First of all huge welcome to everybody it’s such again a great pleasure and a real joy to see so many partners members of different workforces voluntary sector organizations alongside that some of our statutory partners and we’re really really delighted to be able to welcome you today to our first small steps big
Changes father inclusive conference we’ve had a real journey in the ssbc program around the father inclusive agenda um and I’m I’m really looking forward to being able to share the infographic that I know car and fiss have been work working on at some point soon with you all I think we started
Talking about being more father inclusive back in about 2017 2018 there had been some work prior to that as well where we were looking at things like our father’s reading every day our Fred program that our family mentors deliver we’d also done some work really early on with the father’s fatherhood institute
Around our think Dad’s training but in sort of 2018 2019 we decided to really have a focus in on what did Father inclusive mean to us in ssbc what did it mean to to our commission Partners what did it mean to our wide system partners and most importantly what did it mean to
Our fathers the fathers that we were working with across a whole range of our services it’s now a core part of our com ambition and our commitment to system change for ssbc so it’s sits alongside our co-production Ambitions it sits alongside our know Workforce Ambitions and it sits alongside our commissioning
Ambitions around how we commission differently so we’ve made a real commitment to that we put resource behind it we put funding behind it and we actually um kind of I guess raised the bar a little bit for some of our commission providers as well around how
They were going to support us on that journey to become more farther inclusive and in terms of why did we do it I think what we recognize both in ssbc and by speaking to our partners whether they be a delivery partner or a commissioning partner and as I said most importantly
The fathers and the male carers that we work with we identified that there was a real Gap in this area so we identified that including fathers in a conver ation about the importance of the first th1 days was itself a gap that they weren’t often included they’re not necessarily
Seen at some of those first visits the that understanding of why those first thousand And1 days is so important I think most of us in this room who we work in the early years pregnancy Arena understand that that is a crucial time that pregnancy through to two pregnancy through to three to four
As we saw stretch out in ssbc is an Absolut important time so why shouldn’t dads be included in that conversation we also recognized that there was a huge gap in terms of the advice and the information that fathers get around that you know they don’t get the support necessarily as to what to
Expect as a new father how it might impact them how it might impact their relationship how they might feel how they can support their child and how to be the best dad that they can be so we’ve stepped into that space locally and I think it’s a growing space
Nationally as well and we’re delighted today to have some fabulous speakers with us to talk about their work so I hope that you enjoy today I hope you leave inspired to embrace the father inclusive journey and to become real champions and advocates for us on that
Um and to really think dads as you go back into your workplaces there is a QR code for you in the delegate pack which will support with some of the work around the MTI meter and the evaluation as well um we will be tweeting as we always do in ssbc
Fashion so if you follow us and you want to retweet or hashtag us that’ be absolutely fabulous but now I’m delighted to hand over to Alex who’s going to do a far better job than me of kind of really guiding us through today um so I’d like to welcome Alex up onto
The stage now hello is my microphone yes it’s on with double checked good morning everybody I hope you’re all well I think I know a few faces in here or a few faces might know me but for the rest of you I guess I’m a bit of a stranger so
Uh my name is Alex M and as you’ll see in the program I’m here to compare and and just basically introduce um our various excellent speakers we’ve got today um I’m also coming to this from the perspective of the dad which is useful um to give you some perspective
From my side of things but also I really want to hear some stuff from you about what you work on with dads and the things you see because later on we’re going to do something quite inclusive of all of you in the room uh to to bring
Something together a little piece of art that we’re going to be able to take away in our memories and hopefully it will be filmed later on today um I will be here throughout the day I’m probably going to be sitting here if you’ve got any questions for me but before I continue I
Just want to say thank you to ssbc for putting this together because I think it is really important to have father inclusivity uh as part of the as part of the childhood Workforce as a dad myself we we are we do get shunned sometimes when we go to those first maternity
Appointments and it’s like uh you’re listening in and you’re trying not to take over the space cuz it’s about the mom and also when you are when you have the the baby and and they said yeah don’t don’t ever ask your wife for sex don’t tell her anything about her
Appearance don’t don’t don’t don’t don’t it’s never very often do or um you’re going to be a great dad you’re going to be able to support this child you’re going to be able to support that mother and and hopefully everybody in this room will be able to offer that little word
Of kindness to some of those dads that might be struggling with that and unsure of themselves in the journey that they uh that they go ahead with um but I’m going to stop talking about me and my thoughts and I’m going to introduce our first Speaker who is Anna tarant um you
May see in the program that has swapped over you may be expecting anim I can read but we’ve just swapped over so we have Anna tarant coming to speak with us for the next 40 minutes I believe Anna I can’t see you I’m sorry I need to sort my eyesight out
Thank you Anna would you like to join us and and talk with everyone Make some noise F everybody thank you very [Applause] much thank you very much can everyone hear me okay yeah mic check brilliant um well it’s a pleasure to be here um I want to
Just say before I start a huge thank you to Felicity and the team for organizing such a fantastic event um there’s clearly a bit of a a movement at the moment around father inclusion and um the research I’ve been doing um for the past decade um has really um sort of
Culminated in a shift towards a Manifesto towards father inclusion and a vision towards father inclusion um so the research I’m going to be talking about today and introducing you to um is both a vision a Manifesto but then also an evidence-base that we’re developing to demonstrate the the value of Father
Inclusion the reasons why we need to be doing this but then also the methodologies that we need to use um to make that happen so um I’m going to try and take you on a bit of that Journey today uh through a discussion of some of our work around um young
Fatherhood um there is a biography for me in the um in the handbook there but um just to give a bit of background on on my work and my research um so I’ve been researching men’s care responsibilities in families um as I say for the last decade um I actually
Started researching grandfatherhood and looking at older men’s roles in families and since then and over time I’ve kind of Switched and looked at the other end of the life course um but again all of that work has been very applied in focus and over time um I’ve developed co-production methodologies so um very
Similar to the work being done in Nottingham um to think about how we um mobilize the knowledge that’s already out there that that professionals already have um to think about um how we make this work how we make this happen what works in practice um and then how
Do we disseminate that knowledge um and create a collective movement um that’s with that holds that knowledge in order to then affect change on a broader level um so I just want to say today that as much as I’m talking as an expert around the research um a lot of my research is
Is done in collaboration with professionals and with Fathers as well um and a core argument that I want to make today is that we need to have dialogues we need to have these kinds of conversations um and we need to have this kind of training and space event to
Be able to um push things forward to affect systems change and to create a farther inclusive policy um and practice ecosystem so um I’m really Keen um to have conversations with you after this talk um and to hear any questions that you may have um sometimes the questions
Are often you know what do we do just in our relationships with fathers how do we start and initiate a conversation those kinds of questions I think are a core part of this work as much as the broader and bigger Vision as well so um I hope
To take you on board with that with that Journey um but also do ask those kind of more um more searching and obvious questions as well um as we go out through go throughout the day so um just in terms of presentation um the presentation overview um I’m going to
Start talking a little bit about the disconnect between um these generational cultural shifts towards engaged fatherhood and then how people or fathers are responded to in um policy and practice um I’ll then talk about um our research with Young Fathers um and I say this with a caveat that um a lot of
Our research about Young Fathers focuses particularly on those who are socially disadvantaged but again I think what we’re finding is that a lot of what um works for young fathers works for fathers in general so again when we’re going through the presentation when’re talking about some of the evidence do
Think about how that translates into practice more generally for fathers um regardless of their social background or or age um I’m going to talk a little bit about father inclusion as an ideology um and I’m going to talk about some of the research um and some of the theoretical
Work that is beginning to be developed around father inclusion um my argument actually is that this is relatively under theorized as an idea um I think it’s is something that we talk about um and we use in our everyday language but um I’m not entirely sure that we really
Actually have done the the depth work to really understand how that translates and what that means so I’m going to talk about that a little bit um I’m then also going to talk a bit more about the co-creation methodology so this is a part participatory methodology um and one that brings
Together young dads with professionals and researchers in order to affect change um broader system level um and I’m going to talk about some examples of some um in ative work that we’ve been developing in the last four years um to create dads groups um and to create
Training offers with young dads at the very heart of that um and use those as exemplars if you like of of how researchers um can come together with professionals um to enhanced practice um through um an enhanced evidence base and creating an enhanced evidence base as
Well um and then just briefly I’ll just talk about what works as well what we found from existing research um just to provide some kind of insights into what you might do in your own practice so um in terms of the the broader research agenda um it’s really
Important that we situate this within as I say broader cultural shifts um around around involved fatherhood there’s increasingly compelling evidence and it’s interdisciplinary evidence um and anim M’s work which will be talked about in the next talk is evidence of that that dads um matter they matter to their
Children um they matter to their Partners very often and they matter to society we know that in terms of um culture shifts and evidence of that that 98% of fathers now attend the birth um 87% are now much more involved in day-to-day parenting activities um a
Third of dads um since the coid 19 pandemic um are now changing jobs so that they can actually spend more time with their children um and 2third are now requesting uh change in their work patterns in order to be more involved with their children um we also know that this is
Broader value as I say for children for women and also for Society at large so there’s an association or a wealth of evidence between um uh father involvement and Child Development uh across the life course but also um when men are engaged in family life um that also helps to promote shifts towards
Gender equality um as well the Paradox in all of this and and the challenge that I think we face um on a societal level um is that um men in all their diversity are underrepresented in parenting and family research so we don’t actually speak to Dads very often
We don’t NE only know um what works because we don’t know what matters to them um and they do continue to be considered a periphery role in family life um particularly in service and support context so while there were individual shifts within families on a broader societal levels we’re not seeing
Dads um as involved and and relevant caregivers all the time we know that men on the margins as well are more likely to be increasingly disadvantaged by that um as well as all of the other disadvantages that they they may face and and bring into to um a
Support relationship um and um they’re overlooked as being engaged in their in their family lives entirely so very often we use the language of absent fathers um and assume that that’s um a reason not to engage with Dad and that’s something that we’re trying to challenge through much of this
Research and my core argument here really is that um these individual shifts within families that we’re seeing that we’re evidencing are actually really fertile ground for shifting policy and practice um because we’ve got evidence that these things are happening that dads are invested and involved we’ve actually got a really strong case
Um and Foundation from which to say actually we need to support this more and make sure it happens so um in terms of my uh research then um and a bit of my my background um so uh I’m going to talk about a a long qualitative longitudinal program of
Research that I’ve been involved in um for the last six years but it’s actually a program of research that’s been ongoing for well over a DE decade now um so what this research has done it’s called following your fathers it was established at the University of Le by
By Amer Professor now Bren Neil it established the first longitudinal and dynamic study of of Young Fathers so um 31 young dads were interviewed um over five times across their parenting Journeys to explore their support needs and their interactions with with professionals and with um and with
Services um and what we could really see was this very Dynamic view of their lives very often um their pregnancies were un planned um they were experiencing a range of different challenges associated with poverty and and challenging family circumstances um but they wanted to be there for their children and that was a
Really core aspect of that work um the idea for this project actually came from professionals and from a consultation with professionals um in leads so um Bren was really Keen to research young motherhood um she felt that the the research evidence based about young motherhood was was was relatively um low
And poor really um but professionals were saying look we don’t know what to do with young dads you know we we we’re doing some work with them but there’s no evidence base so she created this whole program of study based on um based on that observation and I say that point just to
Observe or just to make the the argument that when researchers listen uh to professionals we can we can start developing and addressing the gaps um following that study I became much more involved um and started to work with different professionals across the UK um to address gaps that we’d identified um
In support so we ended up working with a um a council worker um in leads who um helped us to co-create the young dad’s Collective North in Le I’ll talk about that in a bit more detail um and that was all about encouraging fathers to train professionals um in being father
Inclusive and we also work with Kate Bulman um who works um in a prison setting and we looked at um how we support resettlement for Young Fathers when they come out of prison um and essentially what we did is we created new Pathways of support um through that
Project it was very much an impact project and all about the you know developing change um through those productive Partnerships um and that was really the seeds then for the current study that I’m now leading um which is following Young Fathers further uh and in that study what we’re doing is we’re
Um taking those relationships forward again and we’re co-creating different models of farther inclusive support um we’re generating um research evidence as we go through the process and evaluating that at the same time um and the idea is that um we get a a better Global picture of young fatherhood through doing that
But then also more detailed Focus work around instigating change so so that’s the backdrop for for the work that we’re talking about today um so in terms of definitions um when we refer to Young Fathers um we’re referring typically to young men who are aged 25 and under um and that’s a policy
Narrative um increasingly professionals and services are working with um people up to age 30 um and I’ve got some sort of thoughts around around why that is and I’ll talk about that um in the next slide but as mentioned um the the focus on research um not just about young
Fatherhood but about um parenting in general was very much on on Mothers um with the the research was really important I think because um the the broader societal narrative around young men was very deficit focused so the Assumption again is that they were absent but also feckless um and deadbeat
Um so there was an argument there to change that narrative um and this was a narrative being used by by policy makers as well and there are some quite pertinent and and disturbing uh kind of quotes that I haven’t included in the presentation today around locking these
Young men up because they’ve got girls pregnant Wily and nilly so we were really trying to speak back against that and actually understand what Young father’s lives were really like um where Young Fathers had been included in research they were often included as co-parents um and based on a
Very small sample so again we didn’t have um a strong evidence base so what the project did was was develop this Dynamic longitudinal focus and create this more nuanced picture and um I’m just going to provide an overview now of of some of the some of the um the key
Findings from that from that initial study so um the Intensive tracking revealed a great deal of volatility um and demonstrated the contingencies of their lives um again they had challenging backgrounds lack of family support very shortterm Horizons um and these are all things they bring into support encounters um and you know
Couldn’t plan um for for the next day they adhered strongly to the ethos of engaged fatherhood okay so um they were Keen to adjust to the pregnancy um and they were Keen to develop roles as as good Fathers as well and and that’s including if they were single or
Non-resident so at the core is that commitment to their children even though it’s often assumed that they might not be um in that sample of research um 29 of the 31 um pregnancies were unplanned and um uh except in two cases um but the young men you know they were shocked
They were distressed um and they felt they had no agency in their decisions to keep the child but an unplanned child did never never translated into an unwanted child so they adjusted um they went through some of the challenges and the the the difficult emotions surrounding that pregnancy but again
Demonstrated a commitment to be there um and services and professionals were key um at helping them to manage some of those emotions some of that anger as well um the relationships with the child’s mother and with maternal grandmothers were absolutely pivotal in their ability to maintain and develop that role so um
The Wider family is a really important consideration in thinking about any of the resources that sit around Young Fathers or fathers when they come into um a professional context um this was not necessarily straightforward so where grandmothers were kind of gate openers for those young men they helped them to be there
To remain engaged in their children’s lives um if they felt that the young father was a risk or they didn’t want them to be involved they could actually stop the young men from being involved in the lives of their child so again the power dynamics there within families are
Really important in in their ability to be engaged fathers there were a lack of relational um educational social economic and housing resources for a lot of these young men um and again these were core thematic areas that were observed across um the the range of the different interviews but it was these elements
That hampered their abilities to be there for their children predom ly um and this was especially compounded for those who are entrenched poverty for young offender fathers um those who are brought up in the care system um and then those with mental health problems so those were the core findings
There now the argument that I want to make on on the basis of this is that if we understand that context if we understand some of the challenges um some of the things that they’re navigating as they become apparent um then I think we shift away from an individualizing and blame based deficit
Narrative about Young Fathers to think much more about the contexts in which engage fatherhood happens um and my argument is is that um if we have um people who are expressing that need to be there we then need the contextual conditions to be able to support that um
So policy and service systems are important in shaping young father engagement and again we’ve done some um comparative research with um Young Fathers in Sweden um so Sweden’s much more um known to be father friendly it’s not a Panacea by any means um but what we found is that in both country context
Young Fathers expressed their intentions to be there for their children but it’s much more challenging for the young men in the UK um over time welfare systems have become increasingly conditional um the ability to um get the things you need the resources you need to become a
Parent so a house um you know a relationship a study relationship ship um and uh you know all of those things that support men to to fulfill their aspirations to be men in the ways they want to be um are increasingly difficult for for these young
People so um again I just want to keep that in the in the frame really that um this is becom an increasingly increasingly challenge for people at the very same time that people are saying we want to be more involved um in our children’s lives as fathers um the support system for you
Young Fathers in the UK as well um entrenches those inequalities and if we have a look at that um again these are structural issues and challenges um so overall to provide a broader picture this UK support system um is highly fragmented and it’s also very gendered and it’s experienced in
Gendered ways um it’s really loable that there are pockets of of good practice so Nottingham you know really are flying the flag as an examplar of of of how to do that at the different levels of the system um but this is not happening um
In a coherent way across the UK by by any means um and actually I think what we need longer term is a more coherent policy around around father inclusion um to help to address some of these challenges um but again these are the systems that professionals are working
Within um so when we’re coming to these kinds of events and suggesting um changes that might be made um by Professionals in individual interactions with fathers we also need to keep in the frame some of the things that professionals are also navigating and and the challenges that they’re having
To work you know and constraints they’re working within um as they as they engage with fathers um academic research has kind of captured some of this um so I’ve referenced the work of Georgia Philip there and fitzner colleagues they’re actually us-based but lots of very similar challenges over in the US as
Well um but when Young Fathers are coming into contact with with Services they’re um encountering very pervasive gendered occupational cultures um and that might include persistence in gendered ways of thinking um and acceptance of stereotypes that assume their disinterest in in parenting um there’s limited opportunity for training and reflective supervision
Of professionals again it’s really encouraging to see these kinds of events um but again the costs associated with those um um the time that you need to take out of a already busy work schedule to do this kind of training is an additional challenge that that people
Are struggling to build into into their um broader continuing professional development there are increasing constraints on workload Capac and again that’s linked to cuts to to Services um and cuts to resources um and then also maternal reluctance to Champion dads as well so you know very often um services
Are mother Centric they are designed and developed for women um and if there are challenges within the relationship it can be then difficult to to see dads and they become less visible um in terms of specialist supports so I’m talking more generally really about Universal Services um but
Specialist support offers are there um but but they’re very much a postcode lottery so they’re often driven by um smaller Charities um I’m thinking about the Northeast young dads and Lads as an example um which is a great charity up in Gates head there’s organizations like
Dad’s matter but again um you really do need someone who can Champion that work and can sustain that work over time um and the funding that’s required to sustain that and of course Charities are also competing over smaller pots of funding as well so that makes the
Sustainability of this kind of work um really challenging um in terms of policy as well in the UK I just want to make the broader Point around um the um sort of Public Health um element of this and particularly in relation to teenage fatherhood um but the drive in
Particular around um teenage pregnancy is is is the intention to bring down teenage pregnancy rates and to decrease that um but there’s a less emphasis on support so there’s all of these different competing narratives discourses approaches that are working against us um all the time when we’re
Trying to be farther inclusive um that sounds a bit depressing and I’m going to again think about how we how we change and challenge that as we go through um but again what what Young Fathers tell us about support needs is a really important starting point for thinking
About what next and what works um so we know that they um experience a range of different disadvantages and again I think fathers in general will bring some of these challenges also into their encounters with professionals um we know they’re going to come into the orbit of mainstream and Universal um mainstream
Specialist Services um but there are also dis forces within professional practice that construct Young Fathers as hard to reach and again that really feeds into this deficit view um of Young Fathers and actually um Allison Hadley encourages that we actually think about how are our services hard to access so
How do we make Services more visible um based on the assumption that they might be um invisible to dads they might be um in the language cated to moms could they be better cated to Two Dads for example we also know that they experience um a combination of support
Um surveillance and sidelining um and one professional could actually display any of those three kinds of approaches um in their interactions with with fathers um and I’m going to just give some um evidence of that and how that’s experienced in a moment um but the surveillance and sidelining elements
Tend to be the thing that that the young dads report experiencing in in their interactions the most and these are very much based on a risk-based approach rather than a strength based approach um so rather than seeing um young dads as a a resource for their children they see
Them as a as a risk for their children so um our arguments from this research is how do we actually flip that on its head and create a more caring and compassionate ethos and approach um and Foster um that environment um based on on a Redemptive um and strength-based
Narrative um so here’s just a few a few examples so when support works it works really well so we’ve got Zayn he’s aged 18 um we interviewed him um all the way back back in 2010 now but he said he’s talking about professionals um and his encounters with them he says they were
Absolutely great and you kind of knew the step-by-step things that were going to happen you knew what happened when she became this far dilated or anything like that so you had a pretty good view and as you were going along anyway they were like um okay this is what you’re
Going to do this is what’s happening now so you were always informed you always knew what was going to happen it seemed like it was kind of like a routine thing they did this to everyone irrespective of their age gender so they did seem kind of like very good professionals so
Um the opposite of the don’t don’t don’t narrative which is really really positive um so again an example here of what works um sidelining was the most common um experience for for many of these young men um so uh here Jason is talking about um about midwives um just to just
To add context to this that um again and they talked about a whole range of different professionals and they’re not targeting any particular professional group here but he said um I said to the the Midwife how come you never ever address me when you’ve got got anything
To say about my son you never tell me it’s always my girlfriend and I’m left in the dark you’re just talking in riddles she just said it’s easier and she’s Mom after all so again through that language you know that kind of um invisibilization if you like of of the
Dad the marginalization of the dad in that encounter and the assumption that Mom and Dad are separate and in a silo and not together in a relationship and then surveillance um so um these were the kind of more risk-based approaches and of course necessary in in ch protection context um
But here Callum says um I don’t like it when someone’s watching you you feel stupid cuz you’ve got people looking down on you you can’t play with your kids properly you don’t um want to startop pulling dodgy faces and that you know what I mean you can’t have a proper
Laugh with your kids you just you want to feel more confident um you want don’t want to feel like a bloody criminal um so again you know um this provokes emotion this provokes reaction in these young men um that often translates into anger that often does translate into um
Uh lack of confidence uh and it feeds into that over time so there really is a transformative element here where a professional turns around and says how are you dad and what can I do to support you or why are you feeling or the way you’re feeling um a question you often
Need to ask much later on because many men don’t necessarily and young men in particular don’t want to disclose um their lack of confidence um early on in a relationship um so there’s just some examples of of the kinds of um kind of examples that came out of the
Research so um this is the the the evidence that galvanized my study following your father’s further um I wanted to um I was pushed really to think about um the vision to think about um this as a as a leadership um agenda so um the funding that I received for
This work is a Future Leaders fellowship and that was all about how do you create change in a particular area um and I was very keen to develop this um language around father inclusion um and to think about how we create this this this policy practice ecosystem in in that way
Um the language of Father inclusion as I say is under theorized but again there’s increasing evidence that there is value to this um so the evidence to to to talk about here really um I’m going to talk about Karen Bon’s work um is that it has broader social and and health-based
Outcomes for for for The Wider family so it does promote the fathers’s well-being um but beyond that it helps them build their own capacity to support with psychological well-being um it promotes maternal Health behaviors as well and promotes children’s mental health and development so those are some of the
Core areas where father inclusion is of benefit um it’s also um a multifaceted concept and there are multiple components to it so um more broadly there’s an ethos around um bringing men into the work um in all their diversity um and regardless of the complexity of their of their personal
Circumstances um but it’s also um a set of of of of skills and also um a mindset as well and I really like this is Patrice rollins’ work she’s a us-based scholar um works with African-American fathers um and I think she distills kind of the elements of this in a really
Effective way so um this is the kind of things that that professional she argues professionals need to bring into any service encounter so the first is is knowledge so again a historical or understanding of the historical discourse of Father involvement so some of the stuff that we’ve we’ve talked
About and at um earlier in the presentation it’s about having an understanding of Parental roles um a a broad knowledge of fatherhood um research and theories and then an understanding of of power dynamics and gender and how that plays into all of that um in terms of skills she argues
This translates into the need for cultural humility and competence um ability to communicate effectively and to engage effectively um to engage in participatory strategies so again that’s based on authentic listening and building relationships of trust over time and with families and with fathers um it’s about resource brokering and service
Navigation um so again understanding the broader context in which um the support offer is operating in um and then also about interprofessional collaboration so again this is not about individuals trying to change the world on their own this is about um understanding local resource um and utilizing those
Resources to create a broader holistic environment that’s that’s farther inclusive and supportive she also argues it’s a mindset as well so it’s about being reflexive so having a um an awareness of yourself and others um taking a strength-based perspective but then also thinking about how um things might be
Developed or changed taking an ethical approach and then also a professional approach as well so again in reflecting on your own Encounters in in professional practice um it can be useful I think to use this as a framework to Think Through how that might um have happened or might be done
Differently um in in the future um taking that out a level um this is a kind of a paper by U by Fitz noal again in um in the US um and they talk about the challenges across the process of trying to identify fathers and bring them into the work so I really
Like their model around um getting fathers keeping fathers and engaging fathers and again this is a diverse model there’s lots of different elements to this and to the kinds of Engagement that we need to think through as services in order to bring fathers in um we might need to think about the range
Of practical relational cultural and contextual factors strategic and structural factors that might impede Andor support um each of those levels of the process um but essentially um the temporal lens um I think helps us to think more about this as a longer term process um one key argument that comes
Out of all of the literature around what works with engaging dads is around perseverance and persistence um a lot of I think a lot of services kind of think we’re not engaging dads right now or we’re struggling to engage dads or dads aren’t interested um where it becomes
More successful I think is where you keep pluging plugging away keep going um keep trying to develop um the the the kind of the languages that that bring dads in thinking about what Hooks them in um some of the most successful Services um you know particular specialist Services um they use the
Language of dad um so they make it clear that the service is for Dad um and they also have a hook as well so it’s not necessarily necessarily being a dad but it might be um rock music U it might be pizza and DIY night um you know
That kind of thing um could be really helpful so it’s important to again um I think in our strategic thinking as well um and this is relevant to managers but as well as to professionals about that process um and how we better develop those mechanisms um I also just want to uh
Share a quote from this is Rob um from the Northeast young dads and Lads um he tells us that the father inclusive practice is important again um he says let’s start with the most important talking point when we’re asked this question um the Young Fathers themselves I think it’s extremely important their
Involvement from the very beginning is recognized that its absolute fullest from all angles when it comes to supporting them through Parenthood you know as this is without doubt one of the proudest moments of their lives but can also be the scariest as you can imagine some of the potential thoughts going
Through their heads at that moment in time becoming a dad you know am I going to be good enough will I be able to provide my family I hope I don’t let anyone down so um hopefully I’ve convinced you that there’s a compelling evidence of of
Of the need for this kind of work um and that there are mechanisms in which um that we can draw and we can use to be able to do this so um I’m going to talk a bit more about the methodologies now from fum fathers further um this is a an
Innovation or Innovative approach we’ve been trying to test for essentially the the past six years um again my key argument is is that this work needs to be empirically driven um we can’t just assume we understand what dads need we can’t just assume we understand what professionals need either so if we bring
Everyone together into these collaborative um relational ecologies I use the language of um and and and develop these these conversations um like we’re doing today um then I think we’re better able to do this kind of work um so um in terms of the pro process of this methodology following
Young Fathers was very much about establishing the evidence base so what Young dads need um responding to Young dads in a different way the second phase was about um working with Professionals in co-production to think about um what gaps there are and what we need um and
Then in this third phase we’re now co-creating new dads groups um one of which is in Grimsby um and we’re doing the comparative International research as well to think about um the need for broader policy and systems change um I’m going to make a case for co-creation um because I think it is
Possible and I think it is an approach that is working um in terms of of creating these Innovations and in bringing fathers into the work in our project what it’s doing is it’s bringing together Young Fathers with the range of stakeholders that will be invested in their support offer to
Promote more positive visions of fatherhood um and it’s also doing that across across the systems as well so it’s um promoting that within the individual and within the family context it’s about promoting that um with and for professionals um and longer term our hope is that it will Galvanize policy change as
Well um co-creation is again a participatory method that I think helps to address what is an undefined um and complex challenge that surpasses the capacity of any single actor um it’s a form of collaborative um knowledge generation as well so we’re researching this and evidence ing this
Process as we go through um and it’s all about bringing them bringing communities with lived experience together to promote that knowledge and generate that knowledge with us um it’s an increasingly popular uh methodology that’s being used to um align research and service developed more generally um it’s being used quite
A lot in public health um but less so in Far inclusive practice so again this is kind of a a test bed if you like for for how this works in terms of a social um in terms of social interventions um but it’s also about action research Cycles as well so
Evidence is fed back in real time so are our tweaks are the things we’re doing to try and instigate change working or not if not how do we adjust that and do things in a different way to make sure that that it can work um so the core um example of that
That I want to talk about is the young dad’s Collective approach um so this was a model that was originally established by Corum Family and Child Care which is a London based charity um and since then since uh since 2016 we’ve instigated a new version of this in leads and we’re now instigating
Another example of that um in Grimsby as I said um so um you can see some of the dads there um this is some of the dads from from London and Leeds who came together um they actually presented to a panel um presented on a panel together
To an audience of this size um and told the audience why professional practice um you know supportive professional practice is really important to them it was really emotional and we were hoping to have some of the young dads from um the North East young Johanson Lads here
Today but there’s a train strike um so we would have hoping to hoped to have done the same thing today and and sort of demonstrate the value of that um but what you see is you see professionals really have light bulb moments um it makes it really real when the young dads
Are in the room when they’re talking about some of their challenges um and it’s not a adversarial space it’s a safe space where they can actually share um what it is that they they’ve experienced and what could be done better um I think what’s really um great
About this model as well is that it does speak across multiple levels um so um we see the individual development of the young dads as experts by experience um so they’re involved in the process of building their um own confidence of building their own stories and narratives um and then sharing those
With with professionals um and certainly from the north the young dads Collective North in leads um three dads who had been unemployed went into employ M after they’ve been involved in that process because they were able to evidence their ability to engage with professionals and
To engage in a in a professional way um there is a caveat with all this work of course that some of the more deprived disadvantaged young dads um struggle to engage in the work in that kind of way um so again being reflexive and being responsible for the young dads is a core
Part of this work it’s also a peer support model so what it does is it brings together lots of young dads um around a shared identity um it that helps them to build their their confidence um and build trust in the process over time as well so where peer support is possible or
Where it can be sign posted to um it’s really important to do that as part of a support offer um for professionals IT addresses the Gap in um in lack of continued professional development um particularly around farther inclusion um and what we do after our events um when we do
Training um they they vary in size sometimes it’s like audiences of 20 um as before we’ve had an audience of a 100 for example so it can vary but we ask professionals to make pledges to practice as well so based on what they’ve heard from the fathers we ask
Them to um write down what they do differently um Andor what’s been confirmed for them that they do well already um that’s had varying levels of or varying degrees of success it’s been very interesting actually um some professionals in Grimsby felt quite um affronted by that and being asked to
Make a pledge to practice um so what we ask instead is that they just take the time in that space to be reflective about their what they do in their encounters with dads um and and that seems to have helped um I suppose what we what we’re trying to push towards
More now um we have had a few situations where dads have been able to speak to policy makers um but we want to see that broader systems change and again including dads in that conversation is is really powerful um so the the dads from the north eastern dads and Lads for
Example have presented at the APG on fatherhood with us um and they have been involved in a variety of C campaigns um and advoc advocacy type work to talk about why dads are important um again really powerful for galvanizing that and and and creating that conversation so I think um what we’re
Seeing with this model really is the seeds of ecosystemic change so in terms of the model manager um we’ve evidenced that that that they see this model as a as as being about service change but that there are also these broader outcomes um associated with that so
There are lots of benefits that come with Ds being more involved in their children’s lives which which equate to um to benefits for children more broadly um she argues I think any sort of project which promotes a level of equality for particular groups is beneficial to everyone not just a group
It’s supporting and one of the dads said um buzzing love being listened to it’s not just the work with the professionals it’s about meeting up with other dads and when we do the planning we all want other dads to have a better experience um and then just as an example of
Professional feedback um I’ll think more about how to help Young Fathers I’ll think Beyond moms um again this has been useful in terms of my own research process um but for services who are trying to evidence um the change that that they’re making these kinds of qualitative um comments um and quotes
Can be really powerful um for demonstrating um and evidencing systems change that’s that’s ongoing um my final example before I start to to wrap up is is the Northeast young dads and Lads um so I’m I’m currently the chair of Trustees for the Northeast young dads and Lads um and
I’ve been working with them since around June 2020 um I saw k have the CEO um on children in need during the pandemic and and reached out and again the Northeast young dads and Lads are a specialist service that are really pioneering work with Young Fathers um again I just say
That um what we’re doing is is is work that’s done as part of a specialist charity but there’s lots that can be drawn out for Universal Services as well in terms of what works for for fathers um but the north Ean dads and Lads um have created a brand new um e-learning
Platform um called digiad um which uh is created with and for young dads um and it’s designed to talk to dads about a range of different challenges and issues they may be experiencing in their parenting Journeys from the perspectives of of young dads um and I’d encourage
You to share that with any dads you may may be working with um in your own professional practice um but just in brief a little bit about North eing dads and Lads um it started as a charity in Gates head in 2017 um and its core vision is for young
Dads to be valued and supported in their role as parents um so again aligning really strongly with with the following your father’s further research the mission is to enable uh young dads to play safe active and meaningful role in their children’s lives by supporting and connecting them and influencing wider
Practice um and the key objectives of the charity is to provide individual support to Young dads um to enable them to engage in a range of different activities and that includes research um to provide opportunities to improve their knowledge skills confidence and self-esteem um and then to influence
Policy in practice okay so again we’ve got shared goals here shared interests and aims and um these are the kinds of things that can be built into service plans and service design they address a whole range of different challenges in relation to young men so loneliness and isolation
Poor mental health um neglected physical health loss and bement uh drug and alcohol dependency food Fuel and digital poverty uh low educational attainment and and neat status homelessness and poor housing in um being overlooked by professionals um relationship breakdown um and then need for help around um children’s social care proceedings um
Just seeing that list and this is provided to me by Kev it’s so um Stark how such needs can be turned quickly into an a deficit um approach um and how that can feed into sidelining and and surveillance um so again if we address these with a care and compassion lens um
We’re much better able to to help them to be the dads they want to be um in terms of the kind of activities that are offered by the service um they provide an extensive provision um including intensive onetoone support um I will argue that with what we’re seeing
Is that with young dads in particular peer support has to be accompanied by onetoone intensive support and they do need the time they need the investment to help them to build their confidence to be able to engage with with other other young men um but they do a whole
Range of brilliant activities um they do there’s a Cycling Club uh football they do beekeeping they’ve got a on the Baltic where their offices are they’ve got a beekeeping um they’ve got a hive um and one of the older um uh trustees supports one of the young dads to be uh
To do his beekeeping which is amazing um they’ve created honey and everything um which I’ve got home it’s lovely and you can buy it um they do um pediat they’ve done pediatric first a training and family excursions so again in line with the kind of young dad Collective model
Um they’re upskilling all the time so it’s not just social it’s also um stuff that helps with employment and their longer term prospects and what these Charities and services are doing I think is is bridging a gap where they’ve had very disrupted life course trajectories um they also engage in all
Sorts of volunteering um but more recently we’ve just set up the ambassad dad’s um peer Council as well um so what we’re trying to do with that is that some of the um older beneficiaries who have now built some confidence um are now um coming together as a group
They’re reporting to the board um and they’re telling us or they’re feeding in on strategies for the for the charity and for the organization and they’re also going out and doing some of the training with professionals that that the dads in the the young dad’s Collective model are doing as
Well um and just a quote from one of the dads Because we need the evidence of course so um I wanted to say a massive thank you when I was living up north honestly if it wasn’t for you I know generally I would have committed suicide
Um you were the one person who never judged me you are an amazing person an amazing dad and I never grew up with the dad myself but you are what dads should aspire to be so that’s when the dad talking about care for CEO um I just wanted to show you a video
Um of one of the the digi dad uh content so this is about crying babies I’m going to see if I can get this to work it’s not too Loud uhoh you’re looking out of your depth there me when crying or set your baby may need some help and US dads need to figure out the cluthes you need to be a regular Scooby-Doo it might be that the hungry or teething tired or cold hurt themselves want attention or are
Just feeling knacked or it might be that tire in the floor that she wants to pick them up babies can’t talk but they can cry smile and laugh that’s how they communicate if they’re crying they’re saying they need you and you should go to them don’t worry if the crying makes you
Feel anxious that’s completely normal they aren’t doing it on purpose or trying to wind you up and you might not know exactly what’s wrong with them every time babies need to learn how to get what they need by communicating and that’s down to You if they cry and always get ignored they won’t trust you if they cry and you always get angry they won’t feel safe with you if they cry and always get passed to someone else they won’t build up a bond with you if they cry and
Always get get given a scream they don’t learn that it’s their dad who is always there for them Never Shout hit or shake your baby if you are struggling and need a break then ask for some help right get ready for some top tips on crying number one stay calm number two
Make sure your baby is safe and not in pain number three calmly go through all the things that it is likely to be nappy hungry thirsty tired te feeling poorly needs a cuddle number four if none of this works trust your instincts never be afraid to ask for
Advice remember your health bit and family nurse is always at the end of the phone cracked it this time she just wanted someone to play with so as we all now know crying is how your baby lets you know stuff so treat your baby well be interested and play with them so
She’ll know that her world is a good fun and happy place parent like like a boss and get involved it’s bound to put a smile on your face and There’s okay so uh that’s just one example um more recently we’ve developed some um content around uh feeding babies uh we’re working with the family hubs um again to make sure that everything is up to date um in terms of um leg ation requirements um to think really closely
About our imagery um as well um we’re very thoughtful around diversity and and the kind of images that we present in in each of these um um videos as well just to make sure they’re appealing to to a diverse group of of dads um but again a lovely resource it’s open access and
Free so again you can if you can recommend it if you if you want to have a look at it in your in your um own uh practice that would be amazing and we’ve also created a or co-created did a think Dad toolkit for professionals there’s a
Link on there as well um so that’s got a list of lots of different images we’ve got QR codes where you can listen to quotes from from Young dads talking about their experiences so we’re really trying to bring this into a digital space um we’ve got Tyler up there being
Um interviewed for for one of these videos as well so some of it shows the dad some of it um is cartoon based or or uses figures and that kind of thing um so again really pioneering work in that regard so um in some um and uh you know
Conscious I’ve been talking for a while now um so um as I’ve mentioned this supports everyone in the system to collaborate to Champion dads and to share best practice so this is all about the celebration of dads and again shifting away from those kind of more negative negative uh language and Views
That that actually might shut down a support relationship um to understand what works we need to know about what dad’s need as a starting point um and that enables us to more readily um translate and mobile ize uh that knowledge um based on a strength rather than risk-based approach
Um co-creation as a methodology helps us to translate evidence in real time but as well as to generate it as well um and um to be further inclusive uh I think what we really need is to see dads as experts by experience um we need to have professionals who are galvanized to
Identify and address the barriers to Father inclusion and we need as I say uh coherent policy and I’m going to keep banging that drum um final thoughts um are on how to be part of the change and I hope I’ve dropped in a few suggestions and um kind of recommendations as I’ve
Gone through um the core thing and you’re all here today doing this already which is great but is to think Dad um ask about Dad um and welcome Dad into what are uh traditionally or are seen as women only Services um we know that when dads are empowered to tell their stories
To professionals real transformation and change can happen um relational and strength based work is key but it does take time it does take perseverance and it does take persistence there are already lots of examples of good practice out there um so do talk among one another um ask each other what has
Worked um and and take that forward in your own um professional practice um some organizational changes can also make big differences so actually championing fathers to your managers as well can be really important and again if we can start building in farther inclusion into service design
Um that takes a lot of the owners off individual professionals um and it means that people become on board much more quickly um a key thing I talk about um everything I all the training I do and I hear at all the training I do is um lack
Of data so um building questions about Dad um not just about what risk they pose to to child or Mom but ask about how dad is um whether dad’s in the picture all of those different kinds of questions tell Mom that Dad is important as well um and collecting data about Dad
Is is is part of that process um we ask you to um directly challenge um and some of the stigma and some of these pervasive negative stereotypes by seeing dads as experts by experience and also I ask that you prioritize research and consultation um in your localities and in your region um
Hopefully um you want to or this presentation demonstrates the value of of also working with researchers working with universities um working with those who can help um to translate some of this this knowledge um into the into the evidence base again all of this is driven by what’s already out there
What’s known it’s capturing it um and that that’s helping to shift these things forward even if only very slowly and incrementally um I’m going to finish with a quick plug um we’re we have our own conference um taking place on the 7th of December um to celebrate All of
This research and to to share our um our latest findings um that’s taking place in Lincoln on the 7th of December um we have a Twitter account which is following y f um which has got the Eventbrite registration um page on it um there’s going to be lots of interactive
Workshops with lots of our partners so that includes the north easn dads and Lads um the Grimsby dads Collective and we’ve got someone from um PA from the prison and Care um prison device and Care trust um the imagin a man team are going to talk about positive
Masculinities in in in young men um as future as future dads um and we’ve also got a interactive theater presentation by all right mate which will focus on men’s Mental Health Health um and again how professionals can support men with that um we’ve also got a growing
Community as well um so please do join that and visit our our website um you know you’ll get updates on on the research um and on the various activities that we’re going to be doing in the next sort of three years um another really cheeky plug but
Um the book’s coming out in uh next year June 2024 um based on the earlier slides about and what we’ve learned about young fatherhood as well and that’s going to be published with policy press um so we’ll have um something more um more concrete and written up there that you’ll be able to
Access um select Publications and and then that’s me um thank you for coming on this journey with me um any questions I’m very happy to answer those um I’m conscious I’ve gone way over my time so um I’ll stop there thank you I go thank you very much
Really appreciate you no problem am I staying or going want get bring a chair if you want have a cup of tea yeah great thank you so much um I I guess you guys have seen your QR codes in your uh in your programs if you’ve got any
Questions uh for Anna then drop them on there we’re going to speak about them around half1 12 I believe so you’ll be able to do that so you can have a break you can sit down and have a water thank you thank you so much thanks for your
Time everyone thank you thank you woo that was a lot that was I did not expect that level of uh detail and research that had gone into it and it’s fantastic to know that that that is actually happening and is going to help practice going forward um now Anna I
Know you’ve got a book coming out but you’ve already got this one out right is that correct okay so Anna does have this book which is out currently um and we have animation speaking with us shortly who has hang on let me just pop this down without moving slides
This book coming out shortly and you do have a chance to be a lucky winner of these books signed by said authors but I need you to do one thing first so has everybody in their packs got their think Dad’s evaluation form oh the rustling of the bags go on
Have a look what’s in there then sweetheart go on have a look got it and I’m sure you’ve got a writing Implement too right so so what we want to check really is your understanding um and your awareness of far inclusive practices Etc this at this point now as you begin
This this conference and then we want to check again after all of the talks talks and um all of the videos and the people that you’ve seen today have spoken to see if it’s increased standard evaluation form but if you get yours in you do have a chance of winning both of
These books signed and they are fantastic I’m actually going to get a copy not signed I’m going to buy them not even in practice but as a dad sometimes reading a book about the things around it and the societal changes that needed to actually help you
Um so thank you I’ve learned a lot today so we are going