have a friend Mariano from um here in Brooklyn who’s who rides the NJ the NGR rides with me and also Boris. They were um they were like not my same start time, but they were like K or they were around me. We were keeping in touch and I think at that point I wasn’t sure where RV like was in the I think we found each other really on the course then. Um we didn’t like you know we didn’t coordinate. I mean, I think um that’s part part of the beauty and and magic of it all. It’s just like
being able to like kind of prepared to ride your own ride, but also like having people, you know, is completely lovely and can be necessary just like for for energy, for morale. It’s true,
you know.
So, anyway, so you took off. Uh was it faster the original start? Maybe just Yeah, let’s just go through the whole thing. So then you you took off. You’re excited. 645 took it out, you know, took it out faster than, you know, it just the excitement of it all and but but with my eyes open, you know, full of making intentional choices, being
being generally like aware and not pushing it too hard, but like being like I think it’s it’s one one thing that’s amazing and I I don’t I haven’t had the privilege of riding in in as much uh hugely diverse set of regions in the United States. So I don’t know like peacelining culture in in different regions in in New Jersey. It’s not huge and that you know part of like you know the terrain we’re riding in and like you know how do people practice and culturally as a as a sort of group of humans is the thing that like it just wasn’t something that I had the opportunity to fully practice and like and then in PVP all of a sudden you’re like in in pacelines’s major and you can really work it work through it and I I was hungry for that you know so I think so the the speed also had to do it it was it was faster coming out the gate, but also like wasn’t necessarily burning the type of energy that I would be had I just been on my own and and that sort of later start also I feel like the the end was beautiful also the start was beautiful to go into the night that like line of tail lights red tail lights down these gently sloping into the dark as far as the eye can see was just
amazing just magical and um yeah and so like yeah we I think Arby talked about like we rode So I think we found each other at some point then maybe at the first control or I don’t have in my notes when we actually linked up but then we we we linked up and we we rode through the Ludiac and before sleeping before our first big sleep.
Okay, great.
Yeah.
And and at that and heading out, sorry to cut across you. I think heading out I was like I’m going to just my my initial plan was just to ride as long as I can till I really feel like I need to sleep. like I I didn’t have like a in terms of the initial it was just like I got to I got to take that part as it comes. I’m not going to plan and like you know I think Vadim who I ride with a lot he was like he got his own hotels like along the route he does that thing.
Yeah.
And I was like no I’m just going to see how it goes.
Nice.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So then um you and RV just ended up kind of hanging out with each other and writing. Tell me, were you kind of you were sort of in the bulge, is that right? Like you there’s a lot of So you’d go into a control. There’s a lot of people. Was that overwhelming or or not?
Yeah. I I think I didn’t get too stressed out about how long it took it when when I was in it because it was kind of like what are you going to do? I did it and I I think I was cognizant of it and and also just kind of like barreling kind of tunnel vision like just like uh and I didn’t I think I didn’t have I think in the in the planning like the way some people are like I’m going to like get food at grocery stores but just h high tail it in and out of the control get my card stamped and try not to eat. I think maybe I’ll experiment with that in the future. Um because I think the eating and sitting it’s like if you if you can if you’re going to sleep elsewhere, you’re gonna rest in a different way. Um that can be I I think that’s a recipe. It’s a that’s a sound strategy that I ultimately like I didn’t really engage in the and certainly in the first part.
Yeah. And the first half
and it sound like you both made good time though, isn’t that right? So everything was going well. Did you have sort of at least an idea of okay I’m three hours ahead of my plan or was that even a thing for you?
I would say for me so you know RV is like very data driven. He’s like he’s like that he’s very technical. So it was good to like I mean that was an amazing
Yeah. thing that he brought to the table and and also so I I was more a little bit like that wasn’t I wasn’t I’m just not that type of rider and and I and I don’t have enough experience on the the grand burves like the longer ones to be like really coherent and sharp enough to think through I’m this this far behind and I need to do this to do this because it’s it’s I’m just in the phase of my development where it’s like
I’m doing the best I can I am paying attention to when the controls open and close. But that in itself also seems
hard for me to
Oh, completely. No, I think that’s so standard, right?
Yeah. You keep doing trying to do math in your head, but you can never get to the end of the equation. And even if you do, you don’t retain the answer, so you keep going back again.
That Yeah.
Yeah. So, when was the first maybe challenge? Like when did things start going maybe south, if they did at all?
Yeah. I think there was like I remember feeling like at Ludiac it’s what what’s the distance at Ludiac?
I think it’s about would it be about 800 maybe?
Yeah. 7 782. 782.
That’s on the way back.
Is that the That’s the return.
Yeah. So it’s probably 400. Would it be 400? Maybe Yeah. So, um, yeah, I started having ass issues like at a certain point, you know, it was like it was like, “Oh, that’s like that’s not good.”
Yeah.
That doesn’t feel great,
you know. And then, you know, and I had all my I had my tools of the trade because at that point I was kind of like going in like really kind of fingers crossed because I I had ridden the series and I had discomfort and I was
um working off like what is it? The ludic ludicine lidocaine. I was using that and then I was using some of this like rub. It was like almost like a stick like um waxy stick rollon stick and I just started applying that um and was like okay here we are this is what it’s presenting and then uh and then at a certain point and I can’t remember also the the sort of mechanical issue I think it was after the turnaround and after our our runin with the um municipal uh militia or the the the uh Britney militia Yeah.
Um but then but the my my front re derailer just stopped work. Like it just wasn’t working. So I was like I was manual. I was just like fy like when I had to drop to my to my uh small gear on the climbs I’d have to like reach down and fish it back up.
Basically the second half
enjoyed that. Yeah. Old school.
You know at a certain and you know that thankfully didn’t it didn’t throw me off. I I kind of just was dialed in enough where I was just like this is what it is. And and after that experience with the um uh uh with this this running this red light and this cop threatening to
let’s talk I think that deserves its own um tell us about what what happened there. Yeah. So like Arvy said coming out of out of breast and the turnaround and you know just the emotion of that and the the sort of beautiful you taking our photos on the bridge etc and just like really being excited about that. I think Harvey gave a good account just in terms of like it’s the Brooklyn and the Bay Area kids just doing their head check. we’re clear, not even thinking twice, you know, and just like and then, you know, right away the like, you know, big pink face. Whoa. Like with with the safety vest on and you just like and um and I I just we kind of like I was just what the hell is going I just you know kind of like what is going on right now? And thankfully I mean RV’s RV’s friendship is really good. So, I mean that was it would have been a different experience if if I was dealing with that on my own. Um, and but yeah, we he wasn’t able to talk us out of it. So that’s
we were just like it it you know and like again like Harvey said I think it it really crystallized like
everything just came sharp out of the you know adversity sharpening our our focus sharpening that you know
I know you had something to to kind of rally against isn’t that right? Um, yes. Tell me, did you did you understand like what he was the penalty he was going to give you or you then had to ask Arvy or Arvy then told you that guy just gave us was it a two-hour penalty?
Two hours. So, yeah, that I I understood and you know, I was
Yeah, my my French comprehension is better than my my verbal like my speaking, but I I was able to, you know, I I caught the gist that we were
Yeah. Like you guys are on these beautiful steel machines. You’re used to people just admiring them and then you meet some guy who
he’s not really into the whole thing.
No. No. And he’s just, you know, he’s paid to do a job and
and he did it and uh Well, at that point, did you think, okay, how many hours do you remember how long it took you to get to breast? I don’t.
Okay. But was the two hours a threat to you, you know, getting there by 90 hours? Getting home by 90 hours? Well, so and it was interesting. I was I I remember so I was telling the story. I was in the group chat with the fist guys and they were cheering me on like, you know, you’re going to be good. They they were really concerned around the closing times on the controls. So getting be behind and and I think there was a clarification at a certain point. We asked on the on the on the return like what’s what’s the penalty andor like what do we what’s the threat here if we’re coming in if we’re pushing the limit on the the the open and close the close times for the controls and and at two different controls there there was like it was kind of like pretty relaxed and like that’s that was like an answer we got like don’t worry about that just keep moving and Um, and so that was I think that in terms of like the the potential penalty to going from a 90 hour um kind of time horizon to an 88 hour um there was a couple element. Yeah. So there was the control times element and then there was the the just like what’s the total um that we have left. So yeah, I think Harvey explain I I recall it being like okay we can do this one is like we can do this and it was like we’re not going to let we’re not going to let this be the end of our ride. We’re going to like can can we figure out how to do this and then we just doing the math and sitting with it and be like we can do this is like generally it was like a three hours on 15inute nap. Okay.
That was like with with like I think two hours extra kind of discretionary flex.
Yeah.
And and we needed all of that. But that that was a it was a good plan and it it generally worked like I think and that included us needing to do our own thing. Like I I know I took like an hour nap at a certain point and I we leap frog each other and then we caught up later. Um um and he similarly I think he had a different like longer nap at a certain point
but then yeah I mean like RV explained we we really were for for quite a good chunk of the that that the return we were like three three hours on we set alarms we you know find a nice spot to ditch to take the nap to take the ditch nap and um I just got so much I had so much fun taking photos of just the zombie apocalypse of Brandon’s You know, I I I loved your your your conversation with Army about that, but it just was like I just got such a kick. It’s like a natural disaster. I I like to tell people, which isn’t a nice thing to say, but it’s like Jonestown basically or something. That’s terrible. I know, but yeah.
Okay.
Um
I’m here for it.
So, how many hours sleep do you think you got total?
Total? I think I probably I think I probably got five. Okay. And was there any time after the the cop um gave you those two additional hours that you said I’m not going to make it? No.
Okay, good. So,
I mean there Yeah, as far as like emotionally andor like really thinking through the plan if we didn’t I didn’t hit a point at which I was like physically or Yeah. like like psychologically. Yeah. I didn’t
buy I didn’t reach that point where I wasn’t dialed in. I just was we were just we were dialed in.
Um and we knew we were gonna need to like you know like if we had gone to sleep and not woken up. Yeah.
You know like that would have been a problem. That would have been panic stations. But we didn’t we just didn’t reach that. We just kept
we kept grinding and kept kept moving forward. Pedal came up. We pushed it down again. You know just all those all those mantra drawing on all the mantra.
Yeah. It sounds like you were very lucky to find each other because you worked really well together after that. But, you know, when you think about it, it was probably Arvy’s fault that you got those two hours. When I think about it, I think it was his fault. Who was first through the red light? I definitely think it was Arvy’s fault. Okay. Well, there you go. There you were the victim.
I’m going to back you up on that.
Absolutely.
Um,
so then was there a time maybe you’re 100 kilometers out and you’re thinking, you know what, we are going to do this.
Do you remember that at all? Did you do you remember just feeling I think you said you arrived at the finish line in the early hours. Yeah.
Was it an amazing feeling as you got closer and closer?
Yeah. That last like 100 miles, I mean, it was kind of, you know, it’s it’s it’s kind of it’s kind of like like Yeah. You don’t you’re you’re sort of holding out till the last moment when you can kind of like just feel solid about like this is this is happening. This is this is going to happen. Mark, that is so true because you’re almost afraid to start counting your chickens or anything. You know that you cannot do that. But then there does come a point where
there comes that point.
Yeah. I’m not that far away. I think I’m going to do this. That’s cool.
Yeah. And and I I tend to I’m, you know, not unique, but like I I do get a I solidly like tend to finish strong. like the the last sort of 50 miles of of Bervade, I like get an energized, you know, I get that extra couple of percent where it’s just like it pulls me
pulls me forward and and yeah, that that happened for us and the golden glorious sunset riding in those winding roads through the forest.
Amazing. Amazing.
Yeah.
So, I’ve got three more questions for you.
Yeah.
Um before I ask you, are you going to do it again? I’m going to ask you about the people of France, the supporters, that kind of thing. Any any comments about that? Yeah, I mean that that kind of just the depth of history and and the cultural kind of fabric of of of cycling of like being part of this event of its importance to this region the many regions along it and and in the bigger kind of history of cycling in France it just like that it’s just beautiful. It’s just so meaningful and and like seeing three or four generations of a family or set of families in a town, a little town, it’s cheering you on. It’s just everything that everybody says about how cool that is is true.
Yeah.
And I also think
cuz you know, I had kids as well. Still have them. But it’s kind of really special when your kids are at home or whatever and you see all those kids at the side of the road. It’s so cool.
Actually, I forgot to ask you about your ass. I don’t say that to another man very often, but I did forget to ask. Did it get worse or did it just maintain and it was just painful the whole way?
It it pretty much plateaued and it was like, you know, yeah. So like the and I had to deal like in the two years prior it just like it became a thing after I reached like 400k and above
and I just wasn’t able to figure it out. And I’m I feel like I’m starting to turn a corner on that with I changed the seat post and I’m I’m using one of those springy seat posts and I’m trying a different non non-leather
saddle, one of these specialized saddles right now and that the the Burvey rode recently like I like it was different. It was actually quite different. And it’s, you know, these things take so much trial and error and time and and money too. Like you got to try and figure it out. But at that point I was like if this doesn’t change you know it’s kind of just paying so much attention to those micro levels of discomfort and it’s like where’s your threshold and like can I keep like you know just a lot of just changing position constantly and was like it was pretty much a constant like a high level of discomfort that didn’t go into excruciating territory and like I’m ending my ride like it’s it was another kind of like you know sharpening of like I’m not going to let this be the thing that ends this this ride. I’m going to if it stays here, I can I can manage it. And I I felt really determined in that. Um
perfect.
So, yeah.
Cool.
And and you know, a lot of lot of love and and um and camaraderie and solidarity with all my fellow sufferers of any type of saddle sores. They can be they can come in so many different shapes and sizes and uh and it can be just a hard thing to deal with.
Yeah. And I also think part of it is it’s just not normal for a human to do 1,200k and not feel pain down there. So anyway,
you know,
so tell me about um are you going to do it again?
Yeah, I I’ll love to and I think my my daughter really is like you need to do it next chance you get so I can come with you.
That’s very important there. So we’ll see.
Well, you got to make her happy. like as if you just like, yeah, maybe maybe we’d try and take a trip uh and do a vacation and without me riding PBP. That could also be something we consider um but as an excuse to get get over there and you know because I
Yeah, I really, you know, I I I it was it was amazing. It was like one of the coolest things I’ve ever done. So,
did you feel even during maybe the lowest points of that ride in 2023 that I’m definitely coming back or I definitely would like to come back or is it something that happened afterwards? Afterwards for me, yeah, it was definitely like enjoying in in it just being in it. It’s just like being in a different time time warp being is so all consuming in it and and I think I wasn’t thinking ahead. That wasn’t like but but after like in sort of recovering the day after and like I certainly couldn’t think about sitting on a bicycle anytime and in fact the next year I barely rode in 2024. I was the lowest mileage I’ve gotten you know I barely
you know in part because I was trying you know I got a whole really serious bike fit. I did a bunch of interventions trying to figure out this stuff that I didn’t get to do beforehand. So again um lessons lessons learned but but yeah
but yeah it definitely grew as in ter terms of like the meaning of it the the her you know what it what it’s what it meant for me then and what the memories that I developed and what what I’d like to share with other other people as well. So and continue to um
cool
enjoy that. All right Mark um well hopefully I will see you in 2027. Let’s end then with your three tips for someone
who uh wants to do the next PBP. What do you recommend?
Yeah. Um so I think um I think I spoke to this but just to give the most you can to preparation uh and be content with what you can give. So like finding finding a good a good acceptant of what you can give to the to the prep, you can do it. And uh and then I think tip two would be to enter the PVP year with the bike and the gear completely dialed in. So like everything as much as possible if there’s anything mechanical or otherwise fitwise really the year prior in the qualifying year like really really trying to or even earlier even the you know really kind of having experience of qualification and the PVP year itself where like
you’re really not dealing with major stuff
with dialing in the bike. Yeah. And then um I think just per Arby’s like we really bonded around the sort of jazz metaphor. I think just cribing from him just the balance between planning and anticipating and reacting to the inevitable changes to the plan and like I think that that was really important for me and and not being too attached to an outcome but just to to ride my ride. Cool.
Yeah,
Mark, it’s been an absolute pleasure. I’m glad that RV got us together. Really enjoyed this. Thank you. It’s a pleasure to meet you. Okay. Likewise. And thanks for all the the work you’re doing um sharing these stories, Peter. I look forward to riding with you someday.
Definitely.