England Rugby player and now British and Irish Lion, Fin Smith joins us on the Fozcast this week and in this clip, we look at what football should take from Rugby to improve the game!
From how players respect referees to when teams find out lineups – this insight is 🔥 for fans of both sports.
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28 Comments
I’ve always been rugby over football. It’s far ahead of football, rules and even tech involved in the sport; with far less money involved. Love Finn smith I’m not a saints fan there is him and maybe 2/3 more out of his team that I like as a rival but there is more respect in rugby I love it
Might be on my own here but I appreciate rugby so much more now because of the personalities and temperaments of players which are far superior to football, lads put their bodies on the line and shake hands after.. Football is way worse than 10-20 years ago and the players aren’t anywhere near as talented. Rugby is miles better. Look at the semi finals of the champions cup last week. Unreal.
He just looks like an average bloke, but each week he goes out and plays full contact tackle rugby against some of the most brutal physical specimens on earth.
can't stand football
Erm, they tried advancing the ball ten yards for dissent. It was quickly dropped.
I once worked with a bloke who loved football to the point here he thought rugby was a terrible place to take his kids as they was drunk and continued to say football was a much more relaxed and enjoyable experience than the “pissheads” of rugby… that’s how delusional football fans really are this stupid bloke refused to admit or acknowledge theirs football hooligans and complete and utter disrespect towards officials. Rugby would never.
If I were bringing up my son again I would get him into rugby big time. I’ve seen Pollock and Freeman on podcasts recently and they were respectful, intelligent and listened to experienced players intently. Football should learn.
Quality interview, Finn is such a nice lad.
Fester shut up you lieing coward
As a former rugby player, the respect given to the referee is sacrosanct. Imagine if an EPL referee on the first day of a new season sent a game-changing number of players off, and was then able to explain why post-game. "They called me a c**t multiple times".
Just a thought, I'm not saying refs in non-league football don't take a bit of stick from players and fans, but it's much less than the entitlement culture you see at the top of the pyramid. I follow a team in the 8th level, and one of the players was in my house the other week fitting a dishwasher. It's real football at a real club, owned and run by the local community. Very different from the nonsense in the Premier League. Plus, I can bring my dog…
Love the chat – a crossover I never knew I needed!
A lot of the "rugby culture" has stood the test of time since the amateur days… I think the team-first mentality is definitely one of these scenarios
I've heard Nigel Owens (International rugby ref) say he did a shadowing event with an EPL ref. The opening interaction between the ref and captains shocked him because the ref was swearing at the captains before the game even started. His comment was if they want respect they need to start showing it first.
As an ex rugby player and now a community rugby coach, the ref is always sir and it often feels as though you are a school child. However with 30 blokes in a physical game and only one pair of eyes refs need to be switched on. On occassions I have let my emotions get the better of me and I've had the ref give me some alternatives. However unfair I think he is, I've apologised and we've discussed sensibly post match. I've been with spectatotors getting emotional and the comment I always make is that the ref will not change their mind. I know the inference is that you can influence them later and sometimes it works. My local club has had issues with some players and supporters and points deductions in the league and potential demotion has had a really sobering effect on behaviour. The result is that the club have sanctioned players and supporters even before a tribunal hearing.
I've also reffed community games and have set out with the players and coaches the behaviour I expect. A reminder during the game if the behaviour is unbecoming normally works but if needed, sanctions, which could be 10m, reversing penalties or even yellow cards (10 minute removal from play) in exceptionally circumstances normally has the desired impact.
The Dylan Hartley episode meant he missed a potential Lions tour, which to a Home Nations player is huge. Dylan did swear, the debate was whether it was directed towards the ref. The ref believed it was and hence the sanction.
Didn't grow up with either sport as I grew up abroad – but I fell in love with rugby over football purely because of the sporting culture. I love the sport of football, but I can't stand the egos and divas involved in it.. It's sad, as I want to love it.
Overpaid boy morons v intelligent men.
Actively trying to avoid my boys getting into football. Nothing to aspire to, behaviour wise, from the top down.
Agree. We need to show refs more respect…
I’ve listened to the rugby podcasts with the other Northampton saints players and genuinely this podcast is so much more insightful into their day to day work and a far better discussion. Well done!
Finn talking about the starting 15 hasn't got to the nub of the issue, rugby being a physical game means that all 23 players in the matchday squad tend to be used, so its frequently starters and finishers or starters and impact players. And depending on the team and opposition the more experienced or "better" players may be on the bench at the start of the game.
Players are also limited to a number of game minutes over the season and so they have to be rested if they are not injured. Also post the last international period (6 Nations) all England players who had more than x minutes (dont know what the x was) had to rest for 1 of the 1st 3 club games after the 6 nations. There is a lot more player welfare going on in rugby.
The talking back to the ref thing, i think it would have a huge wider social impact and teach young lads how to conduct themselves in public
All very well asking Premier League teams to change thier attitudes and behaviour but the likes of Athleticio Madrid would need to follow too! They are shocking especially in the UCL games!
The key to the Dylan Hartley sending off was twofold. The commentators, including ex-players, all agreed that if he had sworn at the ref as the ref thought, then being sent off was the only option. And the authorities backed the ref with a proper ban. No one suggested it was just words, or the ref should have had a thicker skin. If the ref awards a penalty in rugby and someone whines, leading the ref to move the offence 10 metres forward making it kickable, no one says it’s a bit soft. They all agree it was avoidable by the player not saying anything. It’s really not hard to sort out.
The other thing I cannot get my head round the abuse hurled at refs by the players on the pitch when a call goes against them is why they bother. Not once. Not once. Have I ever seen a referee reverse the decision because of it. So it makes no difference, completely futile, and just nasty. As Fin said, why would anyone want to be a football referee? The lack of respect is appalling. Players should be ashamed of themselves honestly.
I think the first step in football is to mic the referees up, same as they do in rugby. It would help the fans at home form an opinion as to whether the referee is being fair or not and it also holds referees accountable to ensure they are fair. From there, the mutual respect between players and officials will follow. The players have to know they’re not being cheated while the referees have to feel safe and know that every decision isn’t going to be received with volatility in return
Fin is a nice lad. Happy to be able to support him this summer as an Irish fan.
In the Welsh leagues we have introduced the blue card. If any players swear at the ref, it's an instant blue card and 10 minute timeout. Reduced the abuse the ref got instantly
I didn't expect such a good performance from Fin Smith in the 6 nations match against France. Seems like a really good player