The Shackleton Transverse #podcast #discussion with a man who did the crossing

this film is An Interview with Mark Vikerage who completed the South Georgia Crossing in 2005.

Antarctic research is one of my hobbies , so if this film is not your cup of tea , feel free to skip through it

– accompanying this are maps and visual aids. The original journey was undertaken in 1916 to save 22 stranded Crew and Made Sir Ernest Shackleton into a Legend .

We Study the Maps from the era, modern Maps and cross reference some of the recorded history verses a modern approach.

Many thanks to Mark for taking the time to speak to me and allow this recording to enter the record.

#shackleton #southgeorgia #antarctica #amundsen #robertfalconscott #tomcrean #endurance #fitness #motivation #wildernesssurvival #wildernessadventure

ref mark V

Reference material
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_Trans-Antarctic_Expedition

Shackleton’s account
https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/5199/pg5199-images.html
Search for following text
“May 15 was a great day. We made our hoosh at 7.30 a.m.”
Or download the ebook
https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/5199

Mark Vickerage’s original video

Chapters

Disclaimer – Education
I make this documentary with the intent to teach, inform, motivate, inspire and activate in others…

Images and videos are used sometimes from other content creators, with reference where possible. Places like project guthenberg , youtube, content authors and contributors, historians , documentary makers.. wikipedia, archive.org .. the people who invented google earth, video cards.. computers, All make this documentary possible.

I love the entire topic of Antarctic exploration, it is a hobby of mine to research this topic and I am by no means an expert or claim to be one ever.

Historic offenses are not intended but will occur and feel free to correct any part of the historical document with a comment.

The story of shackleton’s Imperial transantarctic mission is a long one which begins well before 1916 and if it wasn’t for this particular Expedition we may never have heard of Sir Ernest Shackleton on the 10th of May 1916 Ernest Shackleton and five of his crew arrived at King hackam Bay on the south

Coast of South Georgia they had sailed for 17 days 700 stormy nautical miles with tainted water supply from Elephant Island across the scottia sea they’ sailed in the 22t James Carriage to get help and on Elephant Island there remained 22 crew following the wreck of

The endurance in the ice of the wed sea 6 months earlier after a few days of rest at Cave Cove eating Albatross and minor reconnaissance walks Shackleton and two of his men Tom crean and Frank Worsley set off at 3:00 a.m. across the island to reach husvik whaling station this 36

Mile trip across South Georgia from King haon Bay to stom Ness is now known as the Shackleton Traverse and is recognized as one of many epic Antarctic Journeys the gentleman I’m about to speak to decided in 2005 that this would be among the items he wanted to

Experience and he’s kindly agreed to an interview to discuss the topic and his experience his name is Mark vicd what was it that got you into this idea it was just something that I wanted to do um I knew a little bit about the history I’d also done six continents so

This was going to be me seventh so it was trip to South Georgia and the Antarctic Peninsula itself so I could kill two birds with one stone really I guess the realization was that I didn’t realize it was quite such a significant challenge in the sense of like what it

Is now so many people want to do it and it’s just so much more expensive at the time it was just oh fancy going there I’d love to do it it looks a little bit of physical hardship and endurance and I was probably more into that than I am

Now but it’s still something I do enjoy and you had heard of the story before you decided to do it had you heard of that story yeah yeah yeah what what age were you when you encountered that story probably early I don’t know mid 20s maybe something like that would you have

Read a few of the stories to do with the Antarctic or is it just that um Scott and amonson always sort of uh struck a cord and I’m always W for giving credit where credits you because a lot of people actually don’t realize shackleton’s Irish yeah British and same with the

Norwegian you know Scott are the Antarctic famous for actually coming second so not really yeah I mean but they’re they’re all such interesting stories I think even even look at that the the story of endurance I know for myself it it’s almost unbelievable sometimes when you read some of these stories like what

They did what they what they encountered your video starts off with in the summer of 1914 I I don’t know if we can get the music going but in the summer of 1914 sir Ernest Shackleton set off aboard the endurance Bound for the South Atlantic the goal of his expedition was to cross

The Antarctic Overland but more than a year later and still half a continent away from the intended base the endurance was trapped in ice and eventually was crushed for five months Shackleton and his crew survived on drifting ice packs in one of the most Savage regions of the world before they

Were finally able to set sails again in the ship’s lifeboats the story of how Shackleton reached set Georgia Island is one of the epics in the history of survival and then there’s this kind of little known story of the Traverse of South Georgia which began on Friday May

19th I’m not sure if it was 1915 or 1916 it’s that Traverse you know I I want to kind of understand it and i’ I’d love feeling a one of the questions I wanted to ask you um just at the start was do you think if you were in

Shackleton’s Boots and you looked at this Crossing that you had to do and you didn’t have a a direct map or the maps were wrong what was that like to to begin and set out on this and then you must have been able to imagine yourself in that situation if you didn’t have

Maps or if you didn’t know the route so yeah so there was four of us that did the crossing all of us have done a CV to actually say that we were qualified so they don’t just take anybody it is an undertaking um and obviously with was a

Guide as well that supposedly done the route before um but he was actually trying to use a GPS at one point which we thought was a real error and I say We There Was Myself and there was a Swiss Mountain guy called Bruno who didn’t speak much English we were questioning a

Couple of times why we’d actually stop because obviously stopping somewhere like that is quite dangerous really you just get called very very quickly and the GPS with number of satellites particularly in 5 probably wasn’t that great you know floating overhead and so we decided um well we we

Made a gesture to say Well it must be that way because that’s it seemed pretty obvious at the time what the route was and it wasn’t though we were doing anything to sort of avoid creases we were taking a direct Lan route obviously we were Hest St but um but yeah it was

Um I think there was a little bit of apprehension at the start and uh I don’t know if you’re going to ask me this but later on there was there was one or two incidents on the way that we we went through which are actually highlighted in the video but yes it

Quickly got got to a point where we thought this isn’t going to be you know easy yeah yeah and just just reading shackleton’s account today you know what you say about it looked like there was only one way and you can kind of get this in some of the some of the bits

That that are written in the story is you know there’s just towering stuff on either side of you there’s only one one real way through this but listen instead of skipping ahead um what was the first day like or can can you explain to me what what landing on uh

Hack King haakon Bay was like and how how did that how did that start you the gear you had the these are the things I think the gear I packed up was heavy um and I often tell people this and it’s not a sexist comment at all but

Because I was sharing the cheapest accommodation on the ship I was right next to the galley so nothing lavish about where I was staying at all but me bag was outside and there wasn’t a single woman could lift it off the ground in fact some of the men couldn’t

Either so that’s not carry it they couldn’t even lift it um yeah and it and it was uh so being the youngest there out out of the four of us traveling uh I got lumbered with a spare rope a tent and um at the shovel as well and as well

I also got given 4 kilograms of spaghetti bolognese which was our food wow so the backpack itself and obviously once you go you’re self-sufficient there is no helicopter rescue or anything along those lines it’s just you’re on your own so hence the CV an application you’ve got to demonstrate that you’ve

Got some mountaineering technical experience to go okay and and what what was it like when when you started off obviously all your gear comes off the was it a boat or rib boat or something like that no it was zodia yeah we got taken off and I can’t

Remember much about it I would guess that some of the passengers gave us a round of applause or something like that um I think I I honestly can’t remember that bit I just remember landing on the beach and just thinking oh we’re on our way now and um sorting the pack out

Making sure it was comfortable and getting stuff handy that was going to be getting stuff close basically so need them what was that terrain like were you were you dropped off at the at the the very end of the bay it was it was a grally beach I do remember that

The sea was coming in it wasn’t particularly rough or anything like that it was pretty much like every other zodiac Landing we’ve done it wasn’t too bad coming off you was just getting the gear but yes it was once we started it went uphill pretty quickly remember the

Terrain to the side to the left hand side which would be the northish I believe would have been quite mountainous there was lots and lots of gray well in fact black and white and in fact that’s another one of my lasting memories was just that it was either

Snow or Rock there was nothing else there um and and to be honest it it could have been quite intimidating I had seen some documentaries before i’ actually traveled and even me parents have seen one I remember the mom saying that looks pretty Grim you’re not going there are you

But and it literally was it almost could have been filmed in black and white because there’s just okay there’s no color in the terrain at all it’s just Bleak there the way to put it and of course it doesn’t help with a bit of gray Mist coming across which was one of

The problems actually was just was a little bit of visibility that’s that’s in in the account of Shackleton is that they saw fog chasing them you know at it I think it was at Sunset was chasing them all the time even the the first night this fog they

Were they they ended up putting a guy behind on a 50 foot rope to steer them uh because they couldn’t see there was a Moonlight but it was just uh highlighting the fog as they walked so they Trail the Rope back and the guy at

The back was able to tell if they were going left or right during that fog but I think it was twice at least that they encountered this fog was and quite Bleak and horrible and scary I believe yeah well we definitely hit it pretty much

Early on which I think is one of the reasons why we stopped but the thing is you know we did have compasses we can walk on a bearing um that’s really what probably Shackleton couldn’t have done at the time I presume but I get I get the

Principle of what he was doing he could feel the the sort of tension in the Rope going right or left or something that’s work I don’t know if they staggered themselves with the front person as as far forward as possible and they were at the back but they were able

To see if they were keeping a line or not interesting um and also I don’t know if you’ve ever read the story of them tobogganing down one of the last uh slopes um and just reading the Shackleton one today um they talk he talks about un roping and sliding kind

Of childlike down one of the last slopes which which sounds to me like they put their he heel behind them and one leg out in front and slid um off the ropes yeah it’s I think it’s been a while since I’ve I’ve read it to be honest because um having done

It it’s almost like a tick box and I moved on to something else but um I think at the um the way my interpretation of it was that they’d been going on for so long that they weren’t really making any progress and they could just do this all day and all

Night they eventually just decided to just go for it and slide down the other side and they ended up being lucky that they didn’t Crush into any rocks yeah um and and to be honest uh coming down that terrain that’s I understand why they would have got away with us because there weren’t

That many Rooks until he hit me he was still pretty steep and um just done it stepping back we got kind of sidetracked with the with the fog element and that’s that reminded me when I was just reading this today um so you you were saying that the start

Of it was an uphill from the beginning you were pretty much going up yeah it wasn’t steep um it from the beach it wasn’t too bad it was just general snow um but then there was a couple of bits that we had to zigzag round to go to gain a little bit of

Altitude um but again south Georgia is not a massively high place by any stretch okay the grand scheme of things but yeah we zigzagged just to get a little bit because otherwise it’s just so such hard work and the snow began to get softer so obviously just at the

Ascent everything was certainly above the knee it was thigh deep um once we got once we got going in a little bit um into the ground and um so how far do you think you went on the first day or the you were saying um it was divided up over

Three days was it was it two day two nights three days no it was actually two days because we did quite well but I think that was more to do with the time of year that we actually did it yeah and were you saying that was in November and

It was colder or something yeah early early season um by by February I think I think a lot of it probably would have been um dried up and it would have been literally climbing over crevasses yeah so sort of wavy getting in and out of them I mean it was

Hard enough doing what we were doing but I think that probably would have been an extra element to it um the you said You’ done preparation and stuff like that what what was that CV like um what what is that is it just all your experience that you that you

Had up until that point is that the the CV you’re talking about yeah yeah yeah to give a list of things that you’ve done and experienced so okay um I think the biggest one that probably went for me apart from some obviously some UK stuff some um uh stuff in the Alps was

Um the big peak in Argentina which was pretty horrendous we didn’t sum it because the weather was just so bad but it was 48 hours in minus 45- 50 maybe it yeah so that was at the high camp so 7,000 7,000 met nearly sorry in fact that’s the peak is nearly 7,000 we

Stayed about 6,200 meters which is still higher than kiman jaru yeah so um and we stayed in a tent for 48 hours looking for a break in the weather and didn’t get it and that’s that was an expedition in itself I mean uh Knuckles went white toenails all fell off and a

Few weeks of arriving home so so you got like mild frostbite while you were there I think it was just me bod’s reacting to it whether it was frostbite or not I don’t know but certainly yeah it was uh it was damn cold I’ve never complained about British weather since never and Sh

Shackleton actually said that as well he said um I when we were climbing up one of these I think they went up to 4,500 ft I’m not sure if it’s Trident or what they were what they were going on up um but he said that he remembered they were

Getting very hot with the sun it was like baking them and he remembered a point in time where he said he would never complain about the son again that you know it can mean the difference between life and death and he said he’d never comp he remembered that he

Recalled it when he was climbing up to towards there or I’m not sure if it was the Trident but no I don’t think the trident’s that high it’s it’s not it’s it’s quite it’s quite Steep and it’s quite icy so it’s it’s not risky but it’s not a technical thing if you know

What you’re doing you know it’s difficult to tell what they climbed I mean I was trying to trying to read it and break it down today and it’s it’s quite a long series of back and forths that they did when they when they climbed across this the

Map on the video actually shows that they did several like Summits then came back then tried again and tried again eventually they were at that point which presumably later got identified as the tried and that’s when they decided they had enough they just went down I also think that’s the point where the

Shackleton the guys stopped on the way up and they had the little rest okay is there yeah when he said they’d been asleep for several hours but it was actually only about 10 minutes or something yeah yeah what’s um what was your distance that you did I say on the

First day what was that like or do you remember can’t remember the distance element never really came into it because I knew we were aiming for just past the Trident so what it was in distance I just knew it was about um so your first day you were

Aiming for just past the Trident sorry if you cut across you yeah okay yeah it it was going to be to be I can’t remember but it would have been X hours walking or something like that and and and the idea was if we could get above

The Trident great if we couldn’t we would stay at the bottom of it but um we we were quite successful it was it was starting to get dark when we when we arrived and certainly I remember it getting quite dark when we were coming down the Trident the other side yeah

It’s fascinating and then you camp I I see it you know we’ve got some of the photographs from your video that I hope you don’t mind me kind of accompanying this they kind of zoom in and zoom out but I’m sure I can freeze frame them as well there’s there’s some of those

Photographs s of your camp and was it was it one t you you were saying there was two t0 is that right was there two t0 and then it became one is that or it was two t0 and it became one put this way mine was intact okay right

Wow and what what they just um got damaged or what happened or they got lost let’s just say there were some missing pools in another tent wow wow oh from the beginning are we saying that no no okay interesting interesting there’s a story in there I’m sure somewhere yeah you were you were

Saying something happened on the Trident it was to do with um you were uh can you explain that to me what happened you were saying it was the first time you ever used an isax in Anger um there was um what did that look like first of all

When that happened the tri um right at the top it was absolutely sheet ice just ice um so the crampons had been on for a little while anyway and that’s the metal spikes if people don’t know what that is um so and it basically got a stamp in to

Make sure that you don’t slip um however while I was waiting in the queue um the Australian lady whose name I can’t remember to be honest Kim no Kim Kim was her husband Kim was the man yeah okay I can’t remember her name for the life of

Me but she started walking across the top where we were sort of baing each other and hadn’t shouted and I ended up getting um moved off my feet pulled off my feet so it was the first time and only time I’ve ever had to use it in

Anger so self arrest and uh managed to stop up they could see what was happening because I shouted and uh it was it ended up being quite okay but it could have been a hell of a lot worse if I didn’t have me iscea handy so and just going back to what you

Were saying about belaying um so you communicate during belaying isn’t that right that you you say started climb St finished climbing stuff like this yeah it wasn’t like that it was more or less you can go across now it’s safe and then uh the tension was in and whatever else

It wasn’t like a vertical thing it was right I was going um up at an angle she was going across but across the sheet ice but as she went she didn’t tell me she’d gone so hence I went and then I could have pulled everybody down but

Managed to secure it pretty quickly wow fascinating yeah but it was horrendously slippy though um I mean saying really stood ah in your memory that moment were you there yeah I I’ve done quite a lot of Scottish wintering courses and stuff like that it’s the first thing to do is learn to

Sell for rest but I’ve never actually done it in anger and that Still Remains the only time I’ve ever done it in Anger yeah but it was straight down on the ax and um and in fact I remember watching the documentary few years afterwards where some Royal Marines that attempted it and

They’ not got up that doesn’t mean when better than them or anything like that it just means we got a bit lucky perhaps with the weather because normally that a lot of these things are wether uh it certainly has its big big say on things the weather um yeah so

They had problems getting up it and I think you know they were right at the bottom so it just goes to show we managed to succeed they didn’t but yeah the elements definitely probably featur in their expedition and you know in the in the Shackleton Expedition they talk

About using uh Carpenters Adas to cut out uh steps in in the ice I presume this is something similar that they were trying to uh go up to a height to see what was on the other side is it like that on the Trident that you’re um

You’re it was but it was sheer ice for you when you were there but it’s it started to tap it it is it was almost at the summit so it came up if I could just do it so you can see it came like that then across and then there was a little

Bit more which was more snowy for some reason maybe some ice some snow had fallen onto it and then it was the sort of downhill but there was two elements to it I remember going up then across and then just a little trudge more or less and that’s where we all met and

Congregated before we decided how we’re going to go down okay fascinating fascinating and then from there you see you camped at the bottom of the Trident and we did yeah I just you know when you were saying that I was just imagining um the screws that they put

Into the bottoms of their shoes and um reading earlier H I don’t mean to reference this all the time but I thought it was a good thing to do was to read the story today and say to myself or I have it fresh in my memory um but

The Shackleton writes that he’d given up his good I forget the shoes the name of the shoes he used but he had these mediocre shoes for the journey but he he’d given them up to some member of the crew at some stage his his proper shoes

That he he should have used um can you imagine doing that with just screws would you trust no just screw I can’t imagine doing with any cake of that area at all to be honest yeah it’s all lightweight I mean they put if I’m not mistaken they put nails through their

Boots so they could use them as cramp points yeah um I mean it were tough in those days weren’t there you know that Generation Well I I mean like it’s it it’s just fascinating you know it’s this I I think I said this to you it’s this real life information about what

That terrain is like that a lot of us are missing you know um and what you know you were talking about the next part of that Journey was down into the queen glassier or even before that that it was did you say it was never ending T

From that point on or um yeah there’s there I if I remember rightly there’s two glassier there one leads on to the other the creen glassier from after we first spoke I looked it up and it’s actually not that long but maybe maybe that’s so I don’t know but anyway it’s

Just a plateau with Peaks either side bits of black with white TOPS oh just going back to what you said about coming down off the Trident and camping so that that night was it a relief to feed everyone the spaghetti or you know you had four kilos of this what what do you

Remember that that first night or is it a retired h no um I remember it our guide was nepes so that’s some of the Prairie flags that are featur in the video I see them the three flags yeah yeah there’s actually more that was just a a closeup of of the middle three

Um I remember doing dinner there was everybody helped out we were all doing various bits and pieces um I remember putting me down jacket on and thinking I’m warming enough so um I’m glad of that and me one lasting memory was the Australian New Zealand couple him and

His wife which ing on as I dozed off complaining about one of them not brushing their teeth and I thought how ridiculous we’re in this magical place in the middle of nowhere and how obscure you know how and they could they just chose to bicker to

Each other that was a little bit of their relationship was it magical was it was it magical standing yeah I I well yeah I mean I i’ enjoyed the first day i’ enjoyed coming down the Trident especially because it was there’s a style of walking sort of where

You almost Goose steep down and ended up along with Bruno who’s probably done this more than anybody with him him being a mountain guide in Switzerland we got down pretty pretty quickly to be honest is this Goose Goose goose stepping well explain that to me is it

Like big long strides big long step down yeah then your foot goes down and then you’ll slide a little bit and then another one and you’ll slide a little bit more maybe and I well you’ll go down a little bit in the snow you’re not slipping slipping yeah it kind of piles

Up under your heel and then you skip to the next step and that piles up it’s almost gone down a sand June as something similar yeah but once it was getting dark we couldn’t really there was no rocks I remember being a couple of big rocks actually in fact I think

That they were near where we camped um but there’s certain bits I remember vividly and certain bits that probably just assume from from having been there but um yeah getting down was I was pretty pleased that we got down we got the tent up after finding yeah we just

Thought yeah that’s it will just have to keep cozy tonight um adapt improvise overcome so just so get on with it really um nobody was coming to help us so we knew that much but yes it was really strange hearing them too saying yeah I’m brush your teeth and I just

Doed off at that point yeah and the next morning made breakfast and I can’t remember what breakfast was now but I presume it was some sort of pory oy thing or something like that but um I don’t remember feeling hungry and I don’t remember feeling feeling thirsty M

And were you taking water from the land was that how you were or did did you have water water with you um or mixture I definitely took water um the problem is obviously it freezes so we must have stopped off on the first day to get something and use

Mes tins I can’t remember that but I think yeah in fact I think we did um they’ got the forget the name of the brand but there’s a special brand that’s always used by Mountaineers and we made a brew with mess tins right and but I

Don’t think we did that on the second day at all I think we’d had enough and second day was um we may have to stop the call and start again in a second it it gave me a warning saying there’s 10 minutes I think on the free version there’s like

30 40 minutes and then we start again it when it’s oh yeah so it says 7 Minutes 58 seconds at the top so five five six minutes is fine um so yeah so when you say you don’t think you needed to have anything the second

Day were you just ready to you were just committed you were into it all the the edginess was gone oh no I don’t think we stopped for a hot drink um is what I’m saying I don’t think we um I’m pretty sure we did actually on day one but not

On day two H it was a slightly warmer day so the water bottles probably didn’t freeze is probably more the point because I’ve had that before um hold a bottle of orange and upside down um and I also think I I probably took my large flask as well probably would have

Comeing on which probably explains the size of the backpack as well but not that much too into it it was just a big flask I can maybe go through do you yeah have you got it there I see a nodding towards the corner I’m like he’s got

He’s got it there no no it’s not here but I do have it and I actually went to Argentina with that so that must be now 24 years old or something like that w wow it’s a thermos of some sort I presume is it yeah yeah it’s just big

Solid flask yeah it’s been around but um yeah that’s I think that’s something that I do like to do is if you look after your kit it tends to look after you yeah it’s like with your tent that day it’s a sign you know that you had your tent

Poles and whatever so like it looks like a big enough tent as well it’s it’s like was it like four or five kilos in itself or was it and I’m gonna have to remind myself because iell yeah um I can’t remember what brand it was I can’t remember if it was a I

Was trying to see if I could see the name on it um so I I got a very similar tent of me owned that I bought after the Argentina trip because they were the only ones left standing After the Storm wec Ed wow um and I still got that as well and I

Still used that um but the tent was fine they pretty solid pretty rigid and whilst it was a bit cramped it was it was manageable it just meant we had to put um the bags in the dome which wouldn’t wasn’t necessarily a problem because it was quite it turned to be

Quite mild that night and day the next day uh but if it had been windy we would have had a bit of a problem something toome I’m just looking at one of the photographs here where it looks like you’ve come up beside a rock um the stone looks quite interesting it’s kind

Of a red and gray stone but you’ve you’ve dug a hole with a with the with the shovel and or the Spade the shovel was in my backpack a big blue one yeah big blue was it it it looks plastic but it’s not plastic it’s metal and plastic Matt and then you can

See this kind of Prima stove you’ve got going with a foil liner in a in a hole and I it does look suspiciously like uh spaghetti bnes or small sausages in the it SP ball spag ball it definitely Spar ball I I actually don’t remember eating

It I just remember the cook telling me you’ve got four kilos of spag ball you see a little a little ice wall that you’ve built and you know it’s interesting because in the story that I read today they said that when they did make their hoos or their food they dug

It down three feet they dug the hole that they were going to put their stove three feet under the into the snow because a wind could have come at any stage and you know put out their their fire or what whatever they were using I think they were just using petroleum as

The fuel um but it’s interesting you you’ve kind of got the exact same setup I can just make out even some snow bricks uh just to the right of the cooking area that we did yeah yeah yes I mean it’s pretty standard to do that sort of thing it’s also you know you

Overlap on your tent as well okay um you put the snow up so it doesn’t leave any exposure nothing gets underneath it because that’s the worst bit it’ll just rip your tent up it’ll take off and I I see that photograph here at the if I can

Get YouTube to stop in the right place yeah the tent the bags look huge your bags look just is is it is it the space for all your your gear is that what it is like the down jackets stuff like that it’s yeah so sleeping bag I always put

In the bottom always in the bottom pouch and there’s a divider and you can just pull it out from the bottom if you want to then everything else and and obviously the handy stuff Metals anything heavy tends to go close to the back and Central to avoid you leaning to

One side Pence and mic anything essential the the essentials for me is always boots and sleeping bag you can’t compromise on any of them obviously never wear coton might do now but it’s never anything where you’re going to get wet or cold don’t wear cotton what would

Be your go-to clothing if you were doing something would it be neopreme or would it be some sort of technical clothing or oh um anything by yna is who I use now which SP with a j j o t n a r j a t n a

R n a r it’s j pronounced y there was um a mountain you were talking about opposite Mont Blanc called D de jont I think it was the I was looking this up today I’ve obviously got the spelling wrong I couldn’t find this I was like 20 nearest mountains near

Mont Blanc or technical climbing DN T yeah space do as in Du and then je is giant with an e instead of an i ah d e a n t d Deon is that on your bucket list is that like one that’s on your bucket list or you’ve done this one I’ve

Done it um I I think um afterwards I had done some stuff in the Els before um I can’t remember why we got talking about that one last time but what I think what I’d said is like that that a was probably the most scariest climb I’ve ever

Done probably not the most technical because there there’s some handholds and it’s um but yeah for for sheer exposure it is just very intimidating there’s literally a Shear drop of about literally one mile I think it’s about 15600 meters straight down let’s let’s stop here I’m going to

Stop the session and start another one if that’s okay with you have you got time to do yeah sure okay all right cool I’ll send it to by email just looking at St deant while we were having that bit of a break and a video of it and then the height 4,033

MERS and a few questions which were we’re kind of diverging at a halfway point within the story of the South Georgia we’ve gone off on a bit of a tangent and I like this tangent but you know Don deant some some of these things

It made me kind of go down a bit of a rabbit hole where I was thinking about Don Williams Peter Borman uh Joe Tasker The Pinnacles and when I see this the sharp Pinnacle of the Dawn deant um you know I have a few questions

And I’ve got a big question at at the end of this um t tent for you but where do where do you kind of get the idea that you’re going to go do Dawn deant where where does dash like um I I Look to a week in the

Elps and it’s to be honest when I go climbing um you always rely on local knowledge uh even if it’s just for the weather sometimes but the guides know the roots the ins and outs the little nukes and crannies and just about everything that goes on

So um I got teamed up I I went with a company and I got paired up with a guy to do some classic Mountain earing training and then they decide the routes when you get there and it’s virtually always weather dependent I mean I’ve done several trips to the Ys and the one

That’s always escaped me so far is the matter horn and that got snowed off ended up doing some stuff in France and Italy and elsewhere in Switzerland the matter one always always to me sounds like one that you’d go like this go thank God it was snowed off I

Mean it’s it’s got a reputation doesn’t it it really does it it does yeah um it it’s the one that’s got away so far it was the one that really Bridges between being a mountain walker and a mountain climber although I’ve done probably other things but it’s definitely the one

That everybody if you only have to look at the matter hor to know it’s bit of an undertaking but obviously D de is less much less known so much so you couldn’t even find it it actually translates tooth I definitely had it spelled wrong oh Giants tooth okay and

That’s the je I had it spelled D o n d dent it’s Dent the giant yeah that’s Giant’s tooth when you see it you’ll see why it resembles Giant’s tooth yeah yeah I’m just looking at it here um so there’s a bit of a climb up on GL on

Pretty much glass or ice and or a bit of a walk up and then there’s a climb how how long does that climb of rock take to it’s it’s actually surprisingly quick we were the first team out that morning we were the first we were the first team

There um and there’s a bit of a story behind it if you want me to go over it please okay so we we set off and I had real difficulty and well first of all you’ve got to scramble a little bit and get to a place at that point that’s

Where you ditch your bags and it’s um bit of mountain etiquette you ditch your bags and I uh nobody really nobody touches them it’s you know it’s all pretty safe I ditch me bag and realize I left me camera so I was pretty gutted having got to the top and finding I had

No camera but what actually happened was um as I went around I struggled to have enough flexibility uh there’s almost like make a right angle like this where you effectively come up the bit of rock that you’re on and then to the side and that’s the one with the shear drop so

Your M was coming up onto the face um and I just remember thinking my God I’m never going to be able to get around here but um bit of I I can’t remember probably a bit of heave ho and less technical stuff just managed to get

Myself in position and then I was on the face itself with this other guy that had been paired with all week and then the guy was sort of leading up so he had us on two ropes coming down and then you go up and the exposure is enormous there’s

No doubt about it you look down and just as we were approaching the top and there was about four or five teams out um all following us behind um um the mountain rescue helicopter came up and we were thinking oh God somebody’s Fallen what’s happened here

And um we were sort of having a look over our shoulders and seeing what was going on and all of son the doors on this helicopter open with a camera on it a full Thum camera no way and the new energy that you get point when a recording device is appears

Wow yeah is like so um The Summit it isn’t again it’s it’s probably just the exposure that really gets to you but it’s more scumbling were they filming you guys like they were yeah and I’ll I’ll tell you how I know all this but we got to the top and I remember sitting

Down and uh putting me hands over me knees like this and so on the top and it’s a lot bigger than it probably looks actually it’s not a point it’s quite big there’s actually a statue that’s been hit by lightning and it’s got half of it intact of um of um

Mary and uh yes it’s been yeah the Lightning’s hit it and I remember sitting at the top thinking I can’t believe I just got up there um that was a sense of achievements it was like blame me I’ve done it and then obviously this helicopter was still there filming

So there’s a few waves and whatever then I realized I had got me camera because we ditch the backpacks and everybody ditches the backpacks yeah um and there’s a reason for that as well so um coming down on the app sale literally um I just remember the piece

Of rock that we had to uh stand on was just it was it was it was Tiny it was sort of this big and we all sort of had a toe on it um coming down I remember stopping you put a a rat’s tail and secure yourself to it so you’re secure

Um but it’s it there’s a little bit of uneasiness there about it the GU obviously very confident of what they’re doing and and and then there’s another bit to go down so it’s it’s a it’s a climb up but you come down it’s two um

App sales down to get back to where you start started from um at least I think it’s two yeah I’m pretty sure it was two either way when we got back and we we sort of went back to the Hut the helicopter was actually there um I went inside and I

Started saying on I was like there were Italian crew and they’ve been doing this video they were doing a video on Mountain climbs and I gave them an email address I said please just send me a picture said then have me camera with me anyway but said nothing is ever going to

Beat a photograph on top of Don de Jean with more block sunrise in the background there’s nothing ever going to beat that ever and they never sent it oh no never got it you know what that company was was called do you know what no but track them down um I actually

Wrote and I do speak a little bit of French but I used the internet to uh work it through wrote to the mountain rescue helicopter site in French because I knew if I wrote in English they wouldn’t reply um and I asked on the day

Who was doing it and do you have any contact details and never got reply back from them either wow oh it’ be some photograph or some video yeah probably in some documentary yeah in some Italian documentary they’ll be climbing on it yeah but it has made itself into a movie

There’s a a movie called um Summit fever on sky at the minute and it’s the first Peak they climb okay I believe is don’t don’t and and it that actually gives you a true Feel For What It’s actually you like for the exposure it really does the drop I’m

Just even looking I can I can see one part where they hook on just when you’re describing getting onto the face and just the video watch just in between the these two meetings I could see this and this drop that you’re talking about but it’s obviously just the start of it and

Then it’s yeah well I I will be able to um kind of combine video with the conversation so as you talk about something we we will kind of stop and try and figure out what there is there were were you inspired by any of these names that I read out to

You you know like Joe Tasker Peter Borman did do do you and do you watch this stuff do you watch documentaries on climbing or you just do climbing so this is something you you pick at as a a challenge every year it’s something you work towards there’s always something I

Choose to do yeah the names no not necessarily the thing is with with climbing it’s if there if there’s something on one day I might sit and watch it I think the only thing that I’ve watched recently was the nepales guy that managed to do the 8,000 meter

Peaks in a ridiculously short period of time I mean that’s just super human that I can’t remember his name but it’s that that challenge that mesner started wasn’t it where he decided to do all the 8,000 meter Peaks it is kind it’s like it’s in the danger zone isn’t

It I mean you’re taking your life into your own hands trying to achieve the is it four there’s 14 of them is that right 14 8,000 me yes I think so yeah yeah that sounds right yeah few girl or two women I think died on not sure if it was

Anna Perna this year and that that kind of brings me to the bigger the big question I wanted to ask you about one of the things I follow is you know with Everest and uh George mallerie and Andrew Irvine do you have any opinion on did they make

It to the top or not or is that something I think they made it to the top but not the bottom obviously I think they summited I think they were just that they had that dogger determination about them I’m I’m pretty convinced they got there will we ever know I have uh I

Actually have the camera from that expedition I have one of these that I encountered totally by accident around the same time when I started reading those books maybe a couple of years before started reading those books I I got one of these cameras the Kodak vest

Pocket camera and I have a video up on YouTube and it has like 800 views just see this I turn it around a few times and press the shutter but um it’s interesting to to see these cameras and you know would they be still there and obviously they found what what was the

Guy’s name George mallerie they found his body it was mallerie wasn’t it like I got that’s why he stuff and he said because it’s there yeah and I I totally get it yeah okay yeah and is it something to do yes is it what way do

You see a mountain like do you do you have any kind of Talisman things that you do before you climb a mountain do you have like things that you what’s the word for it where you look for danger points do you have like a procedure or process um that you go through when

You’re going to climb when you’re climbing yeah I mean I’m not I’ve got to say I mean I like to push myself wherever else but I’m not one of these people that will free climb or do anything ridiculous look Al Capitan or something along those lines um everything I do and certainly since

My son’s been around I’m a lot more safety conscious uh and I’m not Reckless at all I mean I I think there is the expression I often used when it was to do with actually something very s simple which was the Three Peaks in in the UK was it got past

The point of being dangerous it was bordering on stupidity um and that’s when you’re going to just walk off a cliff because it was foggy that’s what happened there yeah and so I think that’s the threshold is like dangerous yes um you know you

Got to think of the the other side to it it’s like somebody from Mountain Rescue is going to come out and find you or or whatever so I kind of have a a MTO myself that you know if I ever have to get rescued off a mountain I’m going to

Hang up my boots you know it’s it’s yeah well not necessarily I mean I mean to be honest the guys that do that sort of work expected I mean if you’re fallen into your leg or something like that but you’ve got all the right equipment and you’ve you know you’ve done everything

You can um you can’t really help that situation but if you go up you know ladies in high heels or you don’t take a a warm jacket and you take no water or something you know I there’s actually a review of Ben NIS isn’t there where somebody complains allegedly true review somebody

Said they got to the top of Ben n and it’s not like snow because there was no restaurant up there I mean yeah I know yeah well yeah and there’s there’s kind of two there’s a few different layers to it but it’s it’s that process and procedure of what do

You Che what do you check and that you don’t you don’t engage in this activity in any Reckless way you know you don’t because you respect the people that would have to uh rescue and a legitimate rescue is different than you know something where it’s hard to tell isn’t

It with those things I know looking at Scotland 20,000 people any given day go out into the mountains and the Mountain Rescue loved their job they 100% love their job um they don’t ever judge somebody on doing something um it’s it’s part of their life you know

Or their lifestyle as well I even see in Scotland at times they they have somebody from Mountain Rescue up there camping kind of so that they’re up ahead of if something does happen on a set of Peaks there’s usually some guy up there it’s like they’re on rotation almost and

They’re up there camping just for the crack but they’re on some sort of rotation thing so that there is somebody up high that can acoss I I wouldn’t say it’s not impossible that that happens yeah I mean the Scots are tough people aren there Nation that’s they’re tough

Yeah um altitude was another thing you know like um was a question I had in terms of your experience with altitude there’s a lot of different thoughts on this people don’t have the experience I think or they don’t realize what happens with altitude or the the other point of this would be

Disorientation how do you deal with disorientation or how do you deal with um low oxygen environments like obviously you have to be calculating enough to know that you have there’s an effect on the way you think and the way you act and the way you operate at at

Altitude um I’ve I’ve been at altitude three times and I kind of felt there was a bit of comedy at altitude as well there’s because you’re a bit lightheaded or whatever there seems to be comedy is more accessible due to you know partial asphixiation I I don’t know if that’s

Just me but um I don’t know I’m not got that but you know at altitude there’s less pressure holding your blood vessels together the the the air takes four times four times the breath to access the oxygen that’s in it because it lacks the the the air isn’t at the same

Pressure um do you have any experiences with this uh environment um do you have a method that you you climb at when when you’re in that environment no what what altitude were you at and where was it just so one one of the mountains uh was uh tuol

Which was 4,200 oh yes in Morocco yeah yeah um the very first encounter I had sorry the the second last one was the Sierra Nevadas which was 14,000 ft or 144 and in the Sierra Nevada above a place called bishop and I just REM remember getting a headache I’d

Literally gotten to America landed in LA and the very next morning set off to about 8,900 ft and then set off for a walk to 14,000 ft that evening and I just had a splitting headache I remember I just said to my nephew I said I’ve got to go to I’ve got

To lie down I’ve got to go to sleep but I remember having one orange uh just before bed and the pain in my head alleviated for about 40 minutes and then it came back into my head um but the next day we climbed again just much slower U so we were

Doing like 25 steps and stopping 25 steps and stopping and proceeded for the whole day like this until we got to the top um but my first encounter with altitude was uh the Grand Canyon now people wouldn’t think the Grand Canyon is any big thing um but I believe it’s

At 8,000 F feet the top of the Grand Canyon is at 8,000 ft I was mountain biking at the time fit as a fiddle I I had a six-pack like no one could believe I actually could have had a six-pack but I had I was like 19 years of age and I I

And I walked down into the Grand Canyon at some stage I turned around to walk back out and I realized there was some sort of fatigue it was like I was heavy I couldn’t understand what was what was going on i’ since understand it to be

The altitude that I was at and my body just wasn’t acclimatized we we’ driven there i’ i’ decided to walk down two or three two or three miles and then turned around and it took me like six times the amount of time to get out it was only

Later on in life I realized it was to do with the altitude you know just at the Grand Canyon just this tiny slight difference in air pressure um like obviously you know it’s something I’m interested in because I believe there’s a there’s a rate that you can climb at

Where these effects your body kind of climatize to just wondering if you had any understanding of that or what way do you yeah you know I’ve I’ve had it um a few times actually altitude sickness um so quite bit of breadth of experience with it um same as you in Morocco in

Nepal in Mongolia several places in uh South America um I remember the first time was on the Inca Trail I believe um and then I went to a place called vinata if I remember it rightly which was nevado aate was the name of the peak and there was three 5,000 meter

Peaks around there and I remember feeling really not great but okay but there was one thing I did learn it wasn’t it was to do with altitude but no actually altitude sickness was you don’t go to bed on a full stomach I actually stuffed my face because I was so hungry

And the oxygen levels didn’t let the food digest while I was sleeping I was up at 3:00 in the freezing cold I think it was aboutus 15 outside and I just could not stop being ill just violently ill and there was um a couple on the

Trip there was only four of us anyway but there happened to be a and nurse and they were saying we don’t think you’ve digested the food properly not able to oxidize it yeah so I’ve always followed that advice ever since that point fascinating yeah I remember there was an

Irish guy in my tent with me a shair he was Irish um and he said to me you’re not very well are [Laughter] you and yeah I thought he’s nailed it I think he realized I wasn’t Shaman but that way but I mean um H when I did the

Akong gawa which is the Spanish pronunciation because I learned about it in Peru or learned more about it it’s Akon kagu is the way British people Irish people whe the West the world calls it akaga a um that one when I went there I ended up

Sharing a tent with a Swedish judge at base camp and he left he was from Stockholm he said I remember him saying he left Stockholm when it was M as 19 and he decided not to do the summit because he found it too cold and which I thought quite remarkable for by Swedish

Standards yeah um but I I remember the altitude at base camp was about 4,400 meters um and just getting out of the tent was an ordal uh I remember just walking and the pulse was like 120 or something like that just standing up and moving yeah just just just yeah just

Being being a being normal just being there we we put a pulse oximeter on a guide in a similar situation and his was just like resting heart rate at sea level it was like 67 69 or something like this we were at 110 100ish yeah sorry go ahead yeah no that’s exactly I

Mean and then um we we stayed there for a good few days and they were it was actually an Argentine company um I I’d used but they were really professional this going now um they they have a doctor who signs you off to go he does all the medical checks

And wherever else and I was good to go and I remember um I can’t remember the name of the first Camp the second Camp I think is called Condor if I remember rightly and all I remember was I need to put me tent up and have a drink

Otherwise I’m just going to really suffer here or have to go down um so I got the tent up and I got myself warm and and I had a massive drink all very very quickly and then I was fine because realized what was causing it so address

The problem fix it and then and the thing is if i’ actually had a drink first and got warm and not put me tent up there would have been a temptation to not bother putting the tent up at all so that’s why I made sure the tent was up

First because then I could just crash into it and yeah shelter first isn’t that what they say shelter and then yeah um and then at the high camp of Berlin which was the one at about 6,200 M um that’s when it was perishing it it was freezing yeah you feel that I

Remember when I was at the top of tubic call I looked up I I stupidly wore fingerless gloves because I had a GoPro everyone else had um Snickers bars in this pocket here you know to keep their Snickers bars warm and I had batteries

To do at a GoPro in this pocket and I even remember changing them and thinking oh my God they’re like blocks of ice you know they were like ice cubes when I take them out of the camera and but I remember I remember I was wearing

Fingerless gloves I kind of went it was like a a mountain climb in Ireland but I had fingerless gloves on for the cameras and I didn’t I wasn’t suffering too much but I remember looking at my nails when the daylight came and the whole center

Of my nails were white I had like a a tiny red ring around the outside of my nails and I’m still to this day I’ve never seen that again I was fascinated probably what I got as well my nails went white yeah I was fascinated by just

Like this tiny red ring around them because of the cold um obviously we were we weren’t up there that long but it was still I’ll never forget walking up through the snow that that sound of crampons on ice I remember thinking this will haunt you forever this the sound of the squeaking

Of sticks and ice and stuff like that let’s go back to the camping and the Trident and you didn’t stop for warm drinks on the second day you just play played on that I just remember being um as the trail pleas but because I was carrying most of the weight and I ended

Up leading for quite a bit of time um and I think it was just to do with the fact that with the way it was clearing all the snow so it was making easier for everybody else behind to walk through um I don’t know what the ratios

Were if it was 1 hour two hours or whatever else but I remember thinking I’ve been doing this for ages now right but I I think it came down to that it was making it easier for everybody else and it was keeping the keeping the rate

Up at that stage yeah like you said you were the youngest on the I was actually 37 you you said I was 29 I was confusing myself I’m thinking okay I think you were 29 when you came up with the I was 29 when I decided everything in me life

That I I was talking about doing I was going to stop talking about and start doing it that that was the that point and it wasn’t until earlier I caued onto that yeah I’m thinking 20 so so you were 37 doing the Traverse of said Georgia

W which is I and I would have thought yeah you were much younger than that but because you said you know you were the youngest but you were obviously the youngest of four people who were doing it at the same time yeah Bruno was probably pushing 50 but he was a fake

Guy anyway the other two were probably just in the early 40s May’s just turned 40 yeah what what sort of training would you do week to week would you do any training you go to the gym or anything like that is that something you do or I’ve always

Done I I used to play an awful lot of football which kept me massively fit uh yeah played a lot a lot of football it was almost like oh we’re short tonight you want to come down and play five aside ended up playing and then get

There and say oh where short can you play for us as well so play a lot of football yeah but in the early 20s I did do a lot of uh running I was running six miles a night and putting um half an hour circuit training and

I’ve always lived by um I could probably do with losing a bit now but um yeah it’s different lifestyle but I could I was swore by a bit of running press UPS situps and if you can some chinups and that’s got me fit and strong enough to do most things and keeps is

Strong enough like yeah when you say a a bit of okay you know this is what I was talking about about the technical information um people would be interested in what a bit of is is it is it 100 is it 25 is it 50 of press UPS

Sit-ups stuff like this um it used to be uh always 50 50 was always the the The Benchmark 250 the but when it came to the circuit training it was really really fast but always had to be done properly if I didn’t do it properly I wouldn’t count it and you’re going to

Have that mental discipline so it was 10 press UPS straight over to 10 sit-ups 10 press-ups 10 sit-ups and just do it and get to your 50 yeah yeah and shin UPS anytime you had access to a bar and do and do 10 they’re gonna have to set one up in

The middle of the forest you’ll see me doing a bit of um what’s what’s Rocky five or was it Rocky four I’m not sure where he’s doing all the the the natural was it four yeah yeah yeah but actually he did do that in the film I

Wasn’t um yeah now you’ve said it yeah there was um it was DOL whatever he’s called it he was doing all the sort of ethnical stuff and whatever else and Sil Rocky was just doing it the natural way yeah and it that didn’t influence me it’s just always my way it’s interesting so

Um you’ve been you’ve been very good first of all to let me talk to you I’m I’m sure we’ve just touched on the icing on the cake of your experiences and stuff like that but you you really have been very good to give me some of that detail about your

Experience I i’ I’d love to put them against your video and other videos and and stuff like that and try and make a visual story as well even though the the story in itself is just brilliant you know um when when you did get to the end they didn’t obvious was the Wailing

Station still in stom Ness was that was that there it was yeah so what happened was on the walk we came up to another Hill and dropped down into if I remember right it was Fortuna Bay and then the boat was waiting for us and um that was

Actually really scary in a really unusual way it was just cuz the bag weighed so much and on the Zodiac I just thought if I fall backwards here nobody’s I’m never gonna get this off question I would have just dropped like an anchor yeah um but we went back on

Board the boat um we met up with everybody else and then everybody else got off and then they did the short walk up hill you come to the top and strongness is there there’s remnants of the station still left there I mean you can you can see there’s buildings and

Structures when you when you get there and it was the bit of a trudge down to the to the the bottom with everybody else so they’d actually made it so the rest of the ship could do it that the ones that were up for it that last section not everybody did

It it was I remember there was an elderly lady in her 80s she’d actually because i’ been taking some photographs for her she’d actually bought me a beanie from the museum because that was one of the compromis and I didn’t I even asked her she’ just

Done it for me um she bought me this South Georgia beanie and it was all because I’d been taking some photographs but the rest of the group had gone to the museum at grip Vick because we were walking we we’ missed the opportunity okay and she so we went at nighttime

Which was almost like a military assault to be honest and a zodiac trying to land across the first seals um it was definitely walking sticks at the very much handy trying to get them away and then we went to shackleton’s grave okay and we had a small glass of

Champagne in my case very small because I don’t drink um I’m TR for about 30 years now that was our little bit of Celebration lovely and I actually put a photograph up somewhere I can’t remember it maybe it was Facebook many years ago and somebody says why have you put a

Picture up next to a great I’m do you know whose grave that is yeah proud moment I’d say to stand there beside it yeah exactly yeah yeah I’ve often thought of that you in some of the accounts of it must it must be a fascinating feeling to have that uh

As something you’ve done you you say not many people know about it but uh maybe people don’t know about it well maybe some people might know after this you know it connects the dots for me in terms of the story what it was like to have somebody real that’s there that was

There you know so I really appreciate that I really appreciate the time you’ve spent very nice to talk to you mark this evening I’m sure we’ll update at some stage so thanks very much for your time yeah thanks very much all right cheers Che cheers Mark take care bye