PBP Story #43: This week we are honored to have Deirdre Arscott, who lives in Vancouver, British Columbia and holds the female record for most PBPs. Every 4 years, from 1987 to 2023, she has returned to PBP, 7 times as a single and 3 times as a tandem rider. Hear about Deirdre’s remarkable 10 PBPs and how the ride has been part of her life since she was 32 years old.
Paris Brest Paris: PBP Stories and Tips
Join Peter Curley (PBP ’19, ’23) as he interviews the riders who have completed (and DNF’ed!) Paris Brest Paris, the most famous (and oldest) endurance ride in the world. Learn firsthand what to expect and how to give yourself the best chance of a successful PBP.
Paris Brest is a long-distance cycling event with a rich history. Established in 1891 as a professional race, it has evolved into the premier amateur endurance cycling event. Every four years, thousands of cyclists from around the world attempt to finish PBP’s grueling 1,200-kilometer (745-mile) route, within the 90 hour time limit.
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10 PBP Stats (2023)
Participants = 6431
Finish rate = 76%
Average age = 51
Oldest female & male = 69 & 79
Youngest female & male = 17 & 17
Female participation = 7.24%
French participation = 29.03%
Charly Miller (56:40) = 12
Adrian Hands (88:55) = 62
Club with most riders = San Francisco Randonneurs
Two quick thank yous before we talk to Deerra. First of all, I want to thank Paul Adonah who I interviewed last year. Paul sent me some very nice PBP memorabilia which I really appreciate. So, thank you very much Paul. Secondly, I want to thank Raul from the Netherlands. Raul sent me a very nice beer. I have it here. It’s a ghost town beer. It’s a Bay Area beer from Oakland. Very tasty. So, thank you so much, Raul. If anyone else wants to send me a beer, I never say no. Now, on to DRA. This week, we were honored to have Deardra Arcott, who is originally from Cambridge, England, but has lived in Canada for 58 years. Every four years since 1987, she has visited and completed PBP successfully. for 10 PBPs between 1987 and 2023 is a record for a female rider. So nice to meet you, dear. Thank you. Lovely to meet you, too. I’ve been really looking forward to hearing about all 10 PBPs, so we’re going to be here a long time, and that’s fine. Okay. Uh, all right. I always start with this one. What does PBP mean to you? Well, when the first couple of times I did it, I thought it was a cycling event, but as the years went by, I think of it more as a French tradition and cycling is almost secondary with, you know, those people in Normandy and Britany are they’re just so proud that the event goes through and they they support it so well. And yeah, the cycling in some ways is almost secondary to the whole tradition of it. And did you have any idea in 1987 at the age of 32 that this would become such a big part of your life? Well, I’m going to tell you something I’ve never told anyone before. That’s what we’re here for. That’s what we’re here for. Did scoop. Not Not even my husband. I remember when I finished, people asked me if I’d do it again, and I said yes. But in my mind, I thought I could do this 10 times. That’s hilarious. Yeah. I didn’t realize how hard that was going to be. Yeah. And you know, we’ll talk more about the individual 10 times, but you know, the idea of a streak, I think f, you know, it fascinates me. Um, when did this become kind of a a streak in your life that almost had to be defended, if you know what I mean. You felt you had to keep going every four years. I never really felt like I had to go cuz I just wanted to go. Okay. So, and is there any other streaks in your life? Is there anything else like this in your life? No. Okay. All right. Maybe So, maybe it’s not a streak. It’s just happens every four years organically, right? Do do you remember the first finish line in 1987 the last millennium? I remember it well because it the event started and finished just outside of the Paris itself like within it started and finished within 10 kilometers of lion for 10 kilometers from the Eiffel Tower. So it we had to go way through the suburbs to get to the finish. And it was the afternoon and the streets were lined with people. I’ve never seen anything like it. And they screaming at all the participants and screaming at me because I’m a woman and I was totally overwhelmed. It was I couldn’t smile. I was so overwhelmed. I felt like crying. Amazing. And you know, it just must have been so different in 1987. You know, first of all, there weren’t many foreigners. There weren’t many Canadians or English people. Maybe at that time you were still feeling English. I’m not sure. No, I can I felt like I was Canadian. Okay. And there weren’t many females. So, it was just a very foreign experience, I would imagine. It was extremely foreign because you know you don’t have Google Street View or anything like I had a paper map paper maps that I carried with me in case I went off course and I’d never been out of Canada since I had arrived or I had actually I had but uh I’d never been to Europe before and uh very very different not the same kind of information you you know you can’t couldn’t get information and then advance completely. Yeah, it’s a very very different world today. Everything is so connected and there’s less discovery of stuff. I think you you almost experience things before you do them in today’s world. Um, you know, just one brief comment and I was thinking about this that to be the female with the most finishes is incredible, but to do it from Canada, right, because you introduce that sort of logistical um challenge, it’s incredible, right? It is amazing that you were successfully able to make the trip 10 times. A lot of it is luck, too, though. A lot of it is luck. I mean it a lot of it’s preparation and organization but there’s a lot of luck involved. I agree like I think um you can control only so much of PVP the outcome right but that logistical coming from Canada wow the fact that you manage that for 10 times is pretty incredible anyway dear let’s talk just maybe about the your background in cycling your first memory on a bike that kind of thing. Well, in England, I’m one of six kids, and we had one of those big British trikes. Do you you know that they have a chain on them? Like they’re big, sturdy bikes with a chain, and one kid stands on the back and the other pedals. I’ve got a picture of myself on the one of those bikes. Yeah. Yeah. My brothers and sisters, we used to ride that around all the time. Yeah, Cambridge here if I’m not sure if you’ve been to Cambridge, you know, people ride bikes. There’s bikes everywhere, even now in Cambridge. So, I came from an area where it was just natural to ride a bike. Yeah. Was there anything um special in particular about when you start riding a bike or was just standard kind of I’m a kid, this is fun? Uh, I think that but when I came to Canada, I didn’t have a bike for a few years. Uh, partly because I was a teenager and I didn’t want to look nerdy, but I worked a whole summer babysitting so I could buy a bike. So, yeah. I mean, not many teenage girls do that. So true. And then I think you said you were what were you 12 when you moved to Canada? Was that the age? So, at what age did you really sort of get into biking in Canada? Uh, well, ever since I bought that first bike and then again, I had to work for forever to get a 10-speed bike at the time and then I started touring a lot when I was starting about 17 years old. I would tour every summer. That’s cool. And before uh we went on air, you mentioned you first went to Montreal, worked your way across Canada, and now you’ve been in Vancouver. Was when did you actually make it to Vancouver, which to me sounds like a biking mecca? Uh 1981 I got here. So I’ve been here an awfully long time. Cool. And then the whole biking thing, when did it really when did the sickness kick in, dear? Um, some I guess at 1986 I started randering. Someone at work told me about a 100 kometer ride and I should have known right off the bat because I woke up and it was pouring with rain for this 100 kilometer ride and I thought this is silly and I went back to bed. I couldn’t stop talk thinking about it. I got up I didn’t even have time to eat breakfast. I went to the start and did the 100k. They told me told me about the 200 day and I couldn’t stop thinking about it and it went from there. Yeah. Imagine dearra if you were just like a regular normal person you would have just stayed in bed and we wouldn’t be having that this conversation today. Okay. It’s true. And do you remember the first time you heard the three letters PBP or par breast par? It it would have been we had some um uh some older men in our club. There were several riders that had already done it and talked about it. And when they talked about it, I knew I wanted to go. So cool. And obviously, maybe it’s not obvious, but very few women at that time, I would imagine even from your club, had done PBP. Is that correct? Uh no. Uh, no women had done it before, but uh, I went with a friend Barb Blepo and we did it together. That’s amazing. Um, and what was the name of the club in Vancouver? Is that the one you started with? Yes. British Columbia Randonurs. Oh, that’s cool. Um, and do you remember the kind of training involved to ramp up for PBP? Uh, well, I didn’t really know much about training. I did the series actually. I did the year before I did the series and I did a 10,00k ride and the 10,00k ride gave me the confidence that I might be able to do PBP. And so PVP year I did uh we just had the four rides for the 200, 300, 400, 600 and then um as the summer went on we try to just keep riding. Amazing. Amazing. And so it must have been Do you speak French? First of all, I speak bad speak French badly. Okay. But I could commu communicate. That’s cool. And do you remember kind of the the trepidation of the starting line in 1987 if there was trepidation? I was very nervous. I’m I’m still nervous. Okay. I mean, I did a 300 on the weekend and I was excited and nervous still. Yeah. That’s amazing. And definitely nervous. Yeah. And your friend, I’m sorry, I forgot her name. What was her name? Barbara. And Barbara and yourself really were kind of like a team trying to get through this together. Is that correct? Well, there we started riding with two other men in our club, but I mean, four people is too much really. It is. And we we figured we’d probably separate as the time went on, but we figured Barb and I would stay together and those men would stay together, but we were different speeds, so we we I ended up with, you know, we took a man each. That’s funny. And do you remember how you learned about strategy, you know, sleep, nutrition, how you break down, 1200k? Like who taught you all that? I’m not sure if I was taught that. My even now I think you have to think one control at a time. Uh it’s too much to think about a whole event. Like when I think about it, it’s a bit overwhelming. So one control at a time. And I like to think about where I’m going to sleep. How far should I go till I sleep? So, one day at a time, too. Wow. That’s And usually I think about how far I want to go the first day, how far I want to go the second day, and then I’m I’m slower, so there’s always a third night of sleeping. Um, so, but I don’t plan so much the third night because you don’t know what’s going to happen. Like, I’m hopeful of where I’m going to get, but not certain. Cool. Um before we go more into PBP itself, um you’ve made the trip 10 times, maybe talk a little bit about logistics and the challenges of logistics. I would imagine you’ve got quite a few stories about missing bikes, missing gear, or was it always plain sailing for 10 times? Um, I had never lost a bike, but the first time I went, I flew a Heathrobe. Um, because it uh it had been 20 years since I left England and I wanted to see England and uh when I left England, England was English. Yeah, I was not multinational and uh police did not carry guns and I arrived at Heathrow and there was an armed robbery in process and there were fleece and sirens and it was a bit scary and then I got my bike and my rear wheel had been crushed. Oh wow. Okay. And so, um, I took a bus to Windsor and asked around and they told me where to go to get a wheel built for PBP. And I went there and, uh, I didn’t realize he was a wellknown wheel builder, uh, highly recognized in England. And I told him I needed a wheel for PBP. And I for him looking me up and down and said, “Did you qualify? And I said, “Yes.” And he said, “Yes, ma’am. I’ll build you a wheel.” Oh, you’re back in England. No doubt about it. That’s But that’s kind of I don’t know. There’s They’ve never lost bikes, but there’s been a couple of times when there’s been bits broken, so it’s well worth getting there in advance to make sure you can get repairs done if you need to. Yeah. And the other thing I find is the flying is okay, but you arrive in Charles de Gaulle and the northeast corner and the event starts in the southwest corner of 50 kilometers away. Yeah. And you’re trying to get there with your bike in a suitcase. Uh it’s difficult. It is. It costs almost as much to cross Paris as it does to fly. So, in the 10 times you never were stressed getting to the starting line on time with a bicycle, not nothing in particular. Uh, in 2019, my one of my rims split and it took me a while to fit. Uh, I thought I was going to get a wheel rebuild, but no one wanted to do it. So, I bought a whole wheel and had the cluster moved over and that was fine. That was a bit stressful, but in general, it’s been okay. Yeah. Um, tell me about during the 10 times, the actual rise themselves. I’m sure you’ve had some dark moments. Um, any any dark moments that you want to talk about? Any ones that perhaps you said, “That’s it. I’m never coming back to PBP. I quit.” I always like to focus on the negative. That’s who I am. Sorry to I never thought I I never thought that. No, but I remember one time I was riding cannon with a friend and we were just flying along and uh we um we’re about 540 kilometers in and it was about 5:00 in the morning. It was pitch black outside and for some reason the chain tangled up into knots and we couldn’t undo it. Yeah. And so we broke the chain into three pieces to get it off. Oh god. And then we’re trying to put it together and the chain tool broke. Yeah. Oh my god. Wow. That’s I thought, “Oh, it’s over.” And um there’s no one on the road that we were kind of a bit ahead of the crowd and there’s no one there and this this fan pulls up and asks what the problem is and I tell them what the problem is and it’s an unmarked control car. Oh wow. And they have a whole tool kit and they hop out and they fix the chain and off we went. That’s incredible. Um, so you’ve done it seven times as a single rider, three times on a tandem. Just as an aside, can you contrast the experience as an individual versus having a partner on a tandem? Well, tandem is a real teamwork and um I mean once I did it with my husband on a tandem, but other times I was with two other men and of course so their partners have to be on board with this, you know, they’re part of the team almost kind of thing. Yeah. Um, you have to like 1,200 kilometers is a long way to ride with someone and have your feet tied together. So, you have to learn how to deal with the other person’s ups and downs as well. Uh, you know, let them be quiet when they need it and uh, you know, if they get uptight, you just you have to go with the flow a lot. Yeah. It it the other thing is like if I quit, the captain could probably ride the bike in without me, right? I’ve seen uh tandem captains go in without their stoker. But for me, if my captain quits, that probably means I’m out. So, right. So, that’s a consideration. Yeah. In fact, every time I’ve rode tandem, like things have happened. That’s the the chain the chain broke and then when I rode with my husband, he’s had arthritis and uh he has trouble with his arm. His tricep locks up. Yeah. And it spasms and uh it was really a problem when we were stopping every 45 uh minutes for 15 minutes to relieve his harm. And then we got to Mortano Pers and he said, um, I can’t go on. So we stopped for 12 hours there. We were flying along and we were lucky that we had the time in the bank and then it’s quite interesting cuz we’re in the dorms and every time I woke up there was a different person lying beside me at the dorm. Anyway, after 12 hours, we got up and decided to try and bring it in and we did. So, that was Oh, that’s wonderful. A relief. I Yeah, I suppose I hadn’t thought about that dynamic like if I ride with someone on two single bikes all the way through. At least you’re not connected together, right? Okay. And also just that dynamic between the captain and the stoker. The Stoker can’t ride it by themselves, but the captain can. So interesting. That’s funny. Um, any other like particularly dark moments as a single writer that you felt I mightn’t make make it to the end. In 1991, I rode with my brother. Okay. My brother lives in Montreal, so we’re 5,000 kilometers apart. and uh he heard me talk about PBP, so he wanted to go with me the second time. And um he phoned me, he was so excited, telling me he had done the 600 and he was ready to go. And I said, “Well, what was your time?” And he said, “39 and a half hours.” And I I said, “Did you have any sleep?” He said, “No.” And I said, “I think you need to train more.” and he said, “Why? I’m in the time lift.” Anyway, he he trained, but uh his bike fell apart just about on the ride and he lost his control card. His cleat wore out and he couldn’t clip in and one thing after another. And then that that year very very windy and um it took us 7 hours to get from Villain to Mortano P and I thought it was really over then and uh but we woke up and went in and we finished. That’s amazing. Did your brother ever do it again? No. Okay. That’s funny. Yeah. He lost 10 pounds. I thought it was water, but it ke the 10 pounds stayed off for six months. That’s amazing. That’s crazy. Um, I’ll ask some general questions. Um, what’s always been your sleep strategy for PBP and has it changed over those 10 times? Well, I like to sleep. Okay, that’s good. Um, well, at first I just I knew kind of where I wanted to be each night, but I’d just wing it. And there were hotels in all the little villages back then. A lot more hotels and for that matter bakeries and things were everywhere. So, you could get a hotel at the drop of a hat. And so, now I I find definitely is worth it to try and get a hotel room. And um yeah, so I book it a hotel in advance at least one night if not two nights and it makes a world of difference. You know, you’ve got your room, you’ve got a shower right there. It’s you know at the controls you if you’re in the dorms, the dorms in one room, the toilets are in another building, the showers are in another building. It’s very inefficient and to get a good night’s sleep in the dorms. People are snoring, cell phones are going off. It’s often not that warm in there. So, it’s I try to get a hotel room. Yeah. If I can. And again, looking at those 10 visits, what was approximately the one with the least amount of sleep and how? The one I did with my brother. Oh, wait. What was your brother’s name? We have to give him the name. I think. Oh, my brother’s Michael. Michael is a reoccurring character. Okay, we’re going to talk about him more. And how many? Two or three, four hours or something? In the whole of PBP? Yeah. Uh, we probably had eight hours sleep. Yeah. And then the most sleep you’ve ever got, do you remember? Uh, let me think. Um, probably when I was with my husband on the tandem. Yeah, I think we slept seven hours the first night and probably 5 hours the next night and then we got to Mortan or Pers and slept another 12 hours or so there. That’s funny. Um well, let’s talk about nutrition then. Just how you your strategy over those um 10 times and maybe has it evolved over time? At first I think it I find the controls easier to get through than before. Like the first start all 2000 well there were the fast people the 80our group and the 84hour group but not many in there. The the nearly all the riders were in the 90our group and we all started together in one mass group. Yeah. And there were the controls were really crowded and it was very slow to get food. Now I find it a lot easier to get food at the controls. There’s um less lineups and at first I didn’t realize that the controls, you know, they have the bars there. I thought a bar was for alcoholic drinks and of course you can get a sandwich and a coffee there very quickly and get out of the control in a hurry. So, um, I found out about that. Uh, what other I usually now you’ve got Google Street View now and Google search. I try and find out where grocery stores are in the control town so I can go there if I need to. Yeah. And uh, Cool. Um, what about weather? I’m sure you must have experienced everything over those 10 years. 10 10 times. the I’ve always been afraid of um uh heat. Okay. What do you call it? A heat wave. Yeah. Cuz when we arrived in 2003, there was a heat wave on and it was 40°. And it just broke about 2 days before PBP because a heat wave I think would be deadly for PBP. There’s no way I don’t I don’t think you could do it. Yeah. Yeah, but it the or I don’t know whether the organizers would cancel it though with the amount of effort that has gone in to it. Yeah. So, uh I’ve been lucky. It’s been very hot sometimes, but not deadly hot. Um Vancouver, it rains a lot here, so we’re prepared for rain and uh so I know what clothes to bring, you know, layers especially. And yeah, there was one year, was it 2011, I think. Was that the rainy year or 2015? 2007, it rained a lot. Yeah. The other thing is, you know, you bring your layers and usually I carry um piece of plastic, a square piece of plastic to put on my chest or Tyvec, the housing membrane, because if you’re really cold, just putting that in as well will bring your temperature up. Oh, it’s lightweight and doesn’t take any room. That’s cool. Any commentary on equipment, how it’s changed over the years. Uh, lighting has improved tremendously. I don’t like my eyes are quite bad now and I don’t see close up. Well, I don’t think I could do it on the lights we had back then. I think I had one of those Sanor bottom bracket generators in ‘ 87 and uh 91 I had um a light probably just three watt light powered by 4D cells. That’s crazy, huh? That’s amazing. And the other thing that’s happened is GPS devices. Back then we had the arrows but not as many arrows and they weren’t reflective. Now they’re reflective and in a lot of places they have the X if you’ve turned too soon on a roundabout or something. So it’s easier and you certainly don’t have to have a GPS device. And I just have a very simple one and it’s just very reassuring to look down and see that you’re still on the route. Yeah. So true. So true. Um is there anything about being I know we touched on this before about being a female writing PBP. You must have seen some changes, but 2023 it’s still only 7% are female at PPP. Sure. If I’ve seen changes, in some ways it’s good because the um the people on the side of the road are always very encouraging to women. Yeah. Um there’s the one thing I don’t like is um like the all the men are in the women’s washroom and which is okay but you know sometimes you you know I want to take my shorts off and wash my butt or something and I can’t I don’t feel comfortable doing that with 20 men in it. Oh, talking about that. Yes. One thing’s changed. We have our own showers now. In 1987, we stopped to shower, Barbara and I, and we went to the first shower room. We opened the door and it was all men. And he closed it and went to the next one and it was all men. And there’s this squeaky little voice from a corner, another woman saying, “Boy, am I glad to see you,” she said in French. We went in. And so we, you know, we’re in the change room with the men and then we go in and it’s a elementary school and it’s a shower room. Uh no individual cubicles. You’re just It’s one room with about 10 showerheads and you’re in there with the man. That’s great. We didn’t care. We didn’t care at that stage. That’s funny. Um tell me about the people of Britany, the support on the side of the road, things like that. Any thoughts on that? That’s probably why I want to go back every time is because I find it uh so touching. For instance, when you’re cycling through a village in the pitch black at night and the accordion starts playing those old French tunes like Babon Rose and other ones and I get all choked up. They’re playing it just for you. and uh the v decorated villages and the pe kids handing the food out and uh that really wet year we had a hotel everybody else stopped at Ludiac but we had a hotel 60 kilometers on so we went on in the really wet and we passed um a family in a garage um and no one was stopping so we stopped to talk to them and ate ate there. And 4 years later, we didn’t notice the garage, but we stopped about 50 m down the road cuz it was getting cold and we were putting our clothes on. The f this family starts running down towards us. They recognized us and came to talk to us and that’s hilarious. It’s so sweet. It is. Yeah. Like it is such a part of their experience as well. Isn’t that right through the years? Yeah. One of the neatest things that happened is riding talking to a Frenchman and I’m saying talking about the kids and how much fun it is that they’re feeding us and he said I’m from this region. That was me 10 years ago. That’s incredible. Yeah. Amazing. Amazing. Um, let me think. Do I have anything else I should ask you while I have you? Um, is there anything else you want to talk about just over those 10 10 trips? Anything else? Any stories in particular that we might covered? Um, I don’t know. There’s so many stories I could tell you forever. Well, we’ve got forever. Ask you in general about low points because that does fascinate me, right? How do you recover from low points? Because it sounds like you must have recovered because you’ve done it so many times. Well, I don’t like getting up in the morning. Okay. And PVP you’re like for me it’s very hard to ride in the couple of hours before dawn. And so I find that really hard. So also I can say you know you just keep the pedals turning. Make make sure you’re eating. Tell yourself you you know you know you’re going to feel better in couple hours. Think about getting try get to the next control. Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Uh another random question dearra. So every four years for 40 years you’ve been doing this right and we talked about this TV show called Seven Up which is that BBC show. Yes. which follows these kind of workingass upper upper class kids starts in the 50s I think and every seven years this TV program would check in on their lives and to me what you’ve done is a little bit similar okay every four years you know that you’re going to do PBP is is that the case like has it kind of impacted your life in a way that you start thinking about it okay I’m two years out now I gotta start training again or is it much more sort of organic and not as structured? Certainly the year before I I always do the random earth series and then the 1000 so I can set myself up to do it if I want to. Yeah. Yeah. And in your life with, you know, your husband, your family, all that kind of stuff, has it become like, “Oh, that’s Dea. It’s that time. The fourth year, we won’t see her that summer.” Uh, my husband’s been very supportive. Yeah. Okay, that’s good. But, you know, um, I have to train a lot more now. I’m getting older. So, you’re probably going to ask me if I’m going to do it again, maybe. And and I mean, I’d love to do it again, but I’m getting too slow. I think I could do it again, but it would mean an awful lot of training and being away from home. So, I’d have to really think about it, but I’m definitely getting slow. Okay. And yeah, and that’s an interesting thing. So, I know the last time you did it in 2023, you did it with a very strong cyclist. I think one of And it was still a struggle. Is that right? It was only a struggle because he had a cold. He he uh about an hour after the start line, he couldn’t talk cuz his throat was so sore and his face was ashen. Yeah. But he said he wanted to continue, so we did. But I think it was very hard for him and I think he I don’t know whether he would have continued if he was on a single or not. Yeah. I think I suspect he felt a certain he wanted to get you your 10th. Is that right? Yes. Yeah. So we just need to find someone else like that for number 11. Well, is this guy still around or not? Yes, but it’s standard broke. Okay. I think we have to reactivate Michael. Let’s get Michael training for two and a half years. Okay. Very good. That would be a really nice way to end the whole streak on a tandem, the two of you. Yeah, that’s cool. Are you going to do it again? Oh, yeah. I’m like you. I I did it. I My first one was when I was 50 and even and it was tough, you know, because I didn’t know what I was doing. I was with some friends, but even in the darkest moments, I said, “This is amazing. I’m I’m definitely coming back.” And I came back again, and I hope to keep doing it as long as possible. And I’m get I’m going to get to a point where I need to find some captain on a tandem to drag me around as well. Um, yeah. So, I will. How will you decide whether or not you’re going to do it then? because obviously we’re still it’s we’re now 2025 it’s in 2027. I’m sure I’ll do the series next year. Yeah, I’ll have to think about whether I’m going to do the thousand. Yeah, that’s probably going to be the telling point. If I can get through a thousand, I’ll think about it. But um I need more sleep than I used to. Yeah. Uh, as I get older, I need more sleep and I don’t want to make bad decisions. Yeah. And the the a thousand that you do, is that on a single bike or do you do that on a tandem? I usually do it on a single, but with Nigel, we did do a thousand uh ahead of time. Yeah. Yeah. If you found yourself not going, which I don’t think will be the case, by the way, because I I almost guarantee you I’ll see you in 2027. Um, how do you think you’ll feel? I think I’d go and volunteer so I can be part of the event. Yeah. Yeah. So, true. I’ve already uh there’s a um food stop. I can’t remember. It’s near Dur. Yeah. And uh I stopped there in 2019 and the people I two men I was riding with told told them it was my ninth and they wanted to know if I’d do 10 and I said they didn’t know and they told me I I had to do 10 anyway. So we stopped there so I could tell them I was back. I said I don’t know whether I can do it again. They said well you’ll come and work with us then. Yeah. at their food stop. Yeah. I almost like I think as people get older, you can make the decision not to go beforehand or you can go and maybe end up dnfing. Um I think I’d go for the latter. You know what I mean? Like just go for it. That’s what I’m saying, dude. Okay. Yeah. Cool. Um Okay. I think that’s it. Anything else you you want to talk about before we end with your three tips that guarantee a finish from a from a 10 time finisher? I think I’ve talked to your ear off enough. Not at all. I could listen to you all day, dear. Okay, let’s then go with the the three tips. So, tip number one, tip number one is uh don’t go out too fast. It’s so exciting and people often go out, they don’t realize how fast they’re going and that they’re tiring themselves. So, um, tip number two probably, you know, you want to ride with your friends, but I’d say two two people, you know, two people are enough. Three is pushing it and no more than that because otherwise you’re wasting time. Like, three is getting hard already. Uh, what else did I think about? Um, don’t waste time at controls. Like get through the controls efficiently and you can socialize while you’re riding. Yeah. Cool. Uh, dear, thank you so much. Excellent tips. Um, it’s been a complete honor, I must say, to meet you, Dearra, and I really enjoyed hearing all your stories, etc. And I do hope I’ll see you in 2027. Okay. One way or another. You might see me as a volunteer. Well, thank you for taking an interest in my stories. No problem at all, dear. Take care. You too. Oh, if you’re up in ca up in Canada, we’ve got a spare room. Okay. I’ll be there next week. Okay. Okay. All right.