February 7, 2024 Budget Committee

This is the video for the February 7, 2024 Budget Committee

E e e e e e e e e e e e e e all right folks we’ll get settled sh e all right good morning everybody uh I want to begin by acknowledging that we’re in MMI the traditional and the unsurrendered land of the mmma people uh the peace and friendship uh treaties

That was sted starting in 1720s um are a road map for our relationship and we honor those um at Council and I hope uh the entire municipality does somebody want to consider the approval of the minutes of January 24th councelor hensby seconded by councelor Kent all in favor I oppos

Those are done the order of business today is that we are going to be uh looking at the uh Halifax Regional Police and RCMP uh Halifax budget um does somebody want to move the order of approval as circulated councelor Stoddard seconded by councelor Mason all in favor carried

Calls yeah I will yeah calls for con uh Declarations of conflict of interest um I am uh sitting in I’m Mike Savage I’m sitting in for councelor Russell who is the chair of audit um and finance but is also the chair of the committee the whole budget meetings that

We have um if he’s watching at home we continue to wish him well um and uh so this is a budget committee meeting and it begins with public participation we have a number of people who’ve signed up to speak and uh so we’re going to ask

Them to come forward now um people will have up to five minutes Andrea here has the signs show them the signs uh be holding up the 30 seconds and then the time we have a number of people to hear from that we want to hear from today so

We ask people to uh uh be strict on the timing and the first person we’re going to hear from is Victoria lak uh who I see there we’re going to give you a chance to get set up I think Vicki if you want we got the clerk handling this to make

It as convenient as possible I want to thank everybody who’s come down today again everybody will have five minutes it’s not a question and answer session it is a chance for you to say what you feel um what you speak to here can be brought forward by counselors in

Debate following and um word missing oh right there holding it so you can use it that’s great okay so I’m going to wait for everyone to get settled are we good Mr May good morning council members and members of the community community I thought about what I’m going to say quite a bit

Today but I’m a little nervous because I fear the words I say won’t do any good but then again we must always do we must always stand up for what we believe in and so I will do my best and hope my words do not follow by people who simply saying interest in

What I have to say I know a lot of people have complaints about the X Force I am among them but rather than explaining why the hrp does not do what I consider to be in the best of Public Safety I would rather give you Solutions rather than

Complaints to that end I’ve compiled a list of what I feel and many of my community feel the $5.4 million that is being asked for could be better spend on to improve Public Safety and well-being and by this list is by no means exhaustive but here are some

Examples of what we could do with that money after school programs for at risk youth Community Theater and arts programs Community forges program like the CL inclusion that help people in the disability Community also Prescot group who provides employment and other ways of interacting with the community for people who

Have difference in how they see things give give places like out of the cold and add some house for women and children give more public more funding to public libraries who provide countless resources at low or no cost building a community have with all the resources that those who are on

House could could would would need to get back on their feet more community these places in general where people don’t have to spend money in order to spend their time and can simply exist buy back lots that are currently unused and put them towards public housing putting more

Money into the public safety officer budget they have great ideas provide grants for people who have ideas about how to better improve our community put more money towards public transit put more money into the access accessibility budget so we can truly reach the goal of being fully accessible by the year 2030

Or give money to animals like I said this is by no means an exhausted list and but all these things will provide much more benefit to our communities than people with guns and in closing I would like to point out that we as a community would

Should prent crime not punish it and to that end I ask you to deny the 2024 2025 budget for the for the police and their increase in the fun Community not cops thank you very much uh Victoria always good to see you and appreciate your point of

View uh next on the list is Emerson roach followed by Jamie Livingston and then Eloise Bernett Emerson right good morning welcome hi thank you my name is Emerson roach I’m a small business owner and I was born and raised right here in Halifax before I

Get into my speech I want to note that I took time out of my demanding schedule running a small business to speak at the last budget meeting as well as this one because I believe that Community consultation is an essential part of a democratic process and one that we

Should be actively engaged in and I was dismayed to read that Vice chair Gavin gues had disparaged the community consultation process insulting community members like me who had taken hours out of their busy schedules unpaid to voice their concerns about the hrp’s Reckless spending habits and egregious budget

Request we have better things to do with our time then come to meetings to titilate and annoy you and that is a direct quote from Gavin GES um we are here because we have to beg to have our voices even recognized by the city this is a perfect

Example of why the hrp has fundamentally lost the trust of the citizens of Halifax over and over again we’ve pushed for reform for transparency for accountability only to be met with hostility the pece the police have sought to preserve their salaries above all else even when it means causing

Active harm to the community even when their budget could be better allocated to Social Services that would actually solve the problems at the root of crime we need to treat the underlying disease not the symptoms we know that police presence does not deter or prevent crime a 2020 journalistic investigation into

60 years of police spending Across America found no correlation between higher police spending and a reduction in crime a 2024 University of Toronto study of 20 of Canada’s largest municipalities including Halifax analyzed police budgets and crime levels over an 11-year period and found that an increase in police funding had no

Consistent correlation with crime rates what does tangibly decrease rates of crime decades worth of studies say that the most effective deterrence of crime are access to stable income safe housing and mental and physical healthare additional factors that can help prevent crime are Early Childhood Intervention programs such as food support and

Parental coaching free vocational and educational training opportunities Grassroots community that organizations as well as some very basic public amenities like adding street lights funding free social Gathering spaces such as libraries public parks and Community dropin spaces all of these have been statistically proven to reduce crime rates for violent and non-violent

Crime alike I would also like to address that part of the hrp’s proposed budget increase cited the need for more officers specifically to respond to mental health calls which have taken a sharp upturn in the past few years but experts from a variety of fields are actually calling for the police to be

Detached asked from mental health Cults in fact the report from the mass casualty Commission on the 2020 mass shooting in portae recommended that the province establish a mental healthc care model for urban and rural areas that eliminates the practice of using police as the sole First Responders to mental

Health calls Halifax Regional Police only receive 40 hours of Crisis interv Intervention training as opposed to mental health professionals and social workers who train for years in Crisis Intervention coupled with the fact that only about half of the Halifax Regional Police Force have actually received received that training as of junee 2023

That was the most recent number that I could find you should be able to understand why this is woefully inadequate and it is not just the community at large that is calling for the police to remove themselves from Mental Health crisis response but also the police themselves in May of 2023

Jeff Christie the chief superintendent of the RCMP said that the police can’t be the mobile mental health response team they just can’t Chief Dave mcneel with the turo police has said this isn’t the type of work that we sign on to do and it’s not the type of work that we’re

Actually trained well to do deputy chief Danny MC with the Bridgewater Police Service said we’re not full-time mental health case workers we don’t have that experience from working full-time that’s not our profession if the police are so concerned that they’re being forced to act outside of their mandate on Mental

Health calls they would petition for changes to the Nova Scotia involuntary psychiatric treatment act which requires officers to remain onsite with patients who have been detained and brought to hospital but that wouldn’t pad the budget would it to summarize our tax dollars need to go towards addressing

The actual root of crime and working towards actual crime prevention which includes funding various social services and detas police for mental health calls as well as allowing actual professionals to take on the work that they were actually trained for not police we need real Sustainable Solutions not an increasingly militarized police presence

Designed to punish and intimidate citizens who are experiencing Mass suffering due to policy failure thank you thank you very much uh Emerson I understand that Jamie Livingston is now uh coming in uh virtually Madam Clark is that the case yes that is the case mayor okay all right

None of those folks look like Jamie Livingston should we work on this and go to the next speaker what do you think I believe so CH okay all right we’ll try to get Jamie on uh video uh the next speaker is uh Eloise Bernett followed by Collins Ellison and Joanne hussy

Eloise the note says pending maybe Eloise is not with us we’ll try to come back uh Collins Ellison followed by Joanne hussy and Ryan federko Collins Allison are you here not here at the moment okay Joanne hussy Joanne is here Joanne followed by Ryan federko and Luke Campbell good morning good

Morning uh so my name is Joanne uh I live in District 10 in Halifax Bedford Basin and I was one of the 700 115 individuals who signed the open letter that you received so I’m speaking today as an individual I’ve also taken time off work

To be here uh but I have been involved in work related to housing to politics and social justice in Halifax for most of the past 20 years uh I care a lot about evidencebased decisionmaking and using public spending to maximize public good uh which makes

Me so much fun at parties um but it it’s from that perspective that I’m asking Council to reject the requested increase of almost $6 million to the 20242 Halifax Regional Police budget um I expect that I’m not going to say anything that you haven’t already heard and that you don’t already know um

I know that you’ve already been been pointed towards the article published in volume 49 Issue 4 of the Journal of Canadian public policy which analyzed the data around police and and crime uh and found no consistent associations between police funding and crime rates across municipalities in Canada and

Overall that net increases in spending per capita were not associated with greater net decreases in crime rates so there’s no evidence that larger police budgets will increase the safety or well-being in our communities like many of the folks that you’re going to hear from today I support the recommendations of the

Defunding the police report prepared by the board of police commissioner subcommittee and those thoughtfully put forward in the final report by the mass casualty commission the defunding the police report is really clear that defunding the police is not about making cuts to the police budget just for austerity’s

Sake it’s about making legislative and policy reforms that promote Community safety tying police budgets to actual performance me measures and decreasing budget allocations to police while increasing budget allocations to safety promoting community building resources that are chronically underfunded so those principles are repeated in the mass casualty commission

Report that report calls for the community and not the police to be at the center of a modernized community safety and well-being model and for the police to serve as a collaborative partner not the primary actor that report calls for a shift in community safety budgets to focus on prevention

Activities um I want to quote from one of the Lessons Learned in the mass casualty commission report that I think is really important they said that naming and countering the operation of misogyny racism homophobia and other inal inegalitarian attitudes within policing must be placed at the heart of strategies to improve everyday policing

If police continue to disbelieve women operate in ignorance about how violence and Trauma present and work in a silo rather than as a coordin ated Community safety system the problems that were documented in that report will persist so continuing to make significant annual increases in funding to that kind of

Policing is not the way forward so we have the research and we know which practices are supported by the evidence and I’m asking you to make an evidence-based decision and direct public spending towards the areas of greatest benefit so those would involve investments in civilian only Mental Health crisis intervention teams

Increasing support for Emergency Shelters and Street Outreach programs increasing funding for youth programs safe communities are communities where everyone has enough income to pay for the things they need safe and affordable shelter and access to enough nutritious food so safe communities our communities where where people are healthy and have

Increased well-being um we need to invest in that we don’t need more cops thanks thank you very much and uh thank you to our uh folks in the gallery who are cheering with their hands will notice that and appreciate that I think we’re good to try to go

Back to our uh guest virtually uh Jamie Livingston is that right yes okay Jamie are you with us I think so good morning thank you for joining us the floor is yours good morning thanks my name is Dr Jamie Livingston I’m a criminologist and resident of District 8 today I’ll be

Speaking in opposition to the proposed substantial increase to the budgets of Halifax’s Police Services with my time I’m going to highlight three areas of concern first that increased police spending is neither an effective or evidence-based approach for preventing crime or enhancing Community safety as your previous speakers have highlighted

Not only does peer reviewed criminological research indicate this over decades but the pattern of crime rates and police spending in our M municipality clearly demonstrate this police budgets in each in HRM have increased every year for at least the past decade and show no association with whether crime rates have trended up or

Trended down so if your goal is to address crime and improve Community safety in HRM the Research indicates that this won’t be effectively achieved by inre ining the size of a police force it’s fiscally prudent to invest our limited resource resources in public dollars and evidence-based crime prevention approaches so this brings me

To my second area of concern in March last year city council voted to approve hrm’s Public Safety strategy which established strategic priorities for improving Community safety in our municipality this strategy is informed by actual evidence crime prevention evidence and the needs of our community it calls for investing in a spectrum of

Downstream programs to build the social conditions of safety some of which Vicki LC nicely spoke to previously and to develop alternative models to responding without the police to non-criminal matters such as houselessness and Mental Health crisis the public safety strategy does not call for increasing the size of

The police force the proposed budget increase will divert significant resources away from meeting the Strategic priorities of the public safety strategy and I believe will move adrm further away from achieving its legislative mandate to develop and maintain viable and safe communities my third and final area of concern is that the proposed budget

Increase is not aligned with the needs and values of the community this is demonstrated in the extensive Community consultations that went along with the public safety strategy the defund the police report as well as the Mass casual commission’s final report to name a few also an open

Letter has been submitted and signed by hundreds of individuals and organizations in HRM who call on you to reject this significant budget increase further at P public consultations held recently by the board of police Commissioners there was strong opposition to the proposed budget increase it should cause great concern

That public input was wholly ignored by the majority members of a board that has a legislative duty to incorporate Community Values needs and expectations into their decisions so in closing I respectfully urge you to F make a fiscally prudent decision to reject the proposed police budget increase thanks for your

Time thank you for your time and uh for your letter as well thank you uh very much um okay I’ll just see is is Eloise brunette here Collins Collins Ellison okay we’ll go to Ryan furko Luke Campbell and Madison gelder Ryan fedko that was going to be in person was

It uh Madam clerk oh yes sir okay uh L Camp Sor excuse is actually a virtual speaker okay let’s see if we can bring him in uh yes Ryan have one of those acted for the event however I’ll be speaking my name is Pap buard and I’ll be speaking on

Behalf of the National Police Federation okay so good morning mayor and counselors please I don’t have that on the list is no so R was be speaking on behalf of the national Federation of police um so our current Speaker here is speaking on behalf okay thank you very much uh sorry

For the confusion go ahead thank you very much mayor and counselors thank you for the opportunity to be here today my name is Pep buard I’m speaking to you today on behalf of the director of the Atlantic region on behalf of National Police Federation the National Police feder Federation represents 20,000 RCP

Members serving across Canada and internationally including 190 RCMP officers here in the Halifax Regional municipality uh the ntf is focused on improving Public Safety to all Canadians including members by advocating for much needed investment in public safety Continuum to enhance safety and liability of the many communities we

Serve including houss I’m here to speak about and to ask you to support the Halifax Regional Department uh rcmp’s much needed funding request for 1.1 million in the upcoming 2024 2025 fiscal year for the hiring of six new officer positions this include two new intimate uh partner violence investigator to

Support victims of intimate partner violence and four general duty members in our view this is the minimum investment HRM should make to enhance Public Safety and ease pressures current Halifax Regional attachment rmp members perhaps most significantly this request is being made to reduce the decline in the ratio of police officers to the

Hrm’s population commonly referred to as the copto pop ratio over the last number of year Halifax RCMP copto pop ratio has been getting smaller and smaller and currently sits at 96.4 officers per 100,000 people by HRM staff estimates if current funding levels remain stable hrm’s RCMP cop to pop ratio will be the

Lowest in the country by 2627 compared to other cities with over 100,000 people it’s important to note that the national average in 2022 was 181 and the Nova sco average was 184 officers per 100,000 people even with this new six officers the halifa regional Detachment are CMP will be

Substantially under the provincial and national average these statistics are alarming and present a significant risk to Public Safety as it can ultimately result in longer wait times for Police Service reduced police visibility in communities and affect immediate backup times these low rmp officer rates also affect officer Wellness each of our

Members is being asked to do more with less respond to more calls for service work additional overtime shift hours and forego the necessary time off required for police officers to live with a healthy work life balance and this turn turn results in officers experiencing burnout and clinical mental health

Challenges over time ultimately this contributes to a clinic cyclical problem of reduced Staffing rates because it results in even more officers requiring time off for sick leave which in turn exacerbates the lack of officers available for Duty uh being a police officer for 22 years I can tell you the

Police work is hard on our minds hard on our bodies and hard on our souls in addition to officer Wellness this investment in the RCMP will also provide Good Financial value to the healthex regional municipality as part of hrm’s contract with Nova Scotia pring policing service agreement the city benefits from

30% Federal contribution to the municipality overall uh their policing costs with this agreement the all-in cost per officer is $179,000 is of incredible value to the city given that other municipalities are paying one L $200,000 per officer additionally the RCMP also provides 24 specialized services to the city and to

The hrp at little to no cost uh lastly this request also follows numerous policing reform reports and studies it is in line with a recent price Waterhouse Cooper policing transformation report that was delivered to Council in April 2023 the mass casualty commission report from March 2023 and the hrm’s public safety

Strategy 20232 24 2526 prevent and reduce crime this this request should be viewed as a positive gradual first step towards A New Path towards more Progressive Innovative and safer Halifax Community in conclusion we urge the alifax Regional Council to approve the hrd rcmp’s funding request so that more

Police resources can be added to the city’s current RCP complement and enhance its police enhance its policing service to Residents thank you again for this chance to highlight the importance of this investment and I’m happy to take questions if you have any uh I’d like to

To just uh take a moment to speak to some of the uh concerns that were raised by other citizens um that say that not necessarily more police officers result in uh crime reduction and they’re correct however uh the efficiency folks folks folks excuse me uh Mr fedurco the

Time is up we appreciate you uh uh coming to uh speak with us today uh virtually thank you um okay Luke Campbell Madison geldert Kevin Russell and we ask you when you come up just to confirm your name and the community you live Lou Campbell hello everyone good

Morning hello good hi my name is Lou I live in District 8 um like many of my community members I’m here to uh emphatically State my position against in the increase to the police budget um and I’m here to speak about uh refunding Social Services with that

Money instead and um I’ve noticed that there’s going to be some repetition you’re going to hear some things again and again and I’m I just ask you to see that as how passionate we are and really like tune in to those things rather than tuning out that repetition shows that

We’ve done our research so please just see that as how passionate we are um there are many valuable insights into why raising police budgets is not a good use of taxpayer money uh Halifax’s social services are in dire need and you hear a lot of talk about defunding the

Police but let’s try and switch that to refunding Social Services um what if instead of the police receiving 5,787 100 more making their total budget 998,199 we funneled that money into things that actually prevent crime often times these discussions uh come up and rise in crime is brought

Up as a reason to justify giving more money to the police and that’s cuz people are afraid and they think that cops are the solution to that fear but evidence shows that they are not uh someone already talked about a study that was released just this year by U

Oft saying that there’s no consistent associations between police funding increase and crime rates going down so increasing police does nothing to address the root causes of crime and we have so many glaring issues just outside you can see an encampment the housing crisis is so bad child poverty rates are

Higher than they’ve been in 30 years and people can’t afford to buy food um not only are these issues important but they actually affect crime rates because desperation leads to Crime so what can the municipality do what could we do with that money that would have a positive impact one massive factor that

Contributes to desperation is the grocery prices skyrocketing um in fact there are cops in grocery stores right now because shoplifting has become such a problem because people are starving so what if that money that we paid to those cops went to addressing that uh just yesterday a food strategy plan was presented to

Council called the just food action plan that would increase food Security in this city that total cost for that was $856,000 but it was declined to improve that action plan and instead they decided to break the budget down line by line before approving it saying that it wasn’t affordable and saying that food

Security is not your jurisdiction why is it that year after year police budget increases are pushed through without question and then an $856,000 food security request is denied this is a clear example that it’s not about what we can afford it’s about what we prioritize access to Affordable food

Should be one of our highest priorities there are people who are having to choose between feeding themselves and paying rent the municipality should be doing whatever it can to manage this food isn’t the only thing that deserves to be prioritized over policing Mental Health crisis response could be something we look into another

Way to detas the police the entire Street Navigator program only cost $345,000 a year you could invest in better and lower cost Transit better snow removal look at how badly we need that libraries could be open longer more holistic response to the issue of homelessness these are just a few

Suggestions but there are a multitude of ways that that money could be better spent that would have a much more positive impact on our city you just need to actually make the leap you’ve already done some of the work the defunding report was commissioned and completed so you have what you need to

Start to refund Social Services you just need to have the bravery and the imagination to actually do it thank you thank you very much um is Madison here Madison gelder here then we’ll go to Kevin Russell Christal Owen and Mike Burgess Kevin Russell good morning um um mayor Savage

Counselors and members of the board of police Commissioners thank you for the opportunity to present on the proposed 2024 2025 police budget the investment property Owners Association of Nova Scotia ions has been of the voice of responsible private sector rental Pro housing providers since 1978 our members reflect the diversity

Of those in the private sector who provide rental housing in Halifax Regional municipality from large organizations owning thousands of units to smaller operators for whom this is their sole livelihood i’ would like to begin by uh by quoting from my January 24th 2024 budget presentation to Mayor and counselors to conclude the investment

Property Owners Association of Nova Scotia does not want does does want to support one expenditure increase police is a core service of municipal government our members and many tenants who live in our member properties are facing increased threats of violence from Bad tenants who break the law destroy property and threaten staff and

Other tenants many of the owners in staff who are threatened are women newcomers and and racialized persons we need our policing Services properly supported when someone breaks the law someone is available to take the call and respond ion’s members observed a surge in violence and disruptive behavior among uh tenants during a

Covid-19 uh pandemic instances of violence and problematic tenant conduct escalated uh to to me uh escalate due to measures under the province of state of emergency Mercy which prohibited actions to evict tenants although well- intentioned these measures led to abusive Behavior by some tenants who knew they could do anything without

Consequences unfortunately even after the state of emergency was lifted the incidents persisted and worsened the combination of increasing numbers of tenants grappling with a range of issues coupled with rental housing providers lacking access to comprehensive Support Services led to an unsafe work in work and living environments putting the

Safety of property owners staff and residents at risk the absence of enforcement compliance under the residential Tendencies act along with a lengthly resol resolution process taking six to n months leaves rental housing providers in need of protection they require confidence that when contacting the police not only will

There be a response but also the spatch of appropriately trained officers equipped to handle any encountered situation in light of these challenges we EMP emphasize the importance of properly funding our policing services this support ensures ures law enforcement can promptly effectively respond to calls whether they involve threats to owners staff residents

Whether it’s criminal criminal activities or individuals undergoing mental health EP episodes we appreciate your attention to our submission and thank you very much thank you very much uh the next three speakers are Christal ow and Mike burgus and Jesse hatch Christa thank you for joining us welcome

Good morning my name is Christa she her and I’m opposed to the budget increase for the Halifax Police and RCMP as a masters of social Works student I’ve walked alongside folks who have been navigating mental health and the carceral system and see how they are increasingly one in the same and I’m

Concerned about the surveillance approach to mental health interventions within the city to amplify the voices of those with lived experiences in the downtown down east side I will quotee from a report a police-based approach to social problems can only worsen the crisis the central role given to the

Police in this process will only entrench the problematic stereotyping and criminalization of marginalized people people who need real community supports and real economic and social empowerment yet it is the police rather than the people most affected who continue to be empowered in today’s political climate a shift in government

Priorities would Mark a first step in addressing the mental health challenges we all face in particular we envision real moves in the direction of defunding the police arm of the state and funding real housing and social supports for people’s empowerment rather than people’s oppression it’s unacceptable for the municipal government to fail to

Use the powers that they have to implement social change and then to blame the victims of its own failed policies thank you for considering the harmful impact this budget increase we’ll have on this community thank you Christa um Mike Burgess followed by Jesse [Applause] hatch uh good morning good morning good

Morning uh mayor mayor Mr Mayor uh council members of the board of police Commissioners uh my name is Mike Burgess I’m a landlord from North End Dartmouth for over 40 years and I want to thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak to your members this morning in

Support of the uh increased budget for the police for over 40 years I’ve provided affordable housing in Dartmouth Dartmouth North has had a bad reputation in the past but today I wanted to share my observations and experiences in focusing on the Pine Crest and Bru Street areas where some of my buildings

Are located in this neighborhood it’s home to many residents on disability income income assistance and they struggle from day to day many of the people live alone and are single parents they live with mental health issues substance use and substance AB abuse causes its own set of

Problems in 204 I bought uh one of nine boarded up buildings in the community when we began working on resurrecting the 12 unit building within an hour of removing a board off of first window a 12-year-old neighborhood boy had thrown a rock through an exposed window within

Days that building was broken into and over $6,000 with the tools were lost they were never recovered it was during this time that I met Chris free who was hpd’s first uh Community officer of the city when he retired the position was handed off to Randy wood who through his

Passion for the community evolved and grew the role uh exponentially over the years I’ve been fortunate to work with Randy and his other other others who would follow in that role through my interactions with them I’ve learned the profound and pro positive impact in their dedication and presence presence

That can make in the community this neighborhood’s had an abundance of thefts gangs drugs violence including murders over the years the response to the officers have been supportive and committed to the community I’ve been witnesses to the challenges that they face and the dangers that they’re sometimes placed in

While doing their jobs to protect us sometimes the police are criticized and judged we’ve seen that here this morning um uh but my experience when there’s been problems over the years hrpd has been there their jobs are difficult dangerous and challenging but in order to continue their good work it’s it’s essential that

Halifax Police have the resources and the manpower to support to be effective as our population continues to grow on an ongo the ongoing problems we already face with drugs poverty mental illness will only multiply to meet these demands and avoid an increase in crime it’s imperative that the department have the

Resources it needs to do their job it’s vital that the appropriate investment in the police force not be depreciated or overlooked an appropriate investment must be made I appreciate you inviting me to speak today or having the opportunity to to present my My Views and in closing I wish to say thank you

Once again for all the members and your dedication to and support thank you thank you very much uh Jesse hatch followed by uh Trina James and uh Wu Su gerer uh Jesse or Jess I think it’s Jesse good morning hi my name is Jess I’m a a

Resident of district 7 I’m here to voice my strong opposition for the hrp budget and budget increase it is truly wild to me that we’re having a conversation about budget increases to the police in 2024 let’s consider that we’re having a consultation about raising an already overemployed budget despite years of

Defunding work that’s been done in the city after thousands of people took to the streets in Halifax during the summer of 20120 to protest the ongoing brutalization of black and brown people at the hands of police and to and defunding and after the violent encampment evictions in 2021 for which

We still have seen no accountability or transparency yet the hrp continue to be granted budget increases year after year so today I want to talk specifically about the realities of DET tasking you can Envision it this year the hrp are requesting a second console position for

The hate crime unit in Nova Scotia the majority of hate crimes are motivated by race or eacy and most Target black people hate crimes remain significantly underrepresented largely or sorry under reported largely due to fear of violence or reprisal from police which is not surprising what reason do people from

Racialized communities and other marginalized groups have to trust that the police will believe their experience after Decades of police brutality and racial profiling why would we expect people to report hate M crimes to a government body that enacts the same kind of violence and why do we continue

To fund it the hrp are saying that this requested hcu officer in addition to the diversity and Equity officer will be working to connect with community members but in the context of historic and going over policing of marginalized communities I struggle to understand what this kind of relationship Building

Looks like especially when we have no information on the cultural backgrounds or competencies of the hdu officers so here’s an alternative similarly to detas Police from victim Services you can detas police from hate crime reporting by implementing third party reporting systems they’re already successfully in place in other cities

And jurisdictions and they allow people to report hate crimes of places of safety like community centers in their places of worship at libraries or using hotlines next I want to talk about DET tasking police for mental health calls so in 2022 TR began piloting a community leg solution to respond to Mental Health

Crisis calls and wellness checks Mel Crisis Support teams consisting of Crisis workers with Crisis Intervention and deescalation training are dispatched to crisis calls instead of police in the first six months of the pilot they respond to 3,000 calls and they involve police 2.5% of the time which tells me

That police are unnecessarily responding to roughly 97% of the mental health calls that they attend that is dangerous it’s a huge waste of public funds that could be better directed and it doesn’t warrant the creation of 12 new positions in Hala people who use drugs are consistently over placed and over

Incarcerated especially black people indigenous people women and trans people and sex workers in March of 2021 Vancouver applied to health Canada for an exemption to the cdsa which allowed them to decriminalize possession within C limits it follows a health-based approach to the overdose crisis and recognizes that criminalizing drugs

Results in death by funding policy that reduces Health inequities for people they are able to eliminate charges for possession and save lives by redirecting people to harm reduction Services instead that’s another example of detaching we are not asking you to be revolutionaries or to reinvent the wheel

We’re asking you to work in the best interest of the people who elected you to bring about the kind of changes that have already been implemented by far more courageous public officials in other cities and for which there’s a amount of evidence to support so from the defunding report I want to quote

Diverting a substantial portion of the police budget to other community services with he people in need of additional supports Justice and Equity is a commitment to actions which prevent crimes from ever happening and addresses the need of people who are most vulnerable it’s a move away from ative

Vision of Justice to a vision of justice that is centered on ethic of care and I also want to quickly mention that having a representative from the union for police feels deeply inappropriate to me in a pretty obvious conflict of interest his bills literally get paid by this

Increase um and I also want to mention that when the social service organization that I work for had our funding cut by 20% this year despite having being our best year yet in numbers I definitely was not allowed to come to talk to council about that so

Maybe we could consider Ving people uh who are joining thank you thank you very much next speaker is Trina James is that a virtual uh okay we’ll see if we can get uh sorry Council l yes thank you I just have a question for the previous speaker Mr Mayor all

Right could we ask um Jesse to come back thank you Jesse get that thank you so much for coming back I just have a quick question for you because the last thing that you just said was quite concerning yeah um that your budget had been cut but I just need

A clarification that Halifax Regional municipality does not fund your organization my organization is provincially funded um it provides Employment Services I don’t think that’s the main takeaway of what I said though which is also no I just need a clarification I’m sorry because I was just trying to understand

Um how HRM was funding your organization if we were I was not aware that we were so I just wanted to clarify that okay do you any other questions for clarification yeah no no no I I appreciate your time today and I really sincerely appreciate you being here to speak thank you

That was the question answer thank you thank you for coming back uh do we have uh Trina James online I’m here Hi how are you good morning thank you for joining us uh we’re here at budget committee and the floor is yours for five minutes great

Hello everyone my name is Trina I live in district 7 I also work with atam for women children an organization in the city that supports women gender diverse people and families who are unhoused and navigating insecure housing I’m against increasing the police budget last fall I was privileged enough to attend the

Canadian Alliance to an homelessness conference that took place in the city from my knowledge a handful of city workers were also in attendance in hopes for them to learn how to better support this community during the conference many of the attendees discussed the harms experienced by community members

During police interactions two of the presenters one from Montreal another one from Toronto shared their findings after interviewing officers working for the Toronto Police Service all the officers interviewed mentioned they are not equipped to respond to calls to support people in crisis and feel that other community organizations are better

Equipped to address their immediate as well as their long-term needs in addition to that I also attended one of the virtual budget consultation meetings that took place in the fall where the Halala Regional Police themselves expressed concerns about being underere equipped to support mental health calls

And mentioned that most of an office ‘s time was spent in hospital with community members an act that is extremely overwhelming for a person in crisis a budget increase of over $5 million to fund more officers in the city is not going to support us it is

Only going to overp police the problem and under support the root of this issue our city needs to invest in solutions that will address food insecurity we have a need for more free and affordable programming for Youth and adults we need need better supports and services for unhoused people in our community and

Real mental health supports that do not involve the police the need to invest in these resources to address the various social issues in our city is so apparent in every single Corner especially given today where people staying in encampments were just given an eviction notice to leave as of February

26 the officers in the city have already stated that they are not equipped and and cannot properly support community members experiencing Mental Health crisis and the community has consistently and historically stated that we do not want police supporting us during Mental Health crisis at the end

Of 2023 on December 31st at 2:20 p.m. a 19-year-old black man by the name by the name of Offa Lobby Stefan aaso was murdered by Winnipeg Police when his friends called 911 pleading for him to receive mental health supports this did not happen instead of receiving mental health supports this 19-year-old student

Studying at the University of Manitoba was insidiously gifted an early grave I and many other community members who are present both in person and virtually will continue to denounce a police budget increase because police have not and will never be able to protect and serve our community thank

You thank you for joining us appreciate the that very much our next speaker is uh U Su gerer followed by tinan bramberger virtually and then Isaac Wright good morning morning um hi my name is aurer I’m a resident of District 5 and uh I work in district 7 uh

Addressing gaps in food insecurity among students uh I am also here today taking a day of work uh serving students free food because I am concerned by the proposed budget increase uh and what it means to our community I am I I’m here to oppose the additional increases to

The police budget and advocate for redirecting funds to other City projects that address Community safety more efficiently in a time of unprecedented housing and food crisis in the city we need proactive measures to ensure that the community is safe and have resource to combat housing crisis Mental Health crisis and emergency situations created

By the climate climate change uh that we’re facing which the hrp spoke to in their uh proposal for a budget increase allocating more funds to a department that does not Center solving that does not Center Community Care um is not a good use of public funds I recognize

That the population increase um will mean that incre increase Mental Health crisis increase housing crisis and issues that arise with that and even uh increase hate crimes which is also cited in their uh report demanding a budget increase um however as a city council you have the

Responsibility to look at the best ways to tackle these issues through your funding decisions hiring na officers for a body that does that has been created to prevent crime and disorder whose focus is not to systemically address committee issues but to prevent crime uh would just mean more criminalization of

Committee members in crisis rather than solving these issues I would also like to Echo previous speakers that it would be fiscally responsible to address issues um raised by community members through more funds to the hrp I don’t believe that the funds requested by hrp will be used efficient

Efficiently once granted uh the board of police Commissioners as you know has no day-to-day oversight on how this money will be spent and I believe that they did not um create the necessary policies to detest the police as laid out by the defending the police report created by

The subcommittee of the board of police Commissioners by agreeing to increase budget the city sends a clear message that it prioritize policing of its Community or its care once again it’s fiscally responsible to give giv funds to this body uh governed by Board of police Commissioners which has which again does

Not say have a say in how efficiently the money is spent and again fail to create policies uh to test the po police this increase as for the hrp does not exist in a vacuum there are so many other projects funded by the C that will need increased budgets as both

Population grows and housing crisis and food crisis in the city uh will become more complex just because we have not cre the city has not put the energy in creating alternatives to the hrp in response to emergency crisis um does not mean that we should um just give more funds to the

Hrp one every time uh the demand for it increases um that’s all for me I think my peers spoke way better on the evidence-based approaches to why we should not give hrp uh more funding I believe that you should seek out more alternative measures and stop giving the police

Money thank you thank you very much tinan bramberger is joining us I believe virtually we’ll see if we can connect with tinan hello can you hear me yeah hi good morning thank you for joining us the floor is yours thank you good morning uh I live

In District 10 here in Halifax and I work as a registered psychotherapist in Canada including uh here in Halifax it is from my experience as a mental health professional that I’m urging the city of Halifax not to increase the police budget but rather to reallocate funding from police to our housing and health

Sectors to address the root causes of what the city deems criminal activity uh very much in line with the uh majority I would note of speakers that have spoken today so I I kind want to take a a slightly uh different angle I I want to invite you to imagine living under the

Strain of not knowing where you’re going to live next month or next week I want you to imagine not having enough food in your belly to think or move your body imagine living in a world that is unrelentingly hostile to you because of the color of your skin or because of who

You love or because of the work that you do and that this makes it impossible to trust the intention of others now I want you to imagine having a mental health breakdown because of one or all of these things are happening at the same time and someone gets scared by your

Justified feelings of fear and panic living under these conditions imagine this person calls someone with a bulletproof vest and a gun to come yell at you to calm down and until you relinquish or Worse until you are pushed to panic further and defend yourself resulting in getting shot or strangled

On the ground because you psychologically physiologically and spiritually cannot comply in 2020 I had the honor of working on a campaign with other mental health professionals to urge our colleges to discourage and mandate that 911 not um or 911 not be called in mental health checks due to the violence

And death of our patients at the hands of police you can learn more about this campaign at end police involvement in mentalhealth.com amounts of violence at the hands of police there is clear indisputable evidence that involving police can and does lead to harm and or death of black indigenous and ra

Racialized people during mental health checks specifically I’m not just talking about General involvement with police but specifically during mental health checks vulnerable groups such as two spirit lesbian gay bisexual trans and queer people sick and disabled people neurodiverse people people engaged in sex work migrant workers refugees undocumented people homeless or Street

Involved people people who use drugs or anyone who may have previous harmful interactions with police a history of trauma in psychiatric care the child welfare system or a history in the carceral system are all also subject to disproportionate police violence one of the most horrifying cases of death by

The hands of police that I read during this campaign was a black man who was deaf and didn’t respond to a police officer calling to him because he was deaf and that man died he wasn’t harmed he wasn’t inconvenienced he was killed I go on policing in Canada and

Halifax alive alike is a Public Health crisis and policing should be replaced with an alternative community-based mental health and mobile crisis response service whose Personnel are properly Tred trained trauma informed and competent in deescalation and intervention during a mental health crisis to ensure risk of further harm to

Ensure risk of further harm is minimized lastly at the African novas scotian Justice Symposium held in the fall of 2023 the data from rigorous research was overwhelming and very much reviewed by many of the people here today budgetary increases to police including diversity hiring and sensitivity training do not address the

BL and rampant racism reflected in our caral systems in the short or long term I want to add in respond to Pat Bard’s comments about the budget uh supporting officers that respond to domestic violence I work not only as a psychotherapist but specifically as a sex and relationship therapist never in

My Prof professional experience have I ever heard from any of my clients or colleagues that police were a supportive safe or effective response to domestic violence what I have heard from my colleagues and clients were how police exasperated conflict escalated violence either before during or after the incident of domestic violence and

Offered little to no additional resources that would promote the health and safety of those experiencing domestic violence additionally fear of police and uncertainty about where else to turn decision Mak if you are concerned about domestic violent invest in deescalation mental health workers and programs that practically support people

Who need to leave homes of violence get on their feet thank you thank you very much I appreciate you taking the time to be with us the next three speakers are Isaac Wright Willa Oaks and Nancy Hunter Isaac are you you’re here yeah good morning welcome thank you hello my name is Isaac

Wright I’m a resident of District 4 today I would like to speak in strong opposition to the proposed budget increases for both the Halifax Regional police and the RCMP I would specifically like to speak to the proposed addition of 12 constables dedicated to hospitals and mental health calls in

HRM according to the hrp’s budget proposal these 12 officers would specifically provide assistance with detaining individuals under section 14 the involuntary psychiatric treatment act our current mental health system is failing us as a social worker and Community member I have seen this firsthand Halifax needs robust Community interventions not more police

Officers I have worked with many clients and community members who have been traumatized by police involvement in their mental health calls police regularly escalate the crisis after arriving at the scene and particularly for individuals who are racialized and or transgender these interventions can lead to severe injury or death the

Recent deaths of Regis kinsky pette Rodney Levi Danny DC Cooper Shantel more and others have all occurred simply because Canadian police were called to a mental health crisis often when my clients are in distress they will do anything to avoid calling crisis lines or mobile Mental Health crisis teams I have worked with

People who have died by suicide because they knew the police-based services available to them in crisis would not support them the research shows overwhelmingly that people are like that police are likely to be violent towards people with untreated mental illness already too many people have been killed by Canadian police officers responding

To Wellness checks and mental health calls this budget increase would result in more officers responding to mental health calls and more individuals being involuntarily detained and hospitalized it would spike fear in an already marginalized population and in no gentle words would eventually lead to the deaths of more noas scotians this is

In direct conflict with Recent research conducted by the HRM which encourages the city toask police from mental health calls and invest in civilian Le responses there are many civilians in this city who are better equipped than the hrp to respond to these calls we have access to a large population of

Frontline Community workers healthcare workers social workers and peer support workers who care deeply about our community for many years people in Halifax have been urging Halifax Regional Council to divert funds from police to initiatives like housing food security and civilian land mental health response I ask you when will you start listening

We need to direct These funds to a care-based solution and we need to do it now the Halifax Regional Police have made it clear that they do not want to be working with people in a mental health crisis to quote chief of police Don mlan the hrp would love to be out of

The mental health business 100% frankly from talks with my clients and my community we don’t want to be working with police either the data is clear civilian-based Solutions work this money must be used much more effectively to fund civilian-based mental health response teams which do not involve police the hrp’s budget proposal says

That this is only a stop Gap response until non-p police alternatives are established yet the costs of this program are expected to double for the 2526 budget year to $1.5 million today I ask you why the cost of a short-term stop Gap solution is expected to double the following year

I find it hard to justify these increases amidst the housing and healthare crisis currently happening in our city increases to the police budget will surely mean that other essential Services face Cuts already many of these services do not receive the funding they need to operate sustainably I desperately urge you to

Stop for a moment and think about the lives that could be changed with civilian Le crisis response versus the lives that will be lost or destroyed by police response this is the decision that you have to make today I beg you to show your empathy with your decision ision thank you very

Much thank you very much Isaac for your letter as well I want to assure people that uh you know there’s been some correspondence scent that has been circulated to all counselors and we’ve all uh looked at it and appreciate people taking the time uh Willer Willa Oaks Nancy Hunter any lap

Willa good morning thanks for being with us good morning uh good morning my name is Willa Oaks I live in District 9 um I’m here to speak in oppos opposition to the hrp budget increase and I feel like it’s important to note that this is the third time some of us

Have spoken this budget season and we have yet to have any evidence that any of our concerns have been heard in fact on October 25th and November 22nd so many members of the public spoke out against the proposed $5.7 million hrp budget increase in fact almost 80% of

Presentations from the public have been in opposition despite this there is no evidence that the board of police Commissioners took any of the Public’s concerns into consideration in fact Gavin Giles Vice chair of the board of police Commissioners felt so confident in his complete disregard for the public

Consultation process he said quote to be clear on the record I have not been attracted by any of the canned and banal presentations of the type we received last week and two weeks before that some of which have been really bizarre nonsense and rubbish commentary designed only to titilate and annoy rather than

To inform and teach and yet we’re still all here despite the fact that we are insulted by members of your party anyway a wild statement from someone whose role it is to provide civilian oversight and a statement that went completely unchallenged by the other six Commissioners some of which

Are in the room with us today um anyway before I start I’d like to note that the only people I’ve noticed speak in in favor of this budget have been literal landlords and cops so I feel like you’re either going to side with the landlords and the cops or literally everyone

Else um all right so before I start I’d like to make it very clear that I did not design this statement to T or annoy unlike almost every other service in this city the police are never asked to do make do with less while program providers are rationing food the food

They provide at their youth programs the police are asking for more money because the cost of ammunition has gone up if this J’s position doesn’t make you nauseous I implore you to examine why you’re so much more comfortable funding deadly weapons than food on that note city council announced this

Week that they can’t afford the $856,000 required to implement the HRM food strategy to address food insecurity and we’ll be reviewing it line by line to see where Cuts can be made I expect you’ll be combing the hrp budget with the same magnifying glass so I thought I’d help you get

Started by highlighting some areas that I in which the hrp are blatantly exploiting public funds one salaries it would be senseless to talk about police overs spending without talking about salaries over 74% of hrp employees make over $100,000 per year according to the 2022 Municipal compensation report while the average annual income

Is while the average annual income is $53,000 and one in five children live in poverty how can you justify pouring more money into the most expensive and most ineffective way to address societal issues two out of town travel they’ve budgeted $38,000 $380,000 up from $150,000 last year the people your

Tasked to Serve and Protect are here what what is this travel is it absolutely necessary could it be a zoom call and is it more important than food three clothing allowance a separate category from uniforms to be clear and it’s up 9% from 2023 at $66,000 from some light Googling which I

Assume you’ll get more into in your um overview um this appears to be an allowance for officers that are asked to perform duties in plain clothes they get a $600 tax free allowance to buy plain clothes I would love to know how the city can justify spending almost half a

Million dollars for officers to buy clothes um something that everyone else does without uh funding from their employer um for advertising and promotion they are looking to increase this spending by 229 this year up to $20,000 five rewarding Excellence they are looking to increase this vague category by 466 this

Year um all right I’m at my time but their list goes on so I uh look forward to seeing what your line by line review of this budget looks like thank you thank you very much uh Nancy Hunter Annie lap Ash hinchy Nancy Hunter thanks viy thank you

So my name is Nancy Hunter I live in District 11 I think I’m not going to go by my notes because I have a lot of the things here that other people have said so I’m just going to talk to you and uh see if

I can fill in a few other gaps so I’ve lived in Halifax all my life and as a white girl growing up in Suburban h box I believe certain things about the purpose of police the function of police what police did what they were for and then I got out to Suburban white

No uh Helifax and I made my way in the world and met many different people and worked in community and learned that not everyone’s experience with police is the same I learned that police harm many people in our community I learned that even the things we think police do like investigate crimes when

They are brought to them that they have good policies and procedures and good chains of command and good training and trainings are mandatory all of these things I’ve learned throughout many years aren’t so true and one of the things I’ve become a little bit expert on is accountability

By police or as I now call it inac accountability uh by systems designed for inac accountability and a culture that has bestowed on police unquestion ability and a kind of morality that the rest of us don’t have so one of the things that came out of the Marshall

Inquiry was the police Board of Comm Commissioners which is supposed to be a social which is supposed to be a civilian oversight into policing it was struck because there was diplomatically put a very unhealthy relationship between politicians and uh politicians and police and I think what everyone knows Nova Scotia is really considered

Still somewhat an old boy Network so we wouldn’t be here if the police Board of Commissioners were doing their job so I don’t know if any of you recognize me but in the November 22nd meeting I was one of the first speakers and I got up and I said things that are

Many of the things that were said today many of the things that are in the reports evidence that we all know but nothing is being done about it and I was censored by the police Board of Commissioners I was accused by commissioner Giles of casting aspersions even though again everything I said was

Evidence-based and this was upheld by chair Kent who censored me two more times I broke no rules I said nothing that hasn’t been said before I was given no justification for my censorship none I ask questions nothing now I think everyone here should be very concerned in this Democratic institution

Where public presentations are supposed to be meaningful that when they get comfortable or when we get critical that this kind of censorship can arise one of the things about why I think this is so your job you are trusting that the board of police Commissioners is doing their job so that

They’re going to bring you when their work is done this to present to you well they’ve presented to you what they presented to you is pretty much the police ask in its entirety so maybe we don’t need the police Board of Commissioners at all

Maybe we can just get rid of it and the police can come just directly to you they are not rigorously crit uh critically analyzing the police budget this cop to pop well maybe we should look at that are there questions around that is that a real

Thing um is there you know are there cuts are there detas retasking none of the things we are saying did they take into consider ation they just said yes rubber stamp and brought this to you quote uh Becky Kent uh uh the increases are needed because of growth in the

Municipality and police services are stretched thin really it’s about the rationale of what the police put forward none of which is in the reports none of which US the community the people out here who are doing the heavy lifting on safety on caring on all of these things

We’re not on the Sunshine List we are here doing the work and we are dismissed and disparaged and this is a very bad thing for our city Nancy before you go there’s a question here from councelor Blackburn yes thank you very much Mr Mayor uh more of a a clarification more

Than anything else um I was at the meeting where you were uh asked to refrain from mentioning a specific case you were allowed to present and you had your five minutes uh but just wanted to make it clear that the reason why we asked you to uh to refrain from

Mentioning a specific case is because we cannot discuss specific cases in a public forum like that so just wanted to clarify for folks who perhaps did not see that meeting that uh we were more than welcome to to hear your submission but what we could not hear was specifics

About a specific case thank you Mr Mayor am I allowed to respond to that no I don’t think so I think uh the five minutes is uh is uh is done that’s notate okay thank you uh we have uh any lap Ash hinchi K McDonald any lap na good morning

Welcome good morning uh Annie couldn’t be here because it’s uh 9:30 on a Wednesday or whatever um so I’m going to speak speak on their behalf and first of all I just like to say that Nancy was censored for saying that there was rampant racism in the hrp that is the

Comment that Giles had issue with so that just needs to be said can you just identify yourself for us and where you from um my name is Annie lap and I’m a resident of District 8 I’m speaking today because I want city council to spend to send the police budget back to

The board of police Commissioners for review so that our Municipal tax dollar can be reallocated to Social Services that keep haligonian safe and cared for and able to access their city in this City’s supposedly democratic system part of the budget review Pro process is public consultation from what I have seen the

Public consultation is merely a checked box for the board of police Commissioners and the review Pro proceeds purely on advice of the police it takes a lot of bravery and moving through many levels of inaccessibility to participate in this process as a member of the public in fact the fact

That counselors are permitted to make flagrantly dismissive comments about public contri contribution is one dimension of inaccessibility of public consultation I am speaking about count about commissioner Giles calling the well researched evidence and personal experiences shared at the consultation on November 22nd benal and titillating which was approved by by his fellow counselor

Silence these comments follow a running theme of disrespect for public EV for public evidence for public comments follow sorry for public evidence previously by the board’s Silence of approval of dehumanizing and disgraceful language used toward our unhoused neighbors at the consultation on October 25th 2023 excuse me any I I think you’ve

Already spoken I’m I’m speaking on any’s behalf because they’re not able to be here today thank you um how is someone supposed to feel safe sharing their voice in this quote unquote Democratic process when Commissioners themselves are openly disrespectful of it the board of police Commissioners approved the

Proposed police budget to move ahead without any changes despite citizens sharing valuable insight and care and after carefully outlining evidence and statistics of police harms and ineffectiveness including the research in the city’s own comprehensive and so far ignored police defunding the police report the fact that the proposed police

Budget is moving forward without any changes despite the information at City at council’s disposal is honestly astonishing when I walk to work after a storm like the one we just had I risk sprains and Falls trying to climb through the uncleared snow on the sidewalks in the event of any amount of

Snow falling which we can expect for at least a third of the year the hardw working people in the snow clearing Department can only do so much with the amount of funding they have when I am navigating uncleared snow piles piled walked sidewalks I can’t help but think

Of how many people are simply forced to stay home because of how inaccessible the city has become why is it accessible for the city to deny the option for many people to leave their home potentially for weeks while sidewalks remain clogged meanwhile when I take the number three

Bus in the morning buses pass me me because they’re too full or admit me only to be sardined with other Riders because our transit system is consistently underfunded and buses do not run regularly enough and as our City’s houseless population grows the city can only Cobble together peace meal

And halfhazard solutions to keeping these citizens safe in cold or stormy periods let alone at other times rather than acting with the urgency that is needed right now to ensure all haligonian are able to thrive not simply survive I find it bold that the board of police Commissioners and the city

Council would consider going ahead with approving the proposed police budget when essential services are struggling to serve haligonian basic accessibility for all citizens basic needs and basic navigation of our city are being neglected in favor of funding a department that we have made ourselves horse telling you does not

Keep anyone but white wealth holding citizens safe please review the budget so that our tax dollars are allocated to keeping every everyone in the city safe cared for rather than to take an agency that serves to intimidate and enact violence on our most marginalized neighbors thank you for your consideration thank

You Ash hinchi uh K McDonald and then Carmel fash Ash welcome hi um I’m Ashley hiny and I’m from District 8 and um I’m here to read out the open letter that has been referenced a few times um within today’s speakings um and one that has not been

Adequately responded to yet up to this state uh the letter itself received 800 signatures from community members uh including 82 businesses organizations such as adsom Elizabeth fry North and Community Health Center uh Cale and many others um so to start the letter off we are a group of HRM resident presidents

And organizations who are asking the council uh reject the Halifax Board of police Commissioners recommendations to increase the 22425 Halifax Regional budget by 6.3% once again an overwhelming majority of speakers at the bpc’s public consultation advocated against increases to the police budget for detas police from responding to mental health calls

And for the bopc to be more rigorous in their over oversight of Helifax Regional Police in opposition to this public input the bopc has recommended the full budget increase acting against the defunding the police report and the final report of the mass casualty commission and the hrm’s own Public

Safety strategy one of the pillars of the defunding the police report prepared by a subcommittee of the bopc in 2022 was to improve public consultation processes um the bopc is in obvious violation of section six of their public manual which states that the meetings must be accessible to the public this

Inaccessibility renders this process and the bpc’s budget recommendation illegitimate at this year’s consultations there have been many barriers to engagement um one of them is despite requests there was no ASL interpretation or live captioning thus making meetings inaccessible to members of the deaf and the Heart of hearing

Community for those who have been directly traumatized by police and for communities who are most vulnerable to policing there were no accommodations made for the participation this includes black indigenous and people of color people with mental illness sex workers unhoused people people who use drugs people who experience gender um based

Violence and two lgbtq plus plus people this failure to accommodate is indirect contradiction to the recommendations of the public safety strategy um another point is at the virtual consultation on October 25th stigmatizing language was used to refer to unhoused people the chair Becky Kent and Commissioners allowed these dehumanizing comments to

Continue at the in-person consultation on November 22nd an early speaker was censored for being critical of the police I think we just heard about that their time was shortened due to the interruptions from the chair and they were not allowed to speak of specific experiences with police the previous

Speaker who was in favor of the increase was was allowed to speak of specific positive experiences with police and was allowed to go over the a lotted time this double standard and undermines the legitimacy of public consultation process um and the final Point um in the letter is at the board meeting on

November 29th 29th sorry commissioner Gavin Giles made disre Ard disparaging remarks in reference to public consultation participants uh specifically he said I have not been attracted by any of the canned and banel presentations of the type we received last week and two weeks before that some of which have been really bizarre

Nonsense and rubbish commentary designed only to titillate and annoy the bopc accepted these comments this demonstrates clear disregard for the public consultation process and the community members I’d also like to add that he’s now not only accepted these comments he’s now the vice chair um given what we have seen in the budget

Process this year we are concerned with the legitimacy of the bpc’s recommendation we call on the council to enforce the bpc’s principle of public voice inclusion as it stated in the introduction to the bpc’s policy manual this should include cons uh this should consist of a what we heard report

Explaining how public feedback was included in the bpc’s decision our city is in crisis with a dire lack of housing Food and Health Services to incre to increase the police budget at this time is Con my time is oh sorry I thought I heard somebody

Um we could do much better we are urging you to reject the bpc’s recommendation to increase the Halifax Regional Police budget for 2024 2025 um and this was signed Again by 800 community members including 82 businesses and organizations within the community and I would again like to

Speak that it is very concerning to me that the people here today speaking against are landlords and union members thank you thank you very much uh just again to assure people we have that letter every counselor has it has read it I’m I know that uh they have um so

Thank you for that k k McDonald Carmel far bash Amber Tucker good morning uh Happy black history and African Heritage Month my name is k McDonald but most of you know that already I was born and raised in the city more importantly and accurately I’m from jukk mcmi the unseated

Unsurrendered territory of the mmon nation I have fallen in love here GR grown up here and the work I do every day here in this city is to try and create a beautiful city for us all to have our wildest dreams and basic needs met I’ve been presenting at these budget

Meetings for what feels like years and years and years continuously bringing the voice of many communities into this room big shout out to those who are here to speak today speaking truth to power is a practice that is nerve-wracking and vulnerable and I applaud all of us for

Showing up it is once again Black History Month and it feels counterintuitive to the purpose of this month that I’m spending my time advocating for dire Community Services amid several intersecting crisises in the city which we all know well enough by now impact those of us relegated to

The margins I’m in firm opposition to the proposed hrp RCMP budget increases for 2024 2025 let me tell you why I’ll start with my personal and communal experience dating back to August 18th 2021 and before deeming this as a relevant please hear me out on August 18th 2021 I sustain

Injuries from HRM sanctioned police violence injuries I will live with for the rest of my life including a concussion spinal and hip injuries that I’m still dealing with chronically to this day the amount of money I’ve spent on osteopaths massage therapists chiropractors physiotherapists has exceeded my lotted benefit packages and

I end up paying out of pocket to treat injuries that were City sanctioned with a fuller budget there’s only more potential for further irrevocable bodily harm to occur in our city and to my communities these injuries are important to name seeing as I was present for less

Than two and a half minutes on August 18th where were the deescalation tactics where was the demonstration of community centered care informed policing how did I become so violently injured in such a short period of time what policing strategy was employed here I was arrested in charge with charges that

Were ultimately dropped due to lack of evidence I was arrested and brutalized for what I was traumatized and violated by hrp for caring for my unhoused neighbors family members peers and friends is this what we can expect the future of policing to look like on August 18th there were multiple members

Of vulnerable communities who are historically and currently disproportionately targeted by police such as racialized people queer and trans folks and people with mental illness these community members experienced extreme violence and have sustained multiple injuries since the 18th police have yet to respond with full transparency and accountability about

Their actions among the people impacted many were youth which is disturbing to me as a children a child and youth worker this is not the outcome of over the overused rhetoric a few bad apples this is exactly what policing is designed to do and values in the press conference following these events Dan

Canella offered no form of apology or accountability in response to the fact that a 10-year-old was pepper sprayed and said that police have to look at the situation in its totality he stated there are situations where the irtin can atomize and get into the air depending

On the airflow and wind it can travel a little bit generally in a less concentrated form to me this clearly illustrates a lack of hrp control over a dangerous weapon and controlled substance in December 2022 CTV published an article titled experts warn of The Perfect Storm as the number of police

Shootings increase in 2022 in this article Dr Orie Ola a professor of criminology and Associate Dean at the University of Alberta said it’s concerning to see the number of fatal encounters with police grow several variables contribute to the increase he said including inadequate training and an overall Reliance on force and lack of

Accountability in September 2023 we saw the tragic murder of queer and trans Community member Danny Cooper a 27-year-old poet and activist in BC during a wellness check very sadly they advocated for police to be removed from Mental Health crisis responses during their life it is clear that this

Growing epidemic of police violence does not Inspire confidence in the system of policing and especially not in the realities of police sportting mental health so far in 2024 we’ve seen four people murdered by the police in Canada we often look at other provinces and act like these practices are people aren’t

Our business policing is the same practice Beyond borders and has had the same desired outcome since its Inception every officer takes the same oath and abides by the same code of conduct to which they are accountable and as the iconic wenderland Brooks has said we are each other’s Harvest we are each other’s

Business and we are each other’s magnitude and bond at what point have we seen hrp demonstrate the necessary skills to deal with folks who are in a mental health crisis at what point will nationally acclaimed research be sufficient at what point will community and personal testimony be rendered

Enough and when will we be heard money is an investment and I’ve said it before where the government puts it money shows us what you care about what do you care about who do you care about and what are you dream your dreams for the future of

This city I know what mine are and I work towards them every single day I scream and I shout for my dreams and I show up to budget meetings for my dreams and never once have my dreams included incarceration punitive measures police station police state San violence and or

Murder stats show us this isn’t the way forward hrp has had a historical and present lack of accountability to community at large surrounding their own policing practices there’s not been any demonstrated trust or care Illustrated through policing practices at large in the city I’m at time and I could go on

Forever thanks thank you very much carmell followed by Amber Tucker and then Ray Paul good morning good morning thank you for getting my last name right um that that’s awesome um I really appreciate being able to speak here today for my personal experience but also through the lens of community

Engagement work and nonprofit work I sorry I strongly believe that it is dangerous irresponsible and negligent to increase the police budget oh sorry I actually lost my note do you mind if I just find it again can I pause my time just for a second sorry sure thing thank you I appreciate

That okay I found it thank you so much on January 31st a new report was released from the Canadian Center for policy Alternatives that states Nova Scotia child poverty rates Rose above 20.5% in 2021 which represents approximately 35,000 children in youth this jump in Nova scotia’s child poverty rate represents the biggest single-ear

Increase since 1989 while this data is collected for the entire Province it is critical to look at the ways this impacts the municipality in the youth-based nonprofit I direct we have seen a huge increase in housing and food insecurity so much so that we have taken our limited funding options to stretch

Programs into creating more food oriented programs as well as piloting a housing support worker we have catalyzed this work because we see our municipality in an acute crisis we’ve also done this work without an increase to our core funding model since 2018 what most Social Services have to do uh

In this current context as my passion is in youth work I’m going to now focus on the overcriminalization of marginalized Youth and the overcriminalization of poverty that we see demonstrated through local and National Data in 2022 a sttle titled A study titled black youth in the criminal justice system we see first

Voice storytelling show us across sites participants have identified schools as key sites where black youth have their first contact with the criminal justice system and the police this connection is well documented and often referred to the school to prison pipeline the other most commonly mentioned pathway stems from anti-black racism and neighborhood

Policing in this study a parent and Halifax shared kids 13 and 14 years old were coming home from the park they walked on the lawn of a building they were playing building occupants got nervous and they thought they were trying to break in police came with guns

Uh and said they were arresting them for home invasion a father who also is a service provider in Halifax said the moments our kids are born we have to think about how to answer to the police how to keep their hands in plain sight and you police wonder why we get so

Upset when you handle the kids the wrong way he’s already a criminal before he is born these experience are validated by a 2023 study I feel I was targeted a quote from the study reads most people we spoke to had their first encounters with police officers at a young age some

Early as 12 or 13 the youth consistently felt that they were perceived as Criminal crial in the 2022 stat can study titled perceptions and experiences with police among black and Indigenous populations author Adam cter States experiences of discrimination have been subject of discussion nationally for decades over time the rise of movement

Seeking racial and social equity in response to current injustices have demonstrated the importance of measuring and monitoring outcomes of policing a 2021 study titled To Serve and Protect whom discusses how despite the creation of numerous anti-racism committees to address police concerns and public concerns to policing ongoing evidence

Suggests that black and indigenous youth continue to be at risk of harm in the presence of police especially while in mental distress in the 2022 study the impact of police violence in Toronto authors discuss police violence as a Canadian public health issue every participant reported long histories of

Police contact beginning an ear early adolescence all participants reported witnessing police violence all participants and 89% report reported direct experiences of police violence themselves police describe participants described police encounters starting in early teenage years while also expressing immense fear reporting this violence according to the youth criminal justice Act and the United Nations

Conventions on the right of the child Children and Youth should never experience this level of sanctioned violence in all of these studies we see systemic fail failure we see our youth populations being Criminal ized based on their identities where they live as well as a lack of social supports for getting

Their needs met and we still do not see an active investment in Social Services and community- based supports in 2021 we see another call for detas and reform from a House of Commons report titled systemic racism in policing in Canada here like many reports and research before they give a list of

Recommendations in this hocc report The Honorable Justice Michael bash discusses policing culture in Canada as toxic some recommendations are higher civilian review investigations oversight feedback at large recognizing that decisions surrounding policing must be Community Driven and a structural and cultural modernization of policing and the use of indigenous knowledge systems and

Frameworks in this change I urge Council to reflect on these recommendations as well as the recommendations made in our own extensive 20202 defending report recommendations from the TRC recommendations from the Toronto based report rethinking commun safety reading experiences from the wartle port and I

Could go on and on there is so much data research and for first voice storytelling that supports the voices of so many here through these context recent histories and ongoing realities I encourage meaningful tangible and just responses to the proposal for the hrp increase thank you so much for your time

Thank you very much for your time uh Ambert Tucker Ray Paul Caitlyn O’Neal Amber Tucker good morning good morning uh my name is Amber I live in district 7 today I want to speak against the proposed hrp budget increase not only do I believe that this increase of almost $6 million would be

Better spent funding the social services and programs that support everyone to be safe and well I also see a lack of evidence that dedicating even more resources to policing accomplishes the stated purpose of making our communities safer in the report defunding the police defining the way forward for HRM

Released in January 2022 the authors write that Police use of force killed 555 people in so-called Canada between 20 2000 and June 2020 citing the CBC deadly force database since June 2020 according to the tracking Injustice project that number of deaths has already climbed from 555 to

757 which means since June 2020 more than 200 people in this country have been killed by police using force in short police are killing more people at a faster rate statistically these numbers do not even include many cases including in custody deaths deaths resulting from suicide when police were

Present or accidental police caused deaths such as a traffic accident and who is losing their lives to police disproportionately it is indigenous and black people indigenous people account for 4 . 2% of the national population but they make up 16% of the deaths at the hands of police and black people

Account for 2.9% of the population but 8.6% of those killed by police I don’t think that the horrifying uh Injustice of this reality can be communicated in statistics um but here’s one more 68% of the people killed in police encounters were experiencing mental illness addiction or both because police didn’t

Value their lives enough to not kill them which I think is a low low bar these people who needed care and support have become statistics from my own experience when people I love have been taken into custody while they were struggling with substance use and mental health issues these were some of the

Most acutely terrifying times of my life because I know that many others in that situation have died in custody recommendations from the defunding PO report include that the police board should conduct research and consultation with stakeholders to examine opportunities for disarming certain groups of officers and for

Minimizing the use of firearms by police it was also recommended that the police board must provide meaningful oversight and transparency regarding the hrp and rcmp’s use of special weapons teams long guns riot gear and other militarized equipment it is unclear if there has been any movement toward these

Recommendations so if this cannot even be done I honestly have no faith in the ability of the policing system to provide help for mental illness Street patrols or hospitals in a responsible and nonviolent manner related to the past few Decades of dismantling of the social safety net

In favor of things such as more policing unhoused people as well as physically or intellectually disabled people are also at a higher risk of becoming unhoused which makes them far more vulnerable to police violence simply for trying to exist we all saw on August 18th 2021 as K was just speaking about how

Unhoused people in Halifax were brutally attacked by police as were their allies for trying to preserve the tiny shelters and these folks who were also harmed by hrp’s violent actions that day are disproportionately members of the lgbtq2sia plus community so when we say we need more police to make communities more safe we

Should be asking whose communities and how is hrp doing the deep and repair comperative work that is desperately needed to ensure this violence does not continue yes landlords and business owners want more policing which they see as ensuring safety and of course these are the people that see themselves as

Being served by this budget increase I see this as the logic of class war if the city keeps throwing more police at problems based in poverty and inequality then it’s going to have to keep on throwing more and more police at the problem because policing doesn’t heal

These problems the use of force and intimidation doesn’t heal these problems the people who are being over policed are by and large not the threat to Public Safety rather judging some humans to be Expendable and acceptable victims of police violence is a threat to us

All uh I just want to end by saying why should hrp be handed even more money when they show so little accountability for their actions and when there could be so many other programs that many people have described before me with great expertise and compassion uh approving this budget increase would

Be unjust and undemocratic and the Halifax 2024 budget must do better than this I ask you to invest in people not in policing thank you very much uh Ray Paul Caitlyn O’Neal and then Lori Curtis good morning welcome good morning um I’m here representing the youth project I’m a resident of District

3 uh my name is Ry I am a 2s lgbtqia a plus housing coordinator for the Youth project the youth project is a nonprofit organization serving 2s lgbtqia plus youth in the province of Nova Scotia within mcmi our mandate is to make the lives of queer and trans young people

Safer happier and healthier through youth programming classroom Outreach and education and support services including peer-to-peer counseling housing support and access to name and gender marker change processes with the interest of incredible young people as our top priority we are in adamant disagreement and disapproval of the proposed budget increase of the Halifax Police

Department hrp to be clear we are advising that Council reject the Halifax Board of police Commissioners recommendation to increase the 20242 Halifax Regional Police budget by 5,787 uh 6.3% this is an increase that is five times that of the youth project budget we are echoing calls to defund the

Police and invest in Social Services that enable Nova scotians to access a basic quality of life namely access to food and housing and we encourage you to imagine what would be possible if these funds were instead invested in such services in case you were not aware although people have talked about this

Today we would like to remind you that in 22 feed Nova Scotia reported that 22% of Nova scotians live in food insecure households and are unable to meet their basic food and nutrition needs this percentage increases for racialized families with black novas scotian families at 39.2% and Indigenous novascotian families at

33.4% these statistics hold that one in three black and Indigenous families in Nova Scotia are food insecure and we ask how will more cops feed Nova scotians there is a substitute teacher crisis in Scotia but there are cops in schools there’s been no publicly available report on the effectiveness of school

Safety resource officers SRO in Nova Scotia but similar reports in other provinces have found the program ineffective at increasing school safety and found the presence of police on school grounds to Target students of color leading to increased surveillance and criminalization after school hours and into their adult Lives why Des our

Public Funding public money fund the alienation of young people and what is meant to be a learning environment while School staff who specialize in supporting vulnerable students are being pulled away from this critical work to fill in where a substitute teacher cannot be found we ask how do cops

Ensure all of our students are being taught at standards that reflect the inclusive education policy and the standards of teaching and what kind of training to school-based police officers undergo to implement such policies and standards in our schools our schools need more teachers and supports uh support workers not

Cops we have a highly skilled team of 2s lgbtqia class community members who are employed at the youth project we as a collective prioritize care centering youth voice and Survivor expertise as foundations to or organizational decision-making in conversations with Incredible youth that we work with they have asked that involving the police be

Taken out of our safer space policy asking that police presence in an emergency response only be used if all other options were exhausted eliminating the police with the safest option for 2s lgbtqia plus youth many of whom are also members of the bipot community when asked about why this was important in

Consultations with our executive director youth gave and continued to give such insightful and Brilliant responses such as I get scared when I see a police officer in uniform I have had terrible experiences with the police before I do I know that they are not safe for me and I don’t want my mental

Health experience to lead to punishment many older youth participants continue to speak out about the harms of policing and the over representation of harm in relation to queer bipo and disabled youth we have borne witness to stories of violence harassment discrimin perpetuated by police against youth community members and firmly believe an

Increase in criminalization surveillance and policing will not bolster Community resilience in fact many youth who access our services and staff were harmed at the hands of hrpd on August 18th and still have recurrent trauma and injuries in a recent report the color of violence race gender and antiviolence services

Survivors of color reported that police were the least helpful form of support instead highlighting family and friends as the most supportive in a city that is a microcosm of a national housing crisis an opioid and toxic drug poisoning epidemic and a gender based violence epidemic we desperately need healing

Cops don’t provide Community Care people do please consider investing in Community Care not more cops thank you thank you very much next speaker is Caitlyn O’Neal and then virtually with Lori Curtis and then Brody Weaver hello can you hear me oh um yeah who who is that Caitlyn O’Neal oh you’re coming

Okay all right thank you for joining us appreciate it the floor is yours okay great thank you so my name is Caitlyn O’Neal I’m in Lindell Smith’s District I’m here today to speak as a healthc care worker and to Echo the sentiments that have already been been said regarding investing more in Community

Care uh as a healthcare worker I strongly believe in evidence-based practice and as a citizen I believe that city council has a responsibility to use our budget responsibly and use evidence-based practices and the fact of the matter is that increasing police budgets is not an evidence-based practice for making communities safer

What are evidence-based practices are reducing poverty reducing loneliness and improving the supports that people have in their lives these interventions also are shown to improve health care outcomes and as everyone here is aware we are in the middle of a health care crisis and every level of government in Nova Scotia should be

Doing what’s within their mandate to alleviate that crisis and poverty and loneliness are two of the biggest drivers of Health Care issues that are address able to be addressed by all levels of government so I believe that city council should be investing in measures that alleviate poverty and

Improve access to food and housing and social services and social supports and enjoyment that are you know extremely important for supporting community members health and well-being that’s all I have to say today thank you thank you very much for joining us our next speaker is Lori Curtis is that a zoom as well

Uh yes may Savage okay we’ll see if we can Lori uh good morning good morning the floor is yours thank you for joining us my name is Lori Curtis I’m um a resident of Dartmouth um in District in um Sam Austin’s District I don’t know which district is um so I’m the reason

I’m speaking today is to request that the healax Council does not approve the 2024 2025 hrp RCMP budget and business plan as proposed um I didn’t speak at the um hellofax Board of police Commissioners meetings for public engagement but I was able to watch um the recordings and read

Um some of the news articles about them and to be honest I was a bit shocked how the board of police Commissioners dismissed members of the public and that’s actually why um I registered to speak here because um I feel that we’re we’re on a path of

Of um dismissing the public when they’re trying to voice their opinions and I hope that we don’t continue down this path um as we go forward now um that it’s before healthx Council um I also just want to take the opportunity to thank those community members who have

Um continue to speak at the whether it’s the health a council meetings or the board of uh um commissioner meetings just because um this isn’t easy I don’t enjoy um speaking in public I don’t enjoy coming in this and taking time out of my workday and it’s stressful and so

I do want to thank all of you who have spoken before me um who’ve come with the information and the research and are Tire tirelessly advocating for a better community in forms like these um just as a resident of Dartmouth as a parent as a community member I just want to say I

Appreciate and value all of you and what you’ve been doing um I’m just speaking as a member of the public um I want to live in a city a municipality where the council works with community members on a vision of of what they want the city

To look like how they want to improve the well-being of residents with the priority given to the most vulnerable um in our communities and and working step by step to achieving that of course I I recognize the unique circumstances right now of increasing costs everywhere but I

Am very tired and frustrated of seeing that priority is constantly given to support those onerous C burins to organizations that are already well-funded um instead of those people and organizations for whom as um previous speakers have said smaller amounts of money will be much much better spent and have a much larger

Impact on um Community well-being um I I just want to see that the council uh today shows that they you know want that money to be spent on relieving the burdens on its residents to try and you know just that we’re all trying to maintain the sort of basic minimum

Standards and I don’t think that that that um a an increase in the police budget is going to achieve that um I don’t fault the hrp and RCMP for asking for more money I mean we’re all you know facing increased costs but um I I do fault the board of police Commissioners

For accepting it and also I’m I’m very disappointed when we have seen this momentum for defunding the police in you know across North America um we recognize that policing doesn’t actually make um safer communities and while we’re supposed to be working for decreasing the budget of police I I’m

Kind of surprised that we’re sitting here asking for an increase in the budget um especially when there was so much work um and wellth thought out Research into that went into that 2022 report for defunding the police and it doesn’t appear that any of those recommendations have been taken into

Account um explored or moved forward so I guess I’m a bit frustrated that not only are does it appear that that the city is um ignoring the goal of working towards investing in community by taking funds of police and putting them into much needed community service but now

Even to be asking for an increase um it just really to me demonstrates the actions of a city that doesn’t really acknowledge the problems associated with policing um that’s not investing in the most vulnerable and really that isn’t looking to see that in the future we’re going to be increasingly facing problems

Because we’re not really exploring and implementing the correct solutions for the challenges that um this city faces I think we have a really great Community here but um more needs to be done to support the people and organizations that are really working to support and build community and that’s not the police thank

You thank you very much the next three speakers are Brody Weaver Campbell mclintoch Sean mcgilvery and then I’ll go back and see if there are people who were on the list that uh didn’t get to speak and we give them an opportunity Brody Weaver welcome uh good morning uh Mayor Mike Savage and

City councilors 1 through6 my name is Bernie Weaver I am an educator youth worker and resident of District 8 I am here today to advise you all to reject the Halifax Board of police Commissioners recommendation to increase the 2024 2025 Halifax Regional Police budget by around $6 million which would affect a 6.3

Increase in the already massive operational budget of the hrp outgoing calls to defund the police and invest in much needed social services that allow us to access a basic quality of life such as food and housing I’m here to speak about my personal experiences with the police in Halifax to supplement other speeches

Against the proposed budget increase on August 18th 2021 I was physically assaulted by hrp officers this assault which is documented via police cameras resulted in enduring traumatic brain injury and post concussive syndrome my presence at the removal of shelters for unhost people much like the ones directly outside of this

Building resulted not only in my assault but in my arrest I was charged with obstruction of police this charge was later dropped due to a lack of evidence but after 18 months of punishment by process and thousands of public dollars wasted so alongside countless others I will never feel safe in the

Presence of police again as I’m sure you are all aware August 18th 2021 was a deplorable moment in the history of policing in Nova Scotia the amount of police violence the public experienced and witnessed is not to be forgotten anytime soon paramedics treated 21 people with injuries on the

Scene all of these from the hands of police councelor of District 3 Becky Kent described what happened that day as in her own words violent and disturbing with regards to the independent review currently investigating police actions on this day when asked what she hoped this independent review would achieve she

Said there’s clearly trust to be repaired if you meant these words I must question how giving the hrp more money will result in a different outcome this money would be much better spent on the root issue of that day access to housing reject the increase in attending the trials of

Others whose charges were not dropped I listened staff sergeant Mane Shediac attempted to justify the use of excessive force by stating that he was scared of his own firearm he was afraid of the crowd on scene that day that they would take his gun and he said this is why he acted so

Drastically I’ll let us all think about that for a couple of seconds at this trial I also listened as another testifying officer stated that the number of people arrested that day that were being booked at the hrp headquarters was the most she had ever seen in her life and that the facility

Was not prepared to process this many people she reasoned that this is why basic rights were not met including explaining the reason for arrest reading those in police custody their rights and providing those in police custody with a lawyer phone call physically assaulting and processing dozens of people whose

Charges would later be dropped as baseless is an incunable use of public funds and the proposed budget increase must be rejected I implore you all to take a stand against the alarming lack of accountability and militarization of the hrp through rejecting this increase and moving towards efforts to rechannel funds into

Community Services is thank you for your time thank you Campbell mlto and Sean mcgilvery welcome hi good morning uh my name is Campbell I live in District 8 and uh I biked in the snow from my house this morning to find at City Hall city workers zip tying um notices of eviction

To the tents that are 100 feet from us um I worked in supported Housing Organization for supported Housing Organization for three and a half years where I had frequent interactions with police and encampments and at shelters and I’m here today to advise Council to reject the proposed hrp budget increase

They far more effective preventive measures to invest in public well-being such as food security public transportation libraries warming centers and of course housing if City councilors are just willing to be a little bit imaginative I’m particularly concerned with the increase specifically intended for mental health resp response there

Are cities across the country such as Toronto and Vancouver that have implemented police officers specifically for mental health response only for evidence-based research to reveal that having police respond to mental health escalations disproportionately increases the risk risk of death or injury of the exact community members at police are

Supposed to be helping I’m concerned that the city is willing to use public funds to support the possibility of injury or death of my neighbors whenever they have a mental health crisis I’m worried that this risk of harm or death may continue to disproportionately affect black and Indigenous community

Members the people that the police identify as criminals are exactly those individuals who are being failed and killed by our society daily these so-called criminals have never been a threat to me and never will be because I know how to talk to people and listen to people without pulling out a gun these

Are real people who deserve the opportunity to thrive and not just become a statistic the city is more and more impossible to afford to survive in every day and using our tax money to pay for more police is not going to help put a roof over people’s heads there’s no

Amount of trauma informed training that police could receive that would make it safe for somebody with a badge and a gun to respond to a mental health crisis if the police are struggling to continue responding to mental health crisises it’s probably because they are not an adequate solution to this problem and

That mental health response should be redirected to harm reduction based service providers well I’m grateful for the opportunity to participate in this public consultation I worry that this meeting is merely a charade where council members can pretend that they’re listening to us while they have already made their decision to fulfill this

Unsubstantiated budget request rather than fund real Public Safety and Community Care I hope that Council has taken time to research this issue enough to know that there’s no logical basis for this proposed budget increase I hope that council is as diligent in deconstructing each line item of this budget proposal as they

Were for the proposed food security plan yesterday I hope that Council thinks of all the lives of the people who are struggling to survive and are facing State violence every day and not just the landlords and police Union reps if Council votes in favor of this increase the public can only assume that

They have not done their research or that they are content to ignore and supersede Public Safety and consultation in favor of more six figure salaries for police I’m open to being proved otherwise thank you thank you very much Sean mcgilvery welcome thank you chair and councel uh I’m not going to

Belabor the various other ways in which public funds could be spent uh I think that’s been covered in a lot of detail I am going to Echo some of the Grave concerns that have been raised by other speakers about the integrity and performance uh and mandate fulfillment

Of the board of police Commissioners as you may be aware Bop are sort of a creation of the Provincial Police act uh and so I’m going to read you a few bullet points from the ACT pertaining to the bpc’s Mandate ensure the community needs and values are reflected in policing

Priorities objectives goals programs and strategies ensure that police services are delivered in a manner consistent with Community Values needs and expectations act as a conduit between the community and police service providers so in light of the remarks made by Vice chair Giles in response to Citizens whove brought their concerns in good

Faith to the board of police Commissioners in the hopes that they will be heard uh in light of at least allegations of censorious actions on the part of of the chair and others on that board I I feel like I have to recommend that you refuse their hrp budget increase

Ask uh and again not not to belabor the things that other folks have said about but the uh whether the spend is appropriate whether it’s fiscally responsible whether it’s effective uh you know there like the I’ve watched a lot of these meetings now I’ve watched a

Lot of these bopc meetings and I I sit on a few boards myself I sit on um the Nova scal Health Coalition Board of Directors for example uh and and what I feel like I see happening is that the bopc functions as if it is the board of

Directors of hrp which is not really you know a fullsome description of its mandate there’s lots of functional overlap I would I would argue but uh there are responsibilities above and beyond uh merely you know greasing the wheels and keeping the lights on uh so to speak that I feel there’s a clear

Pattern on the part of the board of police Commissioners uh that there is a lack of will or lack of ability to fulfill um in fact the recommendation they’ve come to you with is so out of Step both with public opinion with the research and scholarship that’s been done on the

Topic and even from the other police Chiefs themselves like we’ve heard from you know from previous speakers who have quoted various Chiefs of police saying they don’t want to be in the business of of dealing with people in in Mental Health crisis there and it’s not an an

HR problem it’s not a it’s not a resources problem it’s the they’re not you know the police have become this blunt instrument that we use to solve problems that are better solved with other tools and so we need to be thinking about those other tools and I

Think a lot of the speakers who spoke today have I’m just checking my time here have have covered that in great detail uh in fact I actually just went to a meeting last night of um healax search and rescue uh and met some of those incredible uh motivated and

Organized folks uh who work tirelessly and you would and you’d be shocked at some of the some of the things uh that they take responsibility for and and and the the depth to which they take that responsibility and so for for me that brought home uh that there are other

Ways we can deal with people in Mental Health crisis uh and and people who want to do that work like the cops don’t want to do it they’ve said that uh so so that leaves me thinking you know if the if the cops don’t want to do this work and

The community doesn’t want them doing the work and the scholarship says they ought not to be doing the work who does want that and as we heard from the landlords associate I guess I have my answer now I guess I guess I know who is invested in that is the

People who are directly profiting from the needless suffering that we are witnessing on the front lawn of City Hall today and I’m sorry to say that closing those camps will not change that that’s the I’m going to yield the remainder of my time thank you very

Much thank you very thank you um I’m going to go back to people who uh were on the list but hadn’t spoken uh the first one was Eloise brunette or Eloise Brun perhaps is she is Eloise here good morning morning so my name is Eloise balad I’m a

Constituent of District 5 I’m a child care worker an educational program assistant and hopefully soon to become an elementary school teacher um I have never personally felt safe around the police I do not want to see an increase in policing in my community that is deeply not what I want and I

Know that many of us do not want that I long to be an active participant in a healthy and thriving Community um the police doesn’t create that healthier Community you know they actively harm them and harm us over and over and over again social and public care makes for

Healthier communities support for people to get their basic needs met uh I urge you to deeply question and analyze the narrative that more policing creates here for communities when clearly studies and numbers show us otherwise I urge you to refuse the increase in budget thank you for your time thank you must

See um Collins Ellison here now good morning district 7 uh sorry going to wait for uh whatever it is that have to be projected if you would wouldn’t mind restart the time I have something there I have a lot more for the board but I’ll hope to distribute that

Afterwards I’ll note that we have received some uh correspondents from you that we all have and have looked at yeah so for uh viewers at home uh sir do you mind sliding that up a little bit yeah okay so there the 2022 point in time count suggested that uh out of 586

People who were experiencing homelessness uh during that point in time count 85 persons were considered howed within the Burnside correctional facility and that’s uh about 15% so I’m just saying this is to suggest that there’s a uh a huge correlation between person’s experiencing homelessness and uh the criminalization and incarceration

Of those persons as well uh now if you wouldn’t mind next uh next form here this is the 2021 22 Corrections key indicator report uh it’s the suggested that uh about 15% of persons uh incarcerated were of African Nova scotian descent I want to keep I want

You to keep that number in mind uh that number again is like about 15 for persons of indigenous descent as well and the average daily cost of incarceration was $393 per day that equals out to over $140,000 per year uh and uh again the expenditure was about about 20% of the

Department of Justice’s budget uh and again the the next year uh the costs or the expenditures it increased by about 8 million uh now you don’t have these figures here I wish I could have had more slides to present but um next I’m going to be looking at the income

Assistance rates for Nova Scotia uh this is all available on novas c.ca website as well uh so for a person who’s considered unhoused uh in Nova Scotia their income assistance rate is $380 per month and that equals out to less than 5,000 per year again comparing the cost of

Incarceration that being over 100,000 easily year-over-year uh to spend less than 5,000 on a person who’s experiencing homelessness is uh an outrage I believe uh next I’m going to be looking at uh what I believe are some uh housing affordability uh numbers and the cmhc report from 2023 found that uh

Average rent in Helifax was about 1,700 uh again that’s substantially more than the income assistance rate for a person who’s unhoused I don’t think it’s a of debate to anyone that uh uh there’s a housing crisis in hellofax and I I I just using these figures as to suggest

Again that um trying to police our way out of a housing crisis will never work it hasn’t and it will never work uh next I’m going to be referring again to the same 2022 point in time count that found uh 22% of persons who were experiencing homelessness at at that time were of

Indigenous descent and uh 15% uh were of uh African novascotian descent so again the um the demographics for person experiencing incarceration are uh very similar I would suggest to the persons who are experiencing homelessness again 15% uh of which were persons of African novas scotian descent and the number is even higher for

Persons of indigenous descent and uh keeping this in mind I understand this is a municipal issue but the uh 53% of those persons who are experiencing homelessness were dependent on provincial benefits so um again like more needs to be invested into um addressing the the key causes of

Homelessness which of course is just housing Supply I I would I would suggest that the province should invest more into uh public housing uh as opposed to uh incarceration but it also is relevant to the police budget as well because again uh to my understanding police do not collect uh demographic info for

Persons who they interact with I know that uh uh one of the latest I believe uh Ryan Brian reports or something of that sort uh the police work supposed to collect race-based data although they should also collect their like demographic information on when they’re interacting with persons who are

Experiencing homelessness as I believe again it will uh likely indicate that a lot of those interactions or service calls are directed towards people either experiencing homelessness or at risk of experiencing homelessness um and uh just to uh give more of an updated figure on those uh rates of homelessness the

Affordable housing Association of Nova Scotia which is the main uh Community organization working with the uh reaching home that’s Canada’s national homelessness strategy they put out uh weekly by name lists statistics and uh again their statistics reflect again that uh persons of African descent are about 14 15% of people who are

Experiencing homelessness and uh persons of indigenous descent or about 22% and At Last I want to suggest that uh in terms of racial discrimination the hrp needs to have a division that is uh centered around equity and diversity and right now there’s no one within that division that’s of African Nova scotian

Or MCM desent uh I I know I’m at time but I just want to say this last thing anecdotally I called uh hrp and request to speak with an officer of African Nova scotian descent uh it was only through that means that I found that there’s a A

Meline Smith is the only equity and diversity officer working for the hrp uh and again I I felt that I was being discriminated against based on the color of my skin and I requested to speak again with an officer of African Nova scotian descent this was on February 3rd

And on February 4th I got a call from the hrp uh from an officer who identified himself as officer that’s spelled k k hn but obviously pronouncing it as in a a racial uh discrimination U and I I would suggest again that uh by whatever means uh when

Hrp are looking into uh systemic racism within the force they need to have supervisors as well that can uh look at some of these complaints on on a cultural sensitivity basis because um even of the 12 complaints reviewed uh within the previous years out of 120 uh

All of them were basically denied as being uh some form of racial discrimination by the supervisors and I would suspect that those supervisors are not culturally competent or from uh the persons who had uh or or identify with the cultures of the persons who submitted those complaints so uh yeah

Quite a bit I think the board should consider uh most definitely again um in terms of racial discrimination I think I’ve made it very clear that uh persons who are overp policed are well represented within the African Nova scotian and Indigenous communities and I I would suggest that rather than

Investing in police who have again systemically discriminate against these communities we should invest more into the types of services which uh would better serve again these these particular thank you very much thank you um thank you very much colins there’s one of the name of somebody who wished

To speak but wasn’t here when I mentioned the name and that was Madison gelder Madison’s not here so those are the people who’ve signed up to speak is there anybody else who hasn’t spoken who would like to speak uh at this budget come ahead just identify by yourself where

You’re from and the floor is yours I will thank you my name is Jason snow I the vice president of the Helifax Regional Police Association currently with me in the gallery is Sergeant Philip Howard he’s our Treasurer I am a resident of District 12 and I live in

Timberly thank you for the opportunity for having us to speak here um I hope all of you have had the chance to read the letter that Sergeant Darla Perry our president had sent to the council and the board of police commission on December 19th I’m going to

Be talking about some of the point points from that letter so we support Chief mlan and the management team’s budget and the priorities he has outlined for hrp for the upcoming 2425 budget but we feel it falls short of what is required to adequately ride the service and the safety to our citizens

Of HRM policing has become more advanced and the time required on calls has increased Halifax has experienced a rapid population growth and a rise in violent crimes index work for the should be speak excuse me excuse me everybody has had a chance to speak massive everybody has an opportunity to speak at the

Budget go ahead as an example in 1994 the former city of Dartmouth had 10 officers per shift policing okay thank you go ahead thank you so to get back to it in 1994 at that time the former city of Dartmouth had 10 officers policing each

Shift now in 2024 we have an average of 10 to 13 officers polic in the same area in Bedford we have an increase expected of about 2,000 plus homes in the area we currently are still policing Bedford the former town of Bedford with 33 33% of the police compliment afforded in

1996 the theme I’m speaking here to is to say we have an increased in population but our Frontline resources are not increasing to M that minimum Staffing levels are common in our Frontline policing as of December 23 our overtime has been more than 1.5 million to provide minimal Staffing on the front

Lines for our officers on our streets in our three divisions also our prisoner Care Facility this is our facility at headquarters where our prisoners need to stay depending depending on what their matters are we’ve spent approximately 750,000 in overtime cost and lastly our integrated emergency service so this is

Where if you call you need services and you call 911 or the non-emergency this is where your calls will be answered we have spent approximately 700,000 in overtime since October 2023 to answer calls and service from all citizens of HRM instead of using $3 million in overtime we hope that we should be

Hiring full-time police Personnel in our organization the citizens of HRM deserve a wholesome qualified police presence that can only be provided when we staff accordingly minimum expectations that you have need minimum Staffing and this requires human resources to be able to be here to give this to you as noted

Many of our members are off on some form of work this could be WCB LTD paternity leave sick many need additional assistance to come back to the workplace while our others that are here are still being overworked and burnt out all these overtime hours I’ve mentioned constitute missed opportunity for rest

Wellness and life balance the cost of this practice is often realize years later when these members start to potentially suffer we’re concerned that we’re heading in a dangerous Direction in addressing the sworn officer needs we feel 24 additional Patrol officers today would allow for a reasonable number of resources to

Alleviate most of the overtime concerns being experienced right now by the hrp and also to keep coverage at an acceptable level for our citizens hrp needs to be held accountable for adequate staff to provide quality service council is a conduit to holding hrp accountable budget oversight and management is critical compounding this

Issue is we currently are operating with approximately 22 vacancies in regards to Staffing we don’t have access to any current uh cadets at the APA over in Prince Alward Highland we also will not see a graduate W class until the spring of 2025 our ability to attract and retain

Experienced police officers has been diminished and we anticipate seven upcoming retirements in the com in this coming year when we don’t staff Patrol we can’t provide the proper amount of police Personnel for some of our other units in sections such as our criminal investigation division which have

Vacancies as well I’ll just circle back to IES we find them the staff there find themselves being asked to work on overtime on a very routine basis and this has a negative impact we feel new schedules and additional full-time staff would allow for the attract and augmentation of the watches and

Additional 12 full-time positions could potentially be recruited and funded from our part-time budget also our prisoner Care Facility costs are driven by supervisor needs that are not funded in the budget devel development of prisoner care supervisors could help alleviate these costs so in closing I want to express

Our sincere appreciation for that work that all of our police Personnel provide to the citizens of HRM we are in challenging times and our citizens and our members need more than a Band-Aid approach to fix the understaffing of hrp by supporting this budget the council the citizens as well as the police

Service will know that you support them thank you for your time just before you go councelor outad on a clarification uh thank you and and uh there was a mass Exodus when you spoke so I I didn’t quite hear your uh your comments I think that’s unfortunate

Because I think everybody deserves to be heard um you mentioned Bedford and patroling which is is not new uh to me I it’s something I’ve been dealing with with several Chiefs and and divisional commanders and I thought after some last fairly recent hirings that things were

Getting a little better uh but you made some comments about Staffing in Bedford which I have made in the past so could you give me the latest update please I’ll ask the chief for the same thing later when he speaks were referencing was to say that the policing model back

In 1996 before amalgamation we were currently with 33% of the compliment afforded to the area at that time so essentially a third of what’s there for the old count of Bedford District right okay all right and West Division as you know has grown exponentially absolutely and that there’s whole neighborhoods and

Communities that didn’t exist absolutely all right thanks very much you’re welcome thank you uh counselor Ken thank you for coming in um in relation to the need for what you believe is more bodies is there do you see a correlation though between the cadet classes and the Recruitment and

Retention efforts that are going on now to bring those bring bodies into some positions now that are you know there are members who you’ve spoke to it uh who are off and we need to have have members in those positions can you see that that is is a is a positive step

Towards what you’re talking about yes I I think getting people back to work as well as establishing cycles of hiring new Cadets and having a plan a multi-year plan to address that a combination of all those things can get us to a position where we will be adequately staffed okay thank you thank

You I’m going to ask if there’s anybody else that wishes to speak to this today come ahead good evening morning uh Sergeant Phil power with the HX Regional Police ploud very proud uh member of district 6 I I come with a number of different roles my

First role is that I am a um the treasurer for the Halifax Regional Police Association Union um but I’m more here as a citizen and business owner in particular I was hoping that I could address the gallery however that is not uh really as uh potent as I thought it

Would be so the first thing is that I own four local businesses here in HRM and I’m very proud uh to say that I do I’m also the chair of the Dartmouth Community Health Board and the co-chair for the central region for the Nova sco Health Authority Community Health Board

Why I believe that’s important is people don’t understand a lot of the different um restrictions right now on policing and the different pressures that are happening right now and if we had unlimited dollars I would absolutely say detas the police that is a great idea I 100% % unequivocally support that as a

Citizen I would support it as a union member and of course as a as a police officer myself um the big thing is is unfortunately we do not and as you know there are two buckets of money uh usually uh provincial Federal and then of course us as a municipality and what

We’re seeing right now obviously is that there’s a lot of conflict at all of those levels and just for instance in our unhoused population right now how HRM is really stepping up and doing things that are not necessarily um the responsibility of the municipality but I commend all of you for doing something

And really working towards that the big thing that I do want to uh to really uh touch base on though is our level of service and how it is decreasing here in the municipality and the reason being is because we have so many officers that

Are off and the reason why most of those officers are off is because of Occupational stress injuries right I can tell you unequivocally that uh it is not something that’s getting better is in fact getting worse the fact that we do not have a recruitment this year is

Absolutely going to be crippling to this city and I don’t think we are really at the uh the level that we understand how bad it is and that is only getting worse uh we need recruitment like there is no tomorrow we’re looking at different ways

That how we can do that however it is all after the fact and we are definitely behind the eightball right now I am also in charge of our prisoner care facility which is our uh booking or our jail as per se and I can tell you that it is

Very very important that we also look at that and we have to look at our facilities because what’s happening is um it is almost a toxic place to come to work um due to our facilities and the fact that we can’t do a lot of our jobs

Due to those facts so I would implore you as a uh as a council as a city of course to look at some different uh ways but this can’t take time I understand how the bopc works and everything else um there are processes but the more that

We delay is the larger that we are in a much bigger uh hole than what we are right so uh that’s it I won’t uh belor you anymore with any time but if there are any questions please feel free and thank you thank you Phil is there

Anybody else who wishes to come forward and speak to this is there anybody else who wishes to come forward and speak to this item is there anybody else who wishes to come forward seeing that there is not um I want to thank everybody who took part in the public

Consultation um today um we’ll be uh uh taking a break uh and coming back at 1:00 um to go through the police presentation um coun uh Deputy Mayor will be in the chair at 1:00 for a while I’m going over to be part of the press

Conference I’ll be back as soon as I can I do think councel Russell is going to try to join us uh this afternoon counselor did somebody have a councelor Ken Okay so we’ll come back uh at 1:00 thank you e e e e e e e e e e e e e e

E e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e for what

Ladies and gentlemen if you just indulge us for a few minutes we’re checking on a process item e e e good afternoon everyone and welcome back to our budget meeting of February 7th 2024 where we on um Halifax Regional Police and the world Canadian Mounted Police Halifax Regional Detachment uh

Budget we will begin with comments from chair of the board of police Commissioners Becky Kent thank you Madame Deputy Mayor and chair um it’s my pleasure today to uh present preliminary remarks on behalf of the board of police Commissioners as the chair commissioner as the chair for Halifax Regional Police

And Halifax um Detachment roal Canadian Mounted Police in relation to the budget for 20 2425 and business plan going to share a little bit just to remind folks about the policing model history and background integrated policing model for Halifax within two separate Police Services providers with a shared responsibility for one

Municipality is the model that is in place the Municipal Police Services of Halifax Dartmouth and Bedford were Amalgamated in 1996 to form the Halifax Regional Police the hrp which serves these largely urban areas the former Halifax County municipality which was primarily rural with three large Suburban areas is policed by the RCMP

Halifax Regional Detachment the policing model of governance in relation to the work that we do provides civilian governance and oversight for hrp on behalf of Halifax Regional Council and the board of police Commissioners also provides civilian governance to the RCMP Halifax Regional Detachment RCMP Halifax Regional Detachment services are delivered under

The contract through the Provincial Police service agreement of 2012 between the government of Canada and the Nova Scotia Department of Justice each agency operates under its own authorities while working together when uh situation requires it or it’s a better it’s a collaborative approach when um seems the most uh the best way

For Service delivery the policing model hrp and RCMP hrd is a unique policing model agencies have primary responsibility for specific Municipal geograph Geographic areas their integrated operations exist in some areas primarily within the criminal investigation division in areas in which integrated operations exist both agencies off officers serve the entire

Municipality hrp and RCMP are Partners in policing with a model that facilitates Mutual assistance and coordinated response providing for a professional Police Service for HRM both hrp and RCMP hrd utilize a comstat intelligence Le policing model to focus and prioritize policing objectives related to people places patterns and pro and

Problems pleasing an HRM is delivered under a unique Integrated Service model where hrp and RCMP hrd employees work together in a number of areas primarily within the investigation the criminal investigation division the court sections and the record sections population growth in H facts and how it reflects in policing Services

HRM is a vibrant and diverse municipality which has been experiencing extraordinary population growth in July of 2022 the population of HRM was estimated to be by stat statistics Canada to at 480 500 48,52 people and is predicted to continue trending upwards HRM is also home to Temporary populations including

A large student population across Unity universities the Nova Scotia Community College n secc and private career colleges for tourism 2022 was a rebound year following the covid-19 pandemic with the highest number of over overnight stays across Halifax hotels on record kpn kpi highlights for this for our services include HRM seeing an

Increase in the severity of crime over the past few years in July of 2023 statistics Canada published National statistics on crime across Canada in 2022 including the crime severity indexes the overall crime severity index CSI the violent crime severity index vcsi and the nonviolent crime severity index

Nvi the CSI measures changes in the severity of crime in different geographical areas by giving a weight to each of offense type for example a murder would be considered more serious than a robbery and a robbery would be considered more serious than a theft in 2022 the overall CSI for

Halifax went up for the third consecutive year increasing by 88.4% to 72.2 from 60 from six 66.6 in 2021 it remains below the national overall CSI of 7 78.1 which increased by 4.3% from 2021 the top offenses contributing to this overall CSI increase for Halifax were shoplifting of 5,000 and under

Robbery and breaking and entering finally the kpi highlights where violent crime the violent crime severity index or the VC SI also saw an increase by 4.8% to 10 104.2 from 99.5 in 2021 this took it above the national vcsi of 97.7 which increased by 4.6% from

2021 before I leave I’ll just say that the board of police commission um is uh pleased to serve Council uh in the important role that we do we have a board that has a great interest in s um coming to the table and strengthening the governance so I just want to say

Thank you on behalf of the entire board for the opportunity to serve in this way and now I’ll turn the tables over to our two chiefs to do their presentations I think you’re on Chief mlan excuse me just before you start um chief mlan if I might um our legal

Council is going to describe the process that we’re going to use going forward so um it’s been suggested it might be too much integration to try and deal with two presentations and and two separate motions all in one Fell Swoop and so um if council is uh is agreeable

The the thought would be after speaking with the chair and at the suggestion councelor Mancini that we hear from hrp first questions clarification that the board chair can put the motion on related hrp and then we would deal with the RCMP U budget proposal rather than

Trying to deal with one motion which I know folks will want to split the vote on in any event so that’s that’s the proposal um unless there’s some real objection is probably the easiest way to focus our discussion I see a lot of nodding already seeing no dissenting body

Language we’ll go forward and we’ welcome Chief um Don mlan deputy chief Reed momes and Haley kitchen is that right on I just have a question on um John’s uh suggestion so just so I know we will be breaking this out because I’ll be putting the motion on the floor so we’ll

Be looking at number one first then number two and then where are the presentations in that order so Council Kent what we’ll do is we’ll have the presentation from hrp we’ll have questions of clarification and then the motion item one can be put on the floor

And voted on and then we’ll do the presentation with the RCMP have questions of clarification and then two and three get put on the floor is that acceptable alternatively we can have the full discussion on the hrp budget ask and and then move on and

Put all the Motions on the floor at the very end it’s council’s wish just seems I yeah I Council I would like to I think that we should hear both presentations this is an integrated service we should hear both presentations from both services and um and then look at how we’re going to

Approach the Motions but that as as the chair of the board um I’d appreciate that but obviously it’s the will of councel so um by show of hands and I really do want to respect the chair of the board of police Commissioners absolutely but um if we

Could just have a show of hands if separating the presentation is acceptable councilor man Deputy Mayor I may speak to it thank you so my concern I find it confusion confusing if we have hrp present and then RCMP present and then we have discussion afterwards I think it’ll be

Much more clear if we have hrp why can we can vote at the end I don’t care when we vote but to have conversation about hrp finish that conversation then move on to H RCMP and then have that conversation and then vote at the end

All three is fine by me I just find two presentations then then we’re going to be talking about both uh is confusing that’s my rationale there thank you so so I understand and so that they’re clear so the Chiefs have Clarity we’ll have a presentation on hrp we’ll have

Questions of clarification and debate is that what you’re saying uh debate on what there’s no motion on the table yet right thank you Council K it would be that the item one portion if hrp goes first then item one would have the clarification item one would be put on

The floor it would be debated then the RCMP would go do their presentation questions of clarification item two and three would be put on the floor and then debate V and then vot vote on the whole thing whole thing yes gotta good enough thank you we’re good to

Proceed thank you very much everyone thank you for your patience Chief you’re on on first uh good afternoon Council um Deputy Mayor chair of the board uh fellow counselors colleagues um honored to be here today to present for the hrp budget this has been a bit of a long process I

Believe I was on the job two days when I first went before the board to talk about budget and uh seems like yesterday or maybe six months ago one of the two and uh so here we are today culmination of all those uh those efforts um yeah so the Halifax Regional Police

Our mission is working together to make our community safe and what I want to I just want to highlight on that in terms because obviously we listened to a lot of presenters this morning and and I commend them for being passionate what they feel and how they believe and what

They said and coming forward is that Public Safety and making our community safe is not the sole domain of the police department and I don’t suggest for one second that it is I believe I believe the police have an important role to play in that but I believe that

There are multiple elements that go into public safety and Community safety um many of which were spoken about this morning um and then the policing model geography and jurisdiction as we mostly know there are three hrp Geographic Patrol divisions Central which is downtown Halifax East which is in

Dartmouth West which is in Bedford and West Halifax I’ll just talk very briefly about some of our successes from last year certainly not an exhaustive list um certainly our police activity League or our pal program it’s a uh it involves the participation of approximately 30 hrp members which has directly engaged

More than a 100 youth since its Inception so this is one of our proactive things we do through sport to connect with youth in our community and we added a a newcomer focus on on these groups in the last year and I think that’s very important in terms of police

Reaching out to its Community the member re reintegration program which speaks to member Wellness is uh and I think probably mentioned it earlier one of the speakers in terms is about getting our people back to work because SP support is extremely important uh in 2023 we had 23 members participated in this program

That is 23 members coming back to work that otherwise would be would would quite potential be be still away from work so I think that’s very very impactful uh the background and security clearance unit began operating in July 2022 and became fully functionable in October of

22 um as you all know as result of council uh the polygraph for pre-employment was ceased in 2022 and now they deal with all of our hrp security clearances which is significant and we’ll speak to later in the in the in the budget presentation um during its

First year um we’ve recognized the ba the basc with several internal Awards in relation to the work they’ve done um in November of this year along with the RCMP we hosted the Atlantic women in law enforcement which brought over 200 women in law enforcement together uh in terms

Of an very important event that connects their colleagues from across Canada to network and learn from one another I had the honored uh privilege of being able to open that conference and speak to them and and sit through several of their um presentations and it it it’s

Clearly an an important thing in terms of of of member development and the advancement of diversity within policing and the creation of the rainbow internal support network the rainbow internal support network or the risn as we call it is a collective of hrmp employees who identifies as part of the 2s lgbtq plus

1A uh community that are members of the Halifax Regional Police um there’s been convers around their creation for quite some time but not not this year I guess it was late last year I had the opportunity to speak with them put them together that we actually launched that officially I’m

Very proud of that I’m very proud of the work that they do in supporting one another and it’s something that I hope to look that we can do further with some other groups within our organization I’d be remiss if I didn’t talk about some operational um successes

Over the last year in terms of since October we’ve we’ve attended approximately 60 protests in this city in terms of and I don’t think that’s going to stop anytime soon and in terms I and I would suggest that we’ve done so in a very a very measured and and and

And accomplished manner over the last little bit and in terms of but certainly having impacts on resourcing um we’ve taken 463 Firearms off the street last year which was up from 390 the year before and up for another 264 the year before that a lot

Of that is due to the to the work within the integrated C environment with my our CMP friends here in terms of and what we saw last year two years ago we had uh within hrp area we had 47 shootings uh we had 16 last year um 16

Is still 16 too many but I think it’s certainly trending in the right area and I think a lot of it is based on targeted enforcement uh some of the projects we’ve done in in the integrated CID environment and I look forward to continuing that uh the Halifax Regional Police employee

Family assistant program is uh very important group and uh and and unit within our our organization in relation to member Wellness uh they provide confidential support for employees who are experiencing personal professional or health related challenges and their goal is to provide early intervention and support and encourage employees to

Seek the assistance they may need we know that that um incidents of of operational stress injuries or PTSD occur at a much greater rate within the first responder Community than they do in the what we would call civil civilian community and we need to be prepared to

Deal with that um ensuring that this function is fully staffed and resources in line with our continued focused on employee wellness and Public Safety as you can see from the numbers from 2019 we had 60 82 referrals as should probably wear my glasses this is actually the first time

Officially I’ve ever worn glasses in in doing something like that so it should be noted for the record somewhere I’m guess it should it should also be known for the record that when the union spoke up here one of the things they said is we support the chief of police so I just

Want that noted for the record as well all right so this is true yeah it’s true um so 82 referrals in 2019 um at the time of this report it was at 133 we ended at 144 referrals for 2023 I think that’s actually a good thing um that people are actually

Seeking out the the assistance and the help that they need um we’ seen that that they’ve been increasing just about every year um and that’s one of the pieces that speaks to member wellness and one of my asks in terms of the the budget uh augmentation hate crime

Uh we we in January of 2022 we started the first hate crime unit in Atlanta Canada um we have it staffed by one one officer in the uh integrated CID environment um they provide support to the RCMP as well when when necessary uh as we see the number of hate crimes has

Gone up you know exponentially over the last few years lots of that we know and people have spoken about it earlier we know that hate crime is one of the most under reported uh incidents that occur but we also know that uh because of some of the work we’ve done around with iands

And some of the community groups in terms of knowledge and awareness that that uh that awareness is going up and leading to leading to higher numbers of reporting and we make a distinction between hate crimes which are in fact crimes within the criminal code which is

Very which has a very high bar in terms of what creates a hate crime but then there’s also hate incidents which noten necessarily a crime but clearly on the face of it caused the community or the members that are involved like cons significant concern so we’ve seen that

Number go up uh over the years from six in 2019 to hate crimes and and and we ended up in 2023 well Nani was at the time of this report for the board but we ended up at 116 and we ended up at 288 hate incidents um like I said the hate

Crime unit is currently staffed by one detective Constable we’ve seen that the number continues to increase significantly and we know that this is just not a HRM issue I know I I sit on a call every two weeks with the other Chiefs from across the country we talk

About hate crime and protests and all those other things this is a phenomena that’s being seen across the country and it’s something that I think we need to be in front of in Terms of um you know and it certainly has the support I think from the communities in terms of of

Having that having those uh positions for 2024 plan work Highlights Highlights um uh we talk about responsible Administration the hrp policy refresh and public release of hrp policy which is uh obviously one of the board’s priorities uh we’ll continue our focus on the overall refresh of our po

Policy manuals in the coming year we just hired a new senior policy adviser within the last couple weeks so I look forward um she’s put out some policies already and look forward to put them out publicly and this is a significant long-term project it involves a large number of administrative and operational

Policies and as they are added revised and updated we they will all be considered publication to our website certainly um our people our people is an extremely important piece of our organization obviously member Wellness uh which was a priority from the first day when I walked into this position um

We’ll continue to implement new Implement New Wellness initiatives and enhance our awareness of various programs currently offered within the the department our reintegration obviously is one of those I’m also excited about a new working group around an alternative dispute resolution model uh within our organization that uh

Basically you know responding to some of the academic legal and and sociological research uh throughout the country in terms of having a mechanism that allows member conflict to be dealt with by those things that exist outside necessarily of the police act which gives satisfaction to no one and um I’m

I’m really looking forward to that being implemented particularly around issues of harassment and all those particular things and I I I I will Champion that to the to the very last day in terms I think that’s a very important piece of our organization and from our uh Employee Engagement we do know from

Surveys and internal talks that employe engagement and recognition is extremely important I try to get down to the watch down down to the squads just about every day every second day they probably get tired of me at some particular point but it’s it’s good just to go around and

Talk to people and get a sense of what’s going on uh making ad not the things that are important and um you know it’s very important because you know our people are in fact the backbone of our organization and and what’s really important and and you know the majority

Do a do a a great job in terms of of what goes on could we do better of course we always do better um just last week when I was leaving on Friday and you have to excuse me because I’m actually really sick right now so I

Was actually um I actually wasn’t in yesterday poor Reed was saying I hope he can come in tomorrow otherwise he got this but uh so I I met an officer when I was walking up the door and I was like what are you doing here she had been involved

In a in in in in an event where she actually got her ribs fractured um and I was like why are you here and she was like oh I got to I was going to court and I got to do something and blah blah blah and and you know so

Obviously I said to you know you got to take care of yourself you got to do you know make sure that you’re good and and you know what she said to me but I caught the guy and really at the end of the day in terms of I spoke

With another officer the week before that who was involved in dragging someone out of a car who ended up with a concussion and I called him at home and he talked about the great support he got from people and he was going to the hospital that day and uh he talked about

How I hope I get the word I can come back to work real soon and that is the majority of well we hear a lot of the other stuff sometimes it gets caught up in the people that are off and all these other things and and that’s real um but

But they actually exemplify the people the men and the women that work for the hellofax Regional Police and uh certainly the service Excellence with our hrp technology road map uh we’ll continue to work on our technology road map there’s a variety of projects some as you may have seen them in the capital

Plan e disclosure uh I met with the uh the head of the head of the crown service there two weeks ago and they’re looking at putting something forward which I think is going to be very exciting for our members and vmobile software which which which talks about tracking our own

Members and some of the stuff that came up in the MCC um U recommendations uh prosperous economy uh Recruitment and Retention uh Recruitment and Retention remained maybe one of the highest priorities for our organization um we certainly heard it at the end when when when a few of the members spoke about

The importance of you know our membership and the numbers and um we do have a Cadet class uh recruitment process open now uh for the record um yes I agree with them in terms of it would have been great to start it earlier however we didn’t have we we we don’t have

Resources to actually do that we we drag people off the side of their desk to do that that’s one of the things I want to rectify in this budget ask um it also it also got complicated in terms of we actually are certified through the Department of Education and uh that that

Requires a certification every five years well guess guess what year that was that was this year so we just got our certification last last month last month so we’re working we’re working at doing that um we will continue our lateral uh hiring efforts officer hiring efforts

And and we we’ll do some we we have a recruitment plan and a strategy working with HRM HR now about about doing that but we know that the uh we know the bread and butter of that is in our own in-house people and and and recruiting and retaining and and and developing our

Own people is very important uh from a community community perspective the wartle report implementation uh I continue to co-chair both the wartle uh wartle report uh committee and the subcommittee research committee along with Kimberly Franklin from the Human Rights Commission there was a meeting yesterday with the RCMP uh who

Are doing a pilot project within Nova Scotia in the next little bit around race-based data collection stats can are are doing work as well there’s a lot of stuff going on in relation to that work right now and uh we will definitely be a part of it and we will definitely be

Part of bringing that together in terms of there there there are there are there are a lot of technical uh pieces that need to be considered in terms I we jokingly say that every time we open one door in terms of coming to that piece we find another three behind it in terms

That we end up to but uh we also take the we also take the position that we’re not going to let perfect it in the way of good so I think it’s important that at some point we’ll we’ll move that forward um supporting our communities are making connections we’ve talked

About the hate crime folks we talked about the cro which are a piece of my ass in terms that do do very important work in our community on a daily basis the diversity office um that reaches out and deals with communities I met with them last week in terms of we talked

Doing about a hate crime consultation within communities they’ve done some already in the Asian community and some other communities we’re looking at the African NOVA scotian community next in terms of doing the how how a consultation Works in terms of you know getting a little better at what we do

And uh you know we’ll continue to build better relationships with communities by working to meet their specific needs and certainly both fering hrp training to better serve diverse citizens I had the opportunity honor I guess privilege to to open the journey to change back in

December um it’s very impactful I I I I got I got a chance to stop in three or four times over the week while they were going on um you know the level of community members that step up to be part of that process are are is is you

Know significant um the dis the the conversation and dialogue which takes place and the emotion is raw it’s real and it’s impactful and as I said you know if you ever heard uh Reverend Anderson speak and he closes our piece up there sometimes like there’s an

Impact and in terms of at the end of the day just like any training is it’s about when you leave you know a little bit more than when you came in and when you know better you do better and really journey to change is is is a significant

Uh uh module in that in that case we are having our next journey to change I believe in at the end of this month three weeks will be our next change and we’ll continue to we’ll continue to have these at uh as often as we possibly can recognizing

There there is a resource a resource implication on those people who volunteer to show up and teach but um look I I really look forward to continuing that our last P next piece talks about our staff counts approved 2023 24 full-time equivalents were 86.1 um as you as you’re aware we so we

Have we’ve transferred out um 61.4 bodies I don’t know what point4 is but I know that’s s not it’s just the way they do the math in terms of the bodies around the um school crossing guards um which being transferred over to community safety um new positions in in stats clerks and and

Administrative support and intake analysts around foop and some of those other things and then service enhancements went through the board of police commissioners of 18 constables one Sergeant uh an efap coordinator and two civilian investigators uh for a total final uh budgeted account for uh 2425 requested obviously 77

7787 um as I mentioned earlier recruitment retention are keys for hrp we have no dedicated um Personnel at all assigned to the police Science Program what we have done in the past is is is take people from Patrol and I’ll speak about this later in terms of we got to

Get we got to stop doing that really and um and in order to facilitate the the 38 we um police Science Program um you know my goal is to have when we’re ending our next class I want want us to be in the part of recruiting already for

The next one we we we need to be able to do this like on a yearly basis in terms of as part of our actual operational um you know just just the way we operate in terms of having um police science classes running at at a regular interval um our our our

Past inconsistent approach uh creates issues um and that’s not because those in the past didn’t have the foresight they it the reality the environment has changed over the last little bit where at one time we would have hundreds of of uh EPO EPO uh applicant that’s dwindled down to almost

Nothing that that’s trickled down to almost none in terms of lots of reasons for that but but that’s just the reality in which we um in which we operate um so obviously a dedicated uh resources would enable our our enable us and allow for delivery of a more streamlined effective

And efficient program one thing I do want to not is since 2010 we have had 75 officer resignations it’s 14 years so 29 people left placing all together and that’s just that’s just the reality some people decide that’s just not for them um I actually commend people that

Do that rather because it’s a long it’s a long time it’s a long Place hard place to work for someone that really doesn’t want to be there for 30 years I’ve seen that happen it’s it’s it’s not the best um 46 people went to other police agencies

All over of note only three people who left that left for another police agency were over from our police science program so the people we recruit the people we hire and we train stay with us so I think that’s very important in terms of when we talk about the

Importance of the police science program so the operating budget summary of changes are improved 23 24 budget was 92,3 45,000 our new asks um in the patrol constables uh Community response constables uh police support civilian uh security clearance unit and hate crime uh unit and efb coordinator and we we we

Put a halfe estimate on it in terms of working with uh Jerry and his team in terms of because we recognize they’re not not they’re not going to be here in April so in terms of as we work forward in terms of getting them together

Down the road in terms of I believe was a 1 Point uh 1.3 million ask in terms of that particular piece something just under 1.3 yeah and then we have um of of the net increase of our operating budget to 98 uh 98 million just over 98 million at

The at the total there which is an increase of 5.6 million or 6.1% the vast majority of these prop uh that proposed budget is required to meet our fixed costs so that’s including the wage and benefits of our members the equipment the training the services the

Supplies um I know one of the speakers spoke and you know talked about all the police actually said they wanted you know more money for ammunition and is that more important than food no clearly it’s not more important than food but clearly we’re running a police service in terms of having sufficient ammunition

For our members to train and all that is actually very important to run our operations um you know and so in addition to those fixed costs we’re proposing the service enhancments to improve our operational organizational support functions and bolster a level of service we provide to the public we’re looking at reopening

Some of our uh our sites public facing sites that haven’t been open since covid in terms of them bringing them back because it’s very important I go down to the front door at our Police Department every day in terms of and the people that are there every day for service are

Is significant it’ll be very good to have our other places open over in Dartmouth oon and Bedford to Ser to serve those citizens in the more effective and efficient manner um so following our public consultation and and and extensive meetings with the board of police Commissioners um

Certainly I mean I think the I think part of the discourse about the conversations with the board were not robust or or not extensive I think is wasn’t wasn’t wasn’t the situation from the person sitting in this chair in terms of that wasn’t my experience and

In terms of so we talked about uh the positions I already spoke about both the sergeant and the down to the and the 12 constables for the Patrol Division uh which as um proposed by the boc two of two of those positions would be suced Community safety for a minimum of three

Years in support of the community safety program um and I just want to talk briefly I don’t want to eat up all the auction here in terms of like how did we get here in terms of what like I said I was on the job two days and we talked about

Getting into a budget conversation my rationale and my my process was around I did a couple things one is that I looked at what were the budget asks from before what what what did the Chiefs before me ask for and is that still important is that still a

Priority or are there ways that we can mitigate some of those concerns around with doing different things so there were asks around Sergeant positions and um and and and and it was good to have the hrpa there because there are some things I think that we can do within our Collective

Agreement that are able to satisfy some of those issues without asking for more people and I think that’s very important so when we talk about that when we talk about U um I think one of them even mentioned it when we talked about uh the

IES component in terms of of of doing a different schedule in terms of providing more IES work those are things that we can do within with within our power in terms terms of and some of them are Innovative and some some of them are are are but

They’re not about asking for more people they’re actually about doing things a little bit differently um so we did that then then then then we looked at where are the stresses at so before this position I was the deputy chief of operations and I dealt with the Union on

A regular basis around dealing with what they considered you know staffing issues which clearly which clearly exist in terms of of certain things so so we looked at doing certain things around overtime was a lot where at one point we would have had two people coming in on overtime working their respective shifts

We work a you know 7 to s 7 to S sort of shift in terms of well actually rather than bringing in two people that will cover those two shifts why don’t we bring in one person to cover like from a noon till a midnight shift you know in

Terms of that actually takes away that actually reduces that two to one but at the same time speaks to the peak hours when we actually need people so these are the kind of discussions we I I wish to continue as we do contract negotiations coming up recent uh U soon

These are some of the things I I I wish to present uh you know as part of our deliberations um just before they came up to speak to me they actually served me with notice of of uh for bargaining and personally so we we’re now into our

Our bargaining phase with the with the uh with hrpa so I look forward to that um we’ll continue to aggress our our staffing challenges um you know then then the other thing I looked at was around the challenges around Staffing are two two twofold one is so

We looked at our overtime we and it was mentioned we were using overtime to to staff for daily daily occurrence it’s not sustainable um so when I looked at um part of it is we can do indirect augmentation of our Frontline response which is by where

We would have taken people off of shifts before um to do certain things um we need to put the position so that’s why the hate crime that’s why the uh the um background security clearance positions that’s what that speaks to because we take people out of Patrol to do that uh

That that talks about uh some of the position the position around efap coordinator we had a front line EF uh person in terms of from uh Sant for the last year to to be that second body so we need to full we need to fully fund

That I think in terms of get away from the front line um and then at the same time then there’s about the direct augmentation about increasing the numbers of Patrol members that are available we because we do know reintegration is important we’re getting people back to work but we still have a

Significant number of people off on uh on various um injuries and other other reasons which is which I which I which I think is just indicative of the landscape of Canadian policing now that we have to you know we’re kind of late to the game we’ve been we were actually

Quite we did quite well for a number of years in terms of the people that we had off but I think in terms of and I think I think it was it was always a tenable position at best and I think Co just kind of lit the fuse for it and in terms

It’s it’s been difficult to come back ever since so in terms of illness and stuff that we deal with um so in terms of um certainly the expansion of the CR the cro uh function in terms of I think cro are extremely important in communities I think they do incred ible

Work I would like to be able to uh put them in communities that where they we can extend some of their footprint around not just geographically but actually hours of work in terms of that you know everyone I go to says you know our cro does a great job but they’re

Kind of done by four o’clock so I like to expand that with more cro in terms that have availability to do certain things um and then the patrol members and and maybe I’m the maybe I’m the it’s my own fault for this in terms of I

Think there’s been a bit bit of a misconception around uh because mental health response is was a priority of mine in the sense that because I have a statutory obligation to do it um and I’ve been quoted several times here today and other places where I said I like to be

Out of the business and 100% i’ like to be out of the business I think the chief before me would have said that and probably the three Chiefs before him would have said that and in terms of both the Chiefs across the country say that actually in terms of being out the

Business and I actually commend HRM for taking the place in terms of Community safety where they look at civilian Le um mental health response um going forward in terms I think that’s very important and I support that 100% but I don’t think in terms of the way the

Legislation is suited right now in terms that I can just walk out of the business in terms that I still have an obligation in terms of being able to respond to some of those things I think um you know then the board has been the board has

Been great in terms of you’re trying to reach out to the government and change some of those things I’ve had conversations with with with uh provincial government leaders in terms terms of doing some of those different but I think at the same time I think we

Have to recognize that so when I talk about we we we took 640 give or take people to the hospital last year in terms of for the under the voluntary psychiatric treatment act in terms of um no nobody wants to take people to the hospital for any length of

The time like it’s it’s not something people want to do they they do so because they believe they have no other op they have no other choice and that’s something that they have to do in terms of of taking them forward even even the new community safety model in terms I

Don’t believe actually has the has the process in place in terms where they’re actually taking people to the hospital in terms of are some things be able to mitigate that they don’t go to the hospital great 100% I certainly support that but there are some people that

Actually do need to go to the hosital it may in fact be the only time they actually get some medical help in terms of is when we we take them there the mitigation point that I talked about was around so we spend upwards of 4,000 hours in the hospital last year in terms

Of so these new officers were not about it’s not about being able to provide better mental health um service although I think anything that’s better is well better in terms of in in terms of um Mental Health Training and all those other stuff I don’t think anyone’s

Making a suggestion that um uh police officers who receive critical incident training or the police officers work in the mobile mental health unit that work alongside medical health professionals are in fact as well trained as medical health professionals I don’t think that’s you know I don’t think that’s the

Reality but I do think they work very well together and I think it’s a very and I think it’s a very um positive and it’s been a very successful program but I think part of the mitigation piece when we talked about Capital Health was

Around so um if you take if you if you estimate 640 that’s but 1.8 people today per day that are going to the hospital spending upwards of eight to seven hours in the hospital that are people that aren’t aren’t patrolling communities or doing things because they’re sitting in

The hospital and then multiply that by three or four in terms of because that’s you know On Any Given weekend that’s how many police car you go on to the if you go to the hospital on the weekend you’ll see just SP many police cares in the

Hospital parking lot as you will at the police department um that’s an unfortunate reality so one of the things we looked about was being Innovative with with the health services can you actually give us a place where maybe we don’t have to spend as many people in

The hospital so maybe if we have three or four people here we can actually have one officer that’s it’s more of a it’s more of a physical sort of solution in terms of being able to watch over some of the people there because as I said there was a statutory obligation to

Remain under police Authority until such time that they’re either seen or dealt with by the hospital and and and I get people’s places that maybe the hospital isn’t the place for police um I mean that’s more of a philosophical question in terms but I can tell you that the the

Legislation doesn’t read that way uh I can tell you that the hospital um the hospital wants us there in in in terms of I just got some Communications from there that they’re actually looking at having us there more often in terms of through different means so I think that

You know that’s that’s very important in terms of I don’t want to I I I don’t want to give you know short shift to anyone that spoke earlier that talks about you know mental health challenges and all those other things I I I get that you know it’s an unfort this this

Is my first kick at the can doing this um you know it be I obviously went through the board of police uh process it’s it’s unfortunate I think that sometimes this becomes a very adversarial conversation as we sit with the police and certain members of the community in terms of

Because a lot of the things that they said earlier I actually agree with I actually agree with we’re not going to police our way out of a homeless situation poverty is is terrible we need to do things about it and all those other things there are some things they

Say that I don’t that I don’t agree with clearly in terms of you know um the negative impacts that the police have on with on people again not discounting people’s personal experience I never do that but at but at the same time I think the police have an important part to

Play in in this whole conversation around Community sa it’s not the only word to say um you know unfortunately I think and some of the discussions we have around Community this this is not an either or solution I don’t think this is either you know all this or all that

I think some of this has to be more collaborative I think we kind of have to work together what I’m what I’m trying to do here is get in front of the curve in terms of you know the amount of you know we know probably everyone that sits in front of

You from HRM that’s going to sit here and say we’re growing at such an exponential rate in terms of all these and it’s going to have service impacts and all these other but but it’s true I mean you know I I’ve seen the plans over in dartm the places that are going to

Have thousands of people in the right now are all Woods there’s going to be schools in there there’s going to be places they’re going to be you know that that’s an impact people talk about HRM Halifax having a million people by 20 whatever that is in terms of you know

You know the the challenge is again this isn’t about I’m not suggesting that we have to staff ourselves to a million people today but at the same time these decisions we make and you know this process itself leans itself to Year bye you you

Know I think we need to be a little more you know forward future thinking in terms of what it looks like in particular um to to to uh to our organization in terms of you know like as the union said they agree with me but they don’t think I asked for enough you

Know the other you know but you know but at the same time I ask for what I think is actually um attainable I I think that’s important like I I wouldn’t come here asking for things like I was asked at the board like is this like the gold

Standard of this everything you could no it’s not there are other things we can do uh clearly you know I know traffic is a huge issue for most of you people in terms of you know all these could we have a more more bus Traffic Unit sure

But we could also mitigate that some with you know with the province coming up with red light cameras and some of these other things that maybe can mitigate against some of those issues so I think all of those things come together like I just I just you know I I

I don’t come here in in a sense of you know I came here from listening to my people to looking at some of the stats uh to looking at some of the you know I listen to the board i’ I’ve been to the board for the last few years I listen to

The board asked they wanted more information so I tried to give them more information this year uh as much information as I think we possibly could and uh and at the end of the day this is uh when the baby starts talking is telling you this time that your time is

Done so in terms of uh yeah good job there councelor Smith in terms of just sitting there saying St well but but at but at but uh you know yeah so I I’ll just leave it there in terms of I’m sure there’ll be more discussion as we move forward but I’m

Happy to be able to present to you today thank you very much uh Chief mclan thank you counselor Smith we now will have questions of clarification uh not debate yet but clarification so councilor Mancini thank you thank you Deputy Mayor just very quickly Chief thanks for the

Presentation uh I I Lov it that you went off script and that’s good make you’re giving your own opinion yeah I know we know that very quick I and just because I missed it earlier in your presentation you talked about we had 60 protests since when what was that time since the

1 of October October 7th actually in terms of since October 2023 we’ve had 6 really okay the other one I didn’t catch um the number of police officers you’ve lost you talked about the 46 went to other police agencies but overall the number of police officers lost were how

Many again oh uh 75 since 20 10 since 2010 and the last thing you that’s just res not retirements and that’s not uh because those things will always retirements are are you know a natural state of evolution in terms of any organization resignations do you know

Chief do you have any numbers you don’t have that’s okay out of those 75 you lost this 2010 how many went to other police agencies or percentage 46 4 oh so you mentioned that earlier sorry yeah 46 and the last thing in clarification you alluded to a couple

Times I’m not sure what it is you may have said it but I missed it what’s the efap coordinator sorry the employee family and Assistance Program Coordinator yeah thanks she I have other questions we debate time thank you deputy thank you councelor manini councelor hensby just a quick question on the

Staffing numbers you talk about those who left other retirement or elsewhere how many members we have on either on suc comment or on sick leave that are not or how many bacon positions do you have yeah through you chair to the counselor uh so comments we I believe

It’s probably eight currently today uh those are to either with the RCP and to Federal unit or to a provincial program um I assume by sick leave you mean extended sick leave and not not not just dat to day um sickle is a combination of on job injury as well so we’re probably

The combination of that somewhere around around 50 officers a long-term disability or just sickly that’s a combination of long-term sick long-term disability and long-term on job injury any any expectations how many maybe return to Service uh we’re we’re constantly working on that we have another 25 that are working on in

Temporary accommodated duties then they’re on their way back and it’s it’s it’s a constant flow of in and out we we officers get injured they go off we’re we’re constantly getting them back um it’s it’s a slow process to get them back no question but they are coming

Back as the chief mentioned earlier last year 23 officers went through the reintegration program so that was 23 that came back into the workforce thank you thank you councelor hensby councelor cuddle thank you Deputy Mayor um I just had um had a question it was it was mentioned in the public comments um

Earlier as well about the multi-year plan and um Chief mlan you were talking about you know being future thinking Forward Thinking and I’m just wondering is there a multi-year plan around succession planning like knowing that there’s seven I believe seven retirements happening this year um we have the population growth like is there

Um some kind of plan that’s being developed to look at our needs and how we’re going to get there through your chair to the counsel we’ve looked at the uh seven-year uh exp uh seven-year potential retirements um not not that everybody will retire as soon as they hit their

Date but we’ve looked at a seven-year plan and we’ve looked at what we we think we need each year um to to replace those so that’s that’s not expanding our Force that’s just the succession of the people that could leave and so that that speaks to us needing that in-host police

Science program running steady every year for the next seven years just to meet that anticipated um possible people leaving the workforce yeah and and to that so in terms of in the board package so um by 2029 we have 208 people that are eligible to retire that doesn’t mean

They’re all going to retire by 2029 cuz you some some may leave early some will stay on longer in terms of but that’s just from a baseline piece but that speaks to the part of why um why um a robust uh uh police science program and and planning stage is very important in

Terms to our a sustainable you know that’s not about growth that’s about you know keeping the lights on yeah succession planning okay that’d be great it’ be great to see that at some point Thank you thank you councelor cuddle councelor Austin uh thank you Mr chair and uh

Thank you chief for the presentation um the piece I want to ask about um just because it was it’s come up uh in I the last two budget um years as well um the officers that are off on long-term leave um you know it’s one that we talked

About and like the pressures that then create on patrol and on everyone else who’s left doing the job with fewer people around um and I’m curious um that number you quoted about 50 um I’m try I was trying to remember back to last year

What it was I feel like it was about the same and so it’s good that we’ve done the kind of the the the programs obviously bearing some fruit in terms of people going back but are we actually are we just treading water on that or are we actually St starting to move that

Needle in terms of getting people back uh back on the job through your chair of the councel we believe we’ve stemmed that tide but I want to be very cautious when I say that that you know it was growing and now we we’ve sort of flatlined it and it again

It’s it’s um working with WCB they’ve introduced some new programs that are helping get people back to work sooner plus they’re working with our rein so that’s that’s gotten the people back to work but obviously we’re still we’re kind of maintaining the status quo right

Now for lack of a better answer okay so that my that was my recollection I was like I think that number is about the same it was last year so uh okay thank you for that yeah I would just add in terms of it’s It’s a excuse me it’s a

Complex issue as as I’m sure you’re well aware I would liken it to like it’s it’s like a containership in terms of it takes a while to turn it around but in terms of when you but at least we started we we’ seen the slowing process

In terms of the inertia in terms of the slowing process some of the things the deputy talk about about integration and WCB and all those other things and in terms but and they all speak to other things around member morale and and all those other things that that we try to

Contribute to in terms of you know being being impactful on on that situation okay thank you thank you counselor Austin councelor Lovel thank you madam chair thank you for this presentation um one of the things that uh I I first want to say is thank you for your support during

The wildfire and floods um certainly unprecedented uh times in front of us uh I also wanted to uh just mention thank you so much for the conversation that we had uh around human trafficking um really appreciate it uh your time Chief and uh looking at ways that uh Council

Can become more aware of the human trafficking that’s happening here and so I just want to also thank you for uh hosting a presentation uh upcoming for us uh here at Council and staff to be more aware uh of the um crimes that are taking place in particular with youth

And in schools and so when I hear you talk about extended hours for cro I think about the important linkages uh that police officers actually have in iding right to be able to recognize um young people who may be in those situations I do uh just want to say

Though that I was um you know I’m just trying to understand when we look at those kinds of crimes human trafficking um child abuse uh you know recently I had a conversation with a woman who uh you know she actually was sold into a pedophile ring at the age of 10 you know

These These are really horrific lifechanging um things that are happening and I know that uh RCMP and hrp are working close together in addressing um these serious offenses that are happening um in our city and I just want to know you know what what kind you know similar to the

To the conversation that we’re having about future forward and future looking um there are more and more uh you know incidents of crime that are happening that you know are be coming on our radar and are that are taking place in the municipality and so I feel like we’re

Always doing this catchup and trying to you know catch uh uh and prosecute these people when in fact we just don’t seem to H be able to get in front of it so I’m just wondering if you can speak a little bit about how it is that you know

This is an operational budget and we’re trying to address the issues we have today when in fact when we look at the fraud human trafficking you know the abuse that’s happening um with young people how is it that this budget in the future is going to change so that we

Have a better understanding of that research and that work that we can put into having the staff members excuse me oh sorry I didn’t realize this was onong um is there a question for clarification regarding the budget get to that question okay I was asking that question if I may

Continue yes we’re just looking for a question of clarification yeah that’s okay so my question of clarification specifically is around future budgets which is what I was trying to get at so we have an operational budget in front of us now but clearly when we look at um the

Advancement of crimes moving forward I’d like to know how it is that uh hrp RCMP are going to be coming forward to us with a budget that actually meets the need of this community in the future and what’s happening today as far as new crimes thank you madam chair

That’s a good question there counselor in terms of um like I say you know the budget process we have currently you know in terms as as as how I see it in terms of through the board first all those other I think some of those are discussions I think need to

Need to take place at the board level in terms of you know what they see as priorities going forward in terms of and helping to you know um inform you know budget asks in terms of priorities and that sort of stuff going forward I think that’s I think that’s what’s most

Important it’s it’s very difficult to say what we’re going to put in the future when we’re not there I don’t really know in terms of you know um well we know it’s happening in other cities Chief yeah no no clear and we we need to learn from some other place in terms of

You know we’ll see you know technology will will play a big role we’ll see you know AI has great implications on certain things that has terrible implications on some other things so in terms of you know in our integrated c um um environment in terms that that would

Cover most of those things in terms of one of the things that you know we’re good at but that’s actually good in terms of having some of the you know the research capabilties stuff that the RCMP bring forward to the table in terms of that stuff but just around the

Resourcing and all that other stuff in terms of being able to deal with some of those issues in terms like so you talk about trafficking for instance in terms of a big piece of trafficking um um resp responses around awareness in terms of you know so so training to to um um you

Know Hotel staff and all that other stuff in terms of when they see you know that you know there’s something not right about that in terms of reporting it and that sort and we’ve done that in terms of delivering training to some of those places in terms of then then it’s

Just and then there there’s resources available through the province and all that stuff in terms of um for the people at home actually in terms of to see the signs of what may actually be traffic in terms of you know you see your your children showing up with things that

They just should not have have in terms of because you know those all the other things that are that are very important in terms of so I think some of those things going forward in terms of you know what our future budgets will look like I think will be we we will be

Informed by these things as they actually involved and and certainly those are discussions I think are very important to have with the board I think that may be some of the most important things discussions that we could had actually at the board level yeah proactive budget is what I’m suggesting thank

You thank you councelor love la councelor Austin uh thank you Mr chair and uh if this Strays too much into debate feel free to cut me off you will come back um I I just want to ask about the uh Patrol constables because Chief of

Course um uh you well you were there in downtown Dartmouth a very early days of your appointment um with some of the folks um who have concerns about police presence in the community and um what they’ve seen is not there has hasn’t been enough lately um and so things that

One of the things I’m going to struggle with this this budget is that ask versus the ask of other folks about police reform um so I’m wondering about the the patrol constables on the ground like out there what does what do these additional constables mean like is are they is it

Bedford is it Dartmouth is it HX is it across the board like what how does how does adding these officers actually then show up out there in the rosters in the community counselor very good question in terms of so the initial ask was for 12 which would and we’re doing the

Simple math around around three you know three watches would be four per watch in terms of um but but really what it is is the watch commanders who have the day-to-day control of our resources in terms so when they when so they have the ability to move people around as as well

They should it it’s not the it’s not me at home or the deputy at night sitting there going send three people to Dartmouth and two like it’s the watch commanders are on the road making those decisions right they need to have the pool of which they can make those

Decisions from but we need to also start from a place of uh because we assign we assign officers by division Central East West and um and so then we have to make the decisions around where do they actually go in terms of into the mix because On Any Given night any Control

Office could work any division cuz really those those those lines are artificial right and if something big happens somewhere well everyone’s going to go that that’s just the reality but at the same time and um it’s it’s important that we have a significant amount of people per per each watch that

Are going out in terms of um um fight in into their communities in ter because and you could have sick calls like like four people could call in sick tonight in dartman for instance then we’re going to have to we’re going to have to adjust to that on a daily basis so that’s

That’s the latitude given given to the to the watch commanders um one thing I didn’t say when I when I spoke earlier in terms of you know we hover around a 100,000 calls per year and then you may look at you say well you did more calls back a few years

Ago in terms of you know in terms of but the interesting part of that you have to you have to do a good analysis in terms of so where are the less calls coming there not less calls for robberies or or or or criminal offenses they’re the proactive calls which have gone down

Significantly over the last couple years in terms of the traffic stops so the people driving around your community the proact the Stop and walks that those are the calls that have actually come down so the stuff when people say rather than just go and call to call to call to call

The stuff around where people have the visibility around like I think beat officers are actually very important like I I think beat officers are a good a good thing in terms of it but the challenge with it is it becomes very difficult to have the beat officer

Program in terms of place when you’re struggling to fill your cars to get to your calls on a daily basis in terms of and that’s that’s part of the challenge in terms of when we talk about so where they would go it would be all over but

Decisions would be made in terms of I think they would affect every division okay clearly would the same apply for the response constables the community offic the cro Yes again the the original ask was for six which would have probably given me two per two and two in

Terms of four gives a different direction but I think I think we do have some um you know we have some uh uh I I think priorities come around in terms of certain areas in terms like you know downtown Halifax has has certain priorities and terms around certain

Things I’ll be meeting with their business community so I expect it to go exactly the same as the one I met with you so in terms of um you know downtown Dartmouth um you know the same sort of thing in terms of but at the same time you know their their footprint gets

Expanded you know to other areas as well um but you know that that’s certainly and that some of the questions you know some of the things we’ll have to decide as we as we move that that forward but I can tell you that going to that meeting

That day in terms of actually got my head around the expanded cro program in terms of because some of the things that people said in terms of actually got my mind to thinking as to why that that request actually came vote okay thank you thank you councelor Austin councelor

Cuddle thank you Deputy Mayor um this good uh questions of clarification here and discussion I I appreciate it um I too was happy to see the cro on the list um I I I agree I think they’re very important particularly at the community level back to the retirements you know

And I’m just trying to get what the big picture is here because right now every year you know um business units come including you know hrp and RCMP come and they they ask for additional positions here in additional positions there we’re trying to balance that with retirements retirements are already funded in the

Budget so that’s more of a replacement piece um which you know makes the recruitment position the um uh the recruitment positions um in here really important because I can see you know why we need to fill the vacancies as as they come especially when you mentioned potentially 208 by 202

That’s that’s a significant number um but back to the the bigger picture like understanding what is a full compliment if the situation around policing has changed and we know we have a number of officers who are on leave for various reasons um this isn’t unique to hrp this

Is you know a you something that’s happening across the country um you know I can I looking at some police stats here and uh and you know see that uh officers on leave like there’s you know 20% is kind of the average um so I’m just I’m just trying

To figure out like what are we trying to achieve again back into like this future thinking long-term plan we have retirements we have absenteeism we have changing crime patterns like what is our what is our goal what are we trying to get at because I think what for us here

At coun Al when we’re trying to make decisions about funding and positions having that big picture view of you know what it is that we’re trying to achieve would be really would be really useful and I really appreciate that there’s some things that we can’t predict either

Around crime or around um you know um pandemics for example would be another one right that we’re still recovering from that you know these things do happen but having a baseline I think I think would be helpful because otherwise we’re kind of operating in these year by-ear kind of you know vacuums without

Understanding the without understanding the big picture so I guess you know my back to my question my question of clarification here was um you know what it like what is it that we are trying to achieve here with with the employee complement the full-time the full-time complement at hrp he understands very

At least I I think I understand your question so in a very short answer we want enough resources to come to work every day where we don’t and and where we can deal with the unexpected SI calls and some of the stuff that we can’t control um we we

Don’t want to rely on overtime overtime as we’ve heard from other other people and presentations it it’s just it’s a cycle going in the wrong way because people are working more than they they burn out then they go off on longterm injury so I don’t know if I’m answering

Your question exactly but we’re trying to get to a staffing level where our watch commanders have enough people coming to work every day with some of those unforeseen circumstances that they don’t have to call in on overtime we’re not burning our people out people can get discretionary leave every now and

Then you know with their Bank time you know we can go back to an Era when I first joined you could actually get a night off on a Friday night that’s not existent anymore you know people turn their phones off because they’re getting so many calls on overtime so we really

Just we want to get to a place where we have enough staff coming to work for for the for the well-being of of the citizens but also for our own members so I’m not sure if that really answers your question because I don’t have a hard number because it’s different on Friday

Nights in the summer than it is on Sunday nights in in in February you never predict it but we know es and flows of calls and the watch commanders have that discretion when they have enough people working to let some people go home have some discretionary leave or

Can not not necessarily need to call in on overtime so so that’s that’s our end goal is to have enough resources to to to meet the needs of of I think I think you get 100% what I’m getting at just to see that off paper would be awesome thank

You thank you councelor cudle councelor Austin you’re back I am back but very quickly uh Community response officers um one of the gaps that uh I think we have um has been around you know they work typically kind of daytime 9 till 4: or 5 whatever the case might be um

They’ll come in for some extra thing if there’s a community meeting but you know we don’t have Community officers into the evening shift and what I see in my community often um I’ve pluged this to I think three Chiefs now um is a gap in the early evening hours and I’m

Wondering if there’s any consideration with the community response officer where we’re adding bodies to looking towards an evening shift of community response officers that that actually was one of the things I actually spoke about at the board in terms of and again part of it came from that discussion in terms of

But I know it otherwise I Know It Anyway in terms of first I don’t want to say community officers work all all all time they they work weekends they do all kinds of things in terms of you know I want to be clear in that this dealing

With specific issues but one of the things I talked about when I had my initial ask was around expanding their footprint from a from a from a Time sense in terms of you know in terms of um we still have to work within the the contract only allows them to work

Certain hours of time because of where they work in terms of there are contractual limitations in there but there there certainly those limitations don’t uh uh aren’t against working say till 10:00 at night or something like that but I think that was one of the things actually I actually looked at

That I thought would be actually be a good thing moving forward in terms of um having some CR o um capabilities you know into the evening and that’s not everyone working 2:00 to 3:00 in the morning in terms so any of them who are listening now they are sitting there

Going oh my gosh the chief wants is now work at 3:00 in the morning that’s not what I’m saying but um but I think it is important to expand the footprint in terms of because because the work they do actually could extend a little bit further okay thank

You thank you Council Austin councelor Stoddard on a questional clarification yes thank you than you Madame chair thank you madam Deputy Mayor sorry about that um just a quick question um I understand um from the report that you no longer receive funds on summary offense tickets wasn’t there one time you used

To on summary offense tickets take that take our CFO is uh got his mic on he might be able to help us here councelor stter uh thank you chair uh Jerry black with CFO I think if you go back maybe 25 years um summary ofense tickets Revenue

Was uh was in uh hrp’s budget as a as a revenue line uh it hasn’t been I know I’ve been around for close to 20 years and uh it hasn’t been it was in finance for a little while when Finance managed um parking enforcement and then it switched over to um corporate compliance

And planning and development and is now with uh public works so the uh summary of fence ticket Revenue moved to those business units but just last year uh we did we uh made a corporate decision that that Revenue would reside in fiscal services so it’s outside of any any

Business unit thank you thank you very very much thank you thank you madam CH thank you councelor Stoddard um so seeing no further names on the list or agreed upon process was to put item one on the floor and then to for a debate uh councelor Kent would you like to make that

Motion thank you madam chair I move that healthx Regional Council d one direct the chief administrative officer to incorporate the Halifax Regional Police hrp proposed 2024 25 budget and business plan as set out and discussed in the accompanying plan and supporting presentation attached to the report dated January 24th 2024 into the draft

2024 25 operating budget second I’m sorry I didn’t hear who seconded that councelor Blackburn thank you councelor Blackburn appreciate it councelor Kent yeah thank you um so I’m gonna I have I have remarks to say but that are more um specific to both both uh budgets so I’m just going to offer

Them and and you’ll understand which ones uh go where but mostly they’re more generic I um so I’m pleased to put this motion forward as the board of police commission chair you know we gave the each Police Service a careful consideration we I think we had more uh

Process this year and I think the Chiefs can attest to that more process that’s from what I’m being told of in the past we had uh three presentations for each each um Chief we had supplementary reports we had uh two public presentations one virtual and one in

Person to make sure we accommodated as many people as we possibly could um we uh when we um requested information for our debate you know the the chiefs were responsive um it was really I thought it was very encouraging certainly to get such a good turnout to our our uh our

Meetings for Public Presentation and I can’t agree with every comment that was made today from some of the presenters um but it is important to hear from folks you know it I think it’s also worth mentioning that you uh we don’t always hear from the majority of the

Population in this case I could do the math but you can do it as well as I can um about uh you know the percentage of folks that come in and usually in my experience and the career that I’ve had those that are not stepping up yes there

Are some barriers sometimes and some folks don’t have the means of transportation a number of things like that but in general um I think we’d be hard pressed to find anyone that would like to see the police not available to them when they need it um Insight from

The lived experience is really really important and um you know I agree that uh Mental Health approaches and and I know the board and the chief spoke to it um Chief mlan spoke to the board’s uh interest and our our strategic pillars of which you all

Saw the plan on a page is very clearly has the two major factors including included in it which is a priority for how are we’re policing within the constructs of addressing housing and homelessness and it comes down to the core service that the police serve um to to do that work

We we know there’s a role but we don’t see them as a role that is as deep in as perhaps we were pushed to in the past and the but there are many many many uh issues that come forward for policing that’ll be on that as well and

Um Public Safety I think the public safety office here at the municipality is one of the the biggest um change makers that I think will contribute to the policing services that we provide uh that our two Services provide and what I’m particularly pleased with right now

Um as the chair and I think the board is as well is that we have our leadership that in place right now that are looking for uh collaboration effective seamless ways to address many of the of the issues that are there um it together if not together certainly um

Contributing to the conversation around models and you you know our policing services are at the table around um intimate partner violence uh approaches around the Mental Health crisis calls and and Service delivery around Community response around our um the police science program and the hate crimes and and such those those are and

The general duty I can’t I can’t agree more with the the chief around the importance of the general duty those are the folks that are front facing to our residents of this municipality and they need we hear every day how much they don’t they that they want to see them

And if we don’t resource them in a way that will provide that I think we’re fighting a fight a tough battle um obviously delivery to the public uh is is number one Public Safety delivering their service to the public but our member health and our recruitment and retention

Play the biggest role in how that delivery is provided if we don’t have a healthy service and if we don’t have a recruitment and retention plan and program that we can actually act on so when we have these young Cadets and and and transferring um changing of career

Uh more mature Cadets and lateral moves if we don’t have the capacity to bring them on how can we partic potentially uh improve and better the service delivery that we have um it’s it’s our members are is my time up no coun can you’re very welcome to come back thank

You thank you councilor again councelor Mason I love Becky when she’s in full flight right it’s so passionate I mean it’s too bad we can’t lend our time like the American Congress okay so very quickly so don’t run out of time uh you know we heard a lot of really passionate

People today who said a lot of stuff which I think they’d be surprised how many of us agree with a lot of what they said right I mean they’re not you know uh this is not far from what we’re talking about both in terms of at the board of police Commissioners in the

Policing services and in community uh safety uh I also just have to say because these kind of things drive me crazy like food action the the the hellofax food action thing was not not funded we have not gotten to budget to fund it yet so that that’s a argument

For a future time uh I was pleased to see in the budget that the crossing guards are being moved to community safety as we discussed last year thank you for that and I like the discussion of the reduction overtime uh I wish I had seen that more directly put into

Fdes but I I get it right like we’re seeing that money uh not being used for overtime uh and I agree we need to maintain it for when you need to bring people in uh you know at a certain level I think we’re probably going to get back

Down to pre-co levels in this coming year and that’ll be kind of a good Benchmark uh what we heard from the folks who were here was that we need civilian Le crisis response and I agree with that and Council agrees with that we voted to do that we voted to do that

Uh and that doesn’t mean that you have no police and it doesn’t mean that you don’t increase police funding as you grow in my opinion it and it doesn’t mean that the police never go on a mental health call they’re going to go on Mental Health calls they’re legally

Obliged under the police act to go when ordered or called to a mental health call but the fact is that uh you know we need to stand up our street response that we’ve been talking about our Public Safety response and it may be that one of the people in the truck going around

With the mental health nurse and the social worker is a police officer in plane closed that’s what’s happening on the west coast of the United States they’re not going out there with police uh it’s it’s uh simply not the case so you know we don’t talk so much about uh

Defunding the police but we have talked about detas the police and I want to say and I’ve been saying this to people for the last couple weeks as we come up to this it’s like in the mids there was a move to get rid of Park Patrol and get

Rid of the Port Police and make the police do everything and the end result is you don’t have time to do those things you just don’t right and what we need you you you call when it’s a criminal thing but when I went out on

That ride along uh before I guess it was end of last summer uh 95% of what we what we were called to respond to was social work uh there was one criminal thing and I tell people and it was just because a very drunk guy didn’t want to pay the cab you

Was getting out of his cab that was it in the whole night in downtown on a Friday uh and you know what did I see mental health parking noise complaints all stuff the bylaw officers could handle that compliance officers can handle that nurses could handle with police backup when needed uh no police

Officer is going to get out of their car and issue a ticket in downtown Halifax on a Friday night and wait for a tow truck that’s not going to happen we need to respond to that we need to take that off their plates so uh you know there’s

A lot of things that uh uh we could be talking about here but uh I want to remind Council that last year Council directed staff to reduce the overall budget that was asked for by Community safety in January we cut eight FTE positions from the budget uh those FTE

Are required to fully fund and roll out the uh Public Safety strategy I also want to tell Council that uh the and the board members know this that the board of police commission passed a motion in November that uh asked the HX Regional municipality recommended that HX Council

Fully fund the public safety strategy in the 2425 fiscal year uh to the amount originally identified in the plan so for me I can’t comfortably vote right now to increase the police budget absent of having seen the community safety budget and whether or not those positions are

Going to be funded and I I think everything that we heard from from the acting Chief makes a lot of sense but we also need to either slow slightly the increase in funding to police to make sure that that $8 or $900,000 is given to community safety to hire the

People to actually roll out the plan we endorsed and then didn’t fund right we want to do all the things we heard from these people today but we didn’t fund it so we need to get there uh I got 43 seconds left so I will come

Back after people talk I have a motion to defer and ask for an update on what that cost would be uh and I would do that to both uh to after the Motions for both hrp and RCMP but I want to hear the discussion today and a motion to defer

The passes would end the debate and I don’t want to do that yet questions for you acting Chief and your staff is uh I had a question about commissioner under cont contract are they does that fall under the HRM living wage policy because I had a a former

Employee the commissioner say that there that it doesn’t and I’m wondering about that because ATM’s committed to a living wage you may not have the answers on that right now but hopefully we can get them I I did want to clarify my understanding is that the ACT says that

If we’re going to do if you we’re going to have uh someone that the police handed someone to when they’re doing an admin for mental health the ACT says peace officer not police officer so that could be a special Constable that’s my understanding understand that been a big debate at the

Board I’m wondering if you could tell us what the cop for for all of the HRM is for all of atrion for both forces and I’ll come back thank you thank you sorry Deputy Mayor so to the coun can you can you just clarify what those questions were

Again uh our commissioners paid a living wage under your contract uh uh does the ACT not say peace officer not police officer so special constables could uh wait at the hospital uh the cop per pop for all of HRM both forces full population it’s a it’s a unified Force

So that’s the number that matters yeah no so for for for your first question I I I can’t answer the question for to your first question I’ll have to get back to that one um your second question um was around uh peace officer peace officers yeah so I I do believe the IPA

Does does specify peace officers in there in terms of um particular PA but it also talks about those that take them there need to stay with like so in terms of and I used to have the act in front of me right now I don’t have it right in front of me so

You can’t do a hot handoff from one police officer to another it’s the same no no I think I think you can do that it’s a peace officer anyway we’ll come back I think you can do that and then at your last piece and I have it in here

Something but I I believe that the overall number for cop department is 158 okay all right CL verify that exactly would but but I’ll come back thank you did you um Jerry has a comment to add yeah thank you uh counselor for your question on living wage um commissionaires would would fall

Under the I think the security category and would fall into uh living wage but I’ll we’ll come back and and confirm that but I’m pretty sure they are thank you thank you councelor uh Smith thank you chair and I will definitely try not to run out of time during your watch uh

So and thankfully I’ve had lots of time with this with this budget and and discussion uh with the chief or both Chiefs and and staff and also the the public so we’ve gotten lots of feedback and uh so I really don’t have much much questions the one question that I I want

To clarify um but it was actually clarified already just around the the school crossing guards cuz initially I didn’t see it but then I just had to dig a Little Deeper it’s in there so happy to see that um so so really for for for me uh colleagues and again we’ve had a

Lot of discussion at the police commission and you know it’s it’s a little disheartening sometimes when we hear that we’re not listening uh as the the commission and I understand because it seemed that we’re not listening if we don’t agree um but if if if folks listen to the entirety of the meetings

And and look at the minutes that we we do ask questions around the budget um you know there wasn’t when we had this in front of us um I was one of them who who supported some positions but not all um and ultimately because um the the

Majority wanted to support all of them I didn’t vote for the entire budget not because I didn’t support what some of what’s being asked but I don’t support all of it so really it was I had to vote against the budget I would have liked to

Be a able to add the hate crime because as we we heard that there’s folks who who don’t um want to report but we’ve seen an increase in reporting through through the stats that it’s it’s working maybe it’s not working to the highest extent I probably that’s why we need

Another one but that’s not the question today and and today is really about uh giving what’s being asked for and you know with with what councilor Mason has has laid out and we bring the motion forward and maybe I’ll speak about it then you know the community safety plan actually has actions

Around the mental health response transportation and supporting um emergency response folks in the mental health call and etc etc so I really think that we have the tools in front of us we have to obviously make sure we use them right and that will take some

Growing Pains but at the same time you know there is a concern that that there is a lot of police time being spent and I hope that that when we get the report back at the Poli police commission around the um the involuntary uh Care Act that it gives clarification on what

It means by a peace officer and who can stay and who can’t stay so so and for me not being a lawyer it’s clear to me that a peace officer could be someone who’s special conable but at the same time it who picks the person up so do we need to

Have somebody who’s responding with police who then goes and then stays there you know those are questions that we have to have to ask later on but all that to say is is you know I didn’t vote for the the the budget at commission for the reasons that I mentioned earlier

Around I I do feel some of the positions are needed um uh to deal with some of the issues and and if this doesn’t pass and we’ll have that discussion at the commission so today I won’t be voting for for the budget just on the sense that we can’t really talk about the

Inner workings because that’s our role at the police commission and I’ll save it there to hopefully if if it comes it it goes to that place to have those further discussions so I’ll leave it there and come back when Council brings up this for thanks thank you councelor Smith councelor

Manini thank you uh deputy mayor uh uh Chief and chief superintendent to you and your your member the men and women that serve uh our city I thank them every day for that work I appreciate it public safety isn’t solely the responsibility of police that’s Chief McLean’s quote and I agree

Wholeheartedly in that there was a speaker this morning that said desperation leads to Crime I agree with that also and that’s the situation that we’re in right now and HRM is not keeping up a growth I mean chief came over at dark we sat down with the folks

From Clayton development to talk about Port Wallace it’s 10,000 people the size of Truro we’re putting in there last count when I just did a rough high level estimate in dark withth alone either under construction approved or potentially could be approved 30,000 units dark alone and you know councelor

Out will speak about Bedford and the growth that’s gone on there for the last number of years so we’re when we look at policing we’re simply not keeping up with the growth um a few questions here Chief um and you talked about member Wellness in your presentation but since the last

Time with the previous Chief Sitting here at budget time you know what what has been done since last year to support officers with their mental health I mean you know we know policing is tough putting on the uniform uh morale has been you know morale has been down with

Policing uh being a cop is a lot different from you know when I was a young person and the way that we young people look at police officers uh you know my big question is I’m asking what’s been different are officers getting the help they need do you really

Have their back because when I speak to your members and when every time I see one of your members I I talked to them I introduced myself we have a conversation I asked them how are they doing some of them tell me and some of them don’t but

So have concerns about that that’s my first question watching time here uh any update on the body warn cameras this discussion if you could please that that would be great Um and again if you could elaborate if new if we approve what’s uh in front of us today in those officers you’re asking for when they actually going to start work because you talked about the police science class and the challenges that we have but I think it’s important for people watching and

Understanding even if we approve today and give you the thumbs up and and we approved the budget overall in March to go forward there’s going to be a big lag before we even get those officers hit the hit the street so if you could just

Talk to that a little bit more um is there any data that’s showing that there are better results when police officers have fome mental health training is there any stats around that uh and if you don’t have that today maybe it’s something we could take a look at but I mean you’re

Talking about these new officers going into to um into hospitals uh and you want to give the mental health training you know what type of Mental Health Training is that and what’s the data connected uh to that uh I’m going to stop there because I’m going to come back later on for the

Second time around so Chief I’ll we start there uh and that way I’m also scar of the the chair too so I want to finish oh it’s it’s the easy chair now I didn’t see that go ahead go for 10 go for 10 minut go for 10 minutes that’s right Chief and

I’ll come back for the those questions uh later on your chair to the councel I I’ll start with probably the first question um around around the wellness uh so we have a full-time Wellness coordinator in in hrp and and part of her strategy deals with uh mental Wellness as well as

Physical wellness so that’s a full-time position that’s that is uh continually running running programs whether it’s through nutrition whether it’s through courses on sleep proper proper diet proper exercise si uh things like that so so that there’s a a constant wellness program going on within hrp um for for the members well-being

And that’s that’s that’s part that’s her full-time role is to do that but we do have officers that are off because of impact to their mental health due to the job specifically right and and I know last year we approved the psychologist I think a person’s still

Not in in place yet uh you know what are we doing about getting those officers back and preventing future officers uh to go to leave the job because of their mental health yeah one of the other programs and I think we’ve mentioned it before is we have a a safeguarding

Program which is for a lot of our positions we have um mandatory psychological uh assessments just due to the nature of the job that they’re in and these are some of the highrisk jobs that the sexual assult in investigators forensic investigators just to name a couple but it’s it’s and every year we

Keep expanding that to where we’re now going to a pilot program where we’re going to offer uh voluntary Wellness checks for all members um we’re not making it mandatory for everybody yet but you know we’re working with the Union on that but right now we’re going

To roll it out and make it voluntary so so the the wellness coordinator also works in areas of resilience and we offer courses on resilience so so it’s a combination of all of those things to try and prevent the the me the the occupational stress injury before it occurs

Just add to that um a few years ago we were lucky in our senior our senior leadership team um we had uh Dr coocher presented to us one day um Senator coocher I guess I I believe he actually got he got named to the Senate the day he actually was in

Meeting us actually because he stepped out yeah and uh so he was talking about so obviously he’s you know renowned in terms of of you know mental health and and and Adolescence and all these other lots of things and one of the questions I asked him was I said so around

Resiliency around all the like what from your perspective what what’s the best thing someone can do or what’s the situation in terms of maintaining their own you know their mental health right you know I I don’t know I was expecting some fancy program or so I don’t know what I was expecting

In terms of what I asked but and he said you know the most important thing from his perspective that you could have and I’m paraphrasing a bit now because it was a few years ago was around having a close-nit support system that you trusted and that you

Were able to speak to the things that were bothering you in a timely fashion so that speaks to things like so when we try to do debriefs and things on things when you know significant events occur in terms even at The Shift level even if they’re informal in terms of you know

Having these conversations about uh you know um that actually help right so so formalizing that in terms of actual debriefs but in terms of the squads actually come together in terms of you know talking about when things when they have bad calls and they occur and not that’s so that’s very important

To me right um your other question was the body warn camera I think was next so actually um so that funding was reestablished it was never actually really kind of taken it was we still there right the coordinator position so we will look at bringing

That back up again in in this budget but but I think where we’re at now we’re in a better place I think we’re in a better place because my partners here next to me are going to be instituting uh a program uh very soon I’m not sure

Exactly what it is right and I’m basically going to steal it from right right that’s in terms of you know i’ I’ve spoken to their leadership well not steal borrow you know whatever but in terms of um I I spoken to their leadership at the deputy level in terms of you know that

There 100% you know research and all this other stuff that they have in terms that for us to be able to roll out that program and and at some point a decision has to be made in terms was because there’s significant there’s a cost to it probably a capital cost at some

Particular point in terms of you know rolling that out uh your next question was I I wrote down leg but I’m not sure what it me the uh the if a budget approved you give you the go ahead the new officers you alluded to earlier on

When are they actually going to hit the road because there’s a lag by time you get the approv they’re not going to be showing up uh next month that’s for darn yeah no no not at all I think you know that’s part of the challenge in terms of

Police but that you and police Staffing in terms that you have to be so far ahead of the the curve because it’s not someone you can go and hire tomorrow in ter although you know historically we’ve used you know experienced police officer programs in

Terms of it but right now it it it truly is a it truly is for those who what I would say you know transitory police officers that don’t mind moving all over I was never one of them in terms i’ born and raised here I have no desire to

Leave like right Transit that wants to go you know in terms of um um it’s a buyer’s market for me like in terms of where where they want to go and all these other stuff in terms of almost nomadic to a certain certain degree um we also we’ve also spoken about you know

Making sure we have a very good relationship with the Atlantic Police Academy that that we be putting through two classes this year in terms of I think we have people going over there relatively soon to get ourselves before some of those people in terms of and let

Them know what we have to offer and all so there’s there’s multifaceted pieces but but clearly in terms of it will be um you know this year will be tough this this year will be a Challen I don’t think it’s as frightening as maybe you know was presented earlier in terms of

But I think um is uh you know establishing our robust police science program in terms that’s sustainable and and and and um ongoing and and that sort of thing in terms of I and I’m sure that will be a I think will there will be enough positions going around in terms

That we’ll be able to um that that would be a good thing for policing in Nova Scotia not just HR okay thanks Chief thank you Jerry uh thank you chair and just to uh to councel manini’s question and the chief uh mentioned that in his presentation the the positions the new

Asks in the in the budget are prated at 50% annual funding right for that on boarding I understand thank you y thanks Mr Mayor thank you councilor cutle thank you Mr Mayor um I I I just want to start by saying that I that the tone and tenor of this

Discussion today has been very positive um I want to thank um chief mlan and hrp as well as my counselor colleagues um you know just recognizing that things are changing that we have very much changed the discussion around what policing should look like what it can look like and how

We’re addressing it you know I’m very proud of the establishment of the um Community Safety Office the Public Safety Office and the work that’s being done there um I’m I’m very proud to hear the things that are happening at hrp um both uh you in terms of the journey to

Change um program I’m not exactly sure what that is you talked a little bit about it but recognizing that that change is needed and we’re actively implementing that change is really positive the discussion around mental health not just in the community and how we need to appropriately respond to

Mental health in the community but how that needs to be mirrored within the force itself and and how we treat employees and that these things are a reflection of each other and so I think a lot of positive change is happening and I’m I’m very proud to see that

Um so you know back to the budget uh you know and this is and this is where you know it always becomes a bit of a contentious issue particularly when we’re looking at um a budget an overall budget increase at HRM um you know which

Is really quite High and um and you know trying to mitigate all of that is is definitely um a challenge uh you know when I look at the what’s being presented for hrp again the community response officers they’re really critical to communities especially communities like Spryfield that I

Represent I know the value of of the cro and and very much um support that coming back they were cut during covid um which I never understood so I’m very happy to see that back hate crime you know again that’s one of those things that we we

Are seeing more and more of in the happening in the community and we need to have a response one of those things that we might not have been able to predict 20 years ago that we’re seeing now and and we need to put attention on those issues and so I’m happy to see

That the employee and family assistant positions that’s about getting people back into the workforce and keeping them in the workforce so important right particularly when we know we have people who are off for various reasons you know part of the challenge is you know we need to add the new positions but we

Also need to get the people back who were already paying to be there because this is this is a big big part of the problem so very supportive of that um the background and security clearance piece um about screening recruits that’s all I see that all part of Recruitment

And I see that is um you know as we’ve noted with retirements and growth that we that we need to have that recruitment piece in place and so supportive of that um the 12 asks for the new Patrol officers that’s where I do have some questions I I’ve I’ve heard what you’ve

Said and I’m I’m really considering that I’m also you know thinking about the motion that um councelor Mason is looking at bringing bringing forward that yes we know we need to grow but what is the right rate at which to grow and um you know is there an opportunity

Perhaps to slow that down a bit um while you know we’re waiting to see what’s happening with the with the public safety office um you know often when we’re bringing in change you know while a new system comes in you still have the need for the old system it’s not that

It’s going to switch out automatically you need the time for those things to to grow and mature and and to find out how they’re going to integrate and work together and and where some savings can be um can be made from one to the other

So I um I’m I’m going to wait for councelor Mason’s uh motion and the debate that happens there to see where that goes but you know overall I I think there’s a lot of really positive things in this budget um things that I think we can all be proud of um even our

Residents and you know and addressing many of the concerns that were spoken about here today you know we are we are in the challenge that as was noted you know the we’ve eroded the the social safety net that’s not us but we still do have that jurisdictional responsibility

And and I get that and I support that and I understand that so um you know it’s just where can we make sure that we’re making you know good responsible fiscal decisions not just within this unit but within all of HRM so thank you for your presentation thank you councelor

Lovel thank you Mr Mayor welcome back uh thank you for this presentation and um the first thing I want to say is hello to the watch party over at Mount St V University um uh it’s great to see students interested in the police budget and learning

Uh I want to thank everyone who spoke today who sent in corresponden uh I think one of the takeaways for me personally uh from all of the presentations um is how much the provincial government has actually failed us uh not invested in mental health not invested in public housing

Not and choosing not uh to support those folks who need uh Social Services assistance and a a raise in income assistance and the list goes on and that is my takeaway the municipality at the end of the day does get to keep 70% of all property taxes that we collect and

The other roughly 30% go off to the province for provincial responsibility so I urge uh everyone to talk to their MLA uh to talk to their Member of Parliament you know the municipality can’t uh accept um you know the responsibility for social services unless we overhaul our tax system and

Rethink you know where that money is going to go at the end of the day we are growing uh municipality and I will say that the majority of people that I’ve spoken to in my district are saying where are the police we need the police and we don’t have enough and that’s the

Message that I’m hearing in District 13 hamis plain St Margaret’s uh I will say that uh I think if we look at um the overall vision of policing in the municipality we need to think about rep prioritizing uh what it is that we’re spending the money on but also to think

About what is coming as a municipality grows as a city grows we know that there are other challenges because there’s a Playbook with larger cities I mean just look at the vehicle thefts uh that are taking place in Montreal and Toronto look at the uh rise in domestic violence

Across uh the country and I think you know Alex Livingston he he when he spoke today he said we need to think about refunding social services well that yes but the municipality doesn’t fund Social Services that’s not our Bailey wig that’s not our jurisdiction um and I do think that you

Know when I look at the framework for action on Family Violence which came into place in this province in the 1990s you know I I Chief I’m I’m looking at this saying there’s no dedicated ipv investigator within the Halifax Regional Detachment so at this point it seems to

Me you’re suggesting that a creative solution is to actually get intimate partner violence unit in place so Chief I’m I’m trying to come up with you know the fact that the last 30 years uh Social Services organizations uh supporting women and families and children have been saying we absolutely

Need to have intimate partner violence address so I wonder if you can speak to that where you know I don’t see this as a creative solution I see this as as something that should have been done long ago thank you Mr Mayor thank you is there a response to

That that was you that’s in your budget oh I I’m sorry about that this is the this is the confusion with this budget process uh I think I actually had a minute and a half left Mr Mayor so again this this comes down to who’s

Doing what where when um so I guess my question is out of order then and I need to wait until we’re actually discussing the RCMP budget uh but I so then I will put you on the spot uh Chief mlan can you talk to me about uh your intimate

Partner violence unit uh domestic violence and and the work that you see as far as the numbers continue to increase uh for domestic violence um in HRM yeah yeah to the counselor so we have a dedicated intimate partner violence coordinator that works in our organization what plus civilians that

Work along with them so one’s a police officer then civilians uh but the majority of our intimate partner calls are responded to by first respond like they’re responded by um our Patrol members at the patrol level in terms of and the training that they get at the

Patrol level in terms of um which is Q&A through sergeants and and and all this other um you know very serious matters would end up in integrated CID okay but uh in terms of um thank you so the deputy just reinfored Me In terms so we have one officer and four

Civilians that work within the internet piece and they they deal with offenders and and and and some of this other stuff our day-to-day respond CH is kind of weird you go it’s really hard to see and uh and um thank you you but the majority of our day-to-day

Calls that we respond to someone called right now about an inate pilot partner violence a domestic case it will be responded to by our our Patrol level responders who who who receive training and and and understanding and and and Noah Dara and all these other things in

Terms of uh responding to those issues that’s that’s who deals with the majority of um cable ARA who who’s the person that works in the office in terms has a has a a role in terms of coordinating particularly around offenders and and stuff like that okay I’ll I’ll reserve my question

Mr Mayor for RCMP thank you thank you all right colleagues it’s 3:00 we’re we’re only going till 4:00 today so I’m wondering do people need to take a few minutes a bio break maybe five or maybe we’ll just take five minutes and we’ll chat with um with superintendent Christie whether he wants

To be here because it’s unlikely we’re going to we haven’t done the RCMP presentation right probably not going to get to that today if there’s a motion coming I’m guessing but we’ll have a conversation and see what he wants to do we we’ll just take five minutes okay

Colleagues so let’s try to be back because we only have an hour to go e e e e e e e e e e okay folks we’re going to gather again thank she okay uh Chief uh you had a good reunion with Barb uh St John uh at lunch she

Trying to get her back Barb worked for the police she’s worked for the Navy but she’s got great connections now she’s in our office and she’s amazing all right colleagues we’re going to go back on our list we’re debating we’re discussing the police uh budget um and uh hip budget councilor

Mancini thank you Mr mayor good to see you back in the chair uh Chief last question I last time I asked you question one you didn’t answer that was is there data showing better results when a police officer has mental health training so I’m going to ask you some

Other questions if you could answer that one um so I think we all agreed we don’t want armed officers in the hospitals we’ve talked about that at Great length we talked about the possibility the peace officer I know in Ottawa right now colleagues they’re actually doing peace

Officers going to the hospitals uh with those their mental health uh crisis um you know and chief you talked about the hospital want somebody from a security point of view involved uh I wondering this may be for uh counselor Kent if she gets a chance can you update us where

That motion is like is that the police Board of police commission because as the chief alluded to we need legislative change so that it’s not a police officer but I think the counselor to my left here talked about it could be a peace officer so are you so so if if someone

Could give us an update on that I don’t know if you know what that is no there’s um the there’s a national survey by Angus Reed Institute that said three out of five Canadians 60% feel less safe today than before covid-19 pandemic across the country that’s happening right right now um you

Know today we heard the defund detas conversation the letter was signed by 800 people we heard that quite clearly we our inboxes are full or people stop me in in the uh on the street however and they say and they we’ll complain as it did last budget that so many people

Spoke against it why you’re supporting the police but I will tell you and when I look at my district and I look at when I speak to people in woodlon and Montebello and dark worth North and the businesses in Burnside and when I speak to my colleagues downtown dark withth uh

Business people and here in Spring Garden Road they’re asking for more police because they’re concerned conc ered about safety um you know the folks said detas reallocate the funds for policing to go to Food security real housing social support mental health supports poverty access to housing help with ins income

Assistance rate to go up I agree with all that that’s the province of Nova Scotia as Council lovely said it’s the province of NOA Scotia they did say though we should be supporting library and snow removal community centers free programs for Youth and adults Community Care public transportation I agree we

Should all do that but it’s not an either or it’s not an either or we we need policing we need to make sure as we out grow our Police Department because of the the rapid growth to our city and so I am looking forward to the motion that the councel and as is

Bringing forward because I think there is a parallel path with our our our Public Safety group and I need to hear from them also uh before make a final decision uh but we do need more policing so Chief if you could just answer that question I asked earlier about the data

Showing better results if your officers have mental health training and what is that Mental Health Training you’re proposing that these officers that would be going to the hospital can you give us a description what that is thank you I I don’t know if I have any data

Per se or any but what we’re talk what I what I can tell you is that the the there trading would be so we we’ve had a longstanding and I think very successful um collabor ation with Capital Health with the mobile Mental Health crisis team in terms of it’s been going on for

For many years now um I I used to oversee it at one particular time in terms of and the number of calls that they go to and the issues that they deal with um I think you know I have no doubt there have been you know certainly you a lot of

Speakers got up and and they and they spoke about things and and events most of which most of which is did not occur here like most of which that occurred somewhere else right you know and um I’m not diminishing that but but I’m I’m saying that I think I think we can show

That you know and and the board had presentations from you know Matt white at Capital Health that helps administer that program and in terms of I think they show so they get a they get a level of CR critical in and training that’s that’s that is um provided through Matt

White’s people and and the and the um psychological care of people in terms of and that’s why I would Envision that our officers would get something very similar to that in terms of you know does that make them doctors of course not right that but you know does it make

Them um does it make give them the ability because there are a lot of officers that have actually a lot of empathy and compassion and understanding that do with people on a daily basis in terms of um some of these issues and and I think that I think we’ve seen from the

Success of the mobile mobile Mental Health crisis team over the number of years and like I said we have a long standing there’d be a lot of of data that’s available through them in terms of that we’ve had a very successful program and I and I think that you know

Could could could could it get better is would would would a totally civilian Le program be but I can tell you from their perspective I think they they value our partnership with the police with the police department the officers that go in in terms of you know they’re dealing

With some Sometimes some high Acuity people in terms of right but I mean but at the same time when I say we take 640 people to the hospital that’s only a fraction of the amount of actual mobile mental health of calls that we actually deal with like there are thousands of

Other calls that don’t end up at that level um that are that are dealt with and are dealt with appropriately and and and are dealt with compassionately and with empathy in terms of you know by the by Patrol officers on the street and and

In terms of and with mobile but but I me I think that um you know the reality that more training is always a better thing like you know more training around around mental health and all that it’s just a better for all of us actually at

The end of the day because we deal with it so so much in terms of you know and not just even that the police but anyone in the service industry that that that deals with who’s in the service indust deals with people with mental health issues that that that’s just the reality

Of of where we we know we know that uh you know when they talked about back like one in five people had mental health issues at one time to deal you know in terms of Nova Scotia and all that that’s just the reality right there’s not all people that the police

Are just dealing with right these are you know across the Spectrum in terms of nobody certainly me nobody wants to see people with mental health issues um you know treated unfairly or or or or or or have violence brought upon them and all this other but but at sometimes the

Levels you know the situation itself actually for the safety of the other people involved in terms actually requires a police respon responds right you know the RCMP unfortunately you know they they lost a member because of that in in Vancouver and uh you know that that that you know that’s that’s that’s

A reality we have to deal with in terms so I think that you know certainly that’s that’s important okay thanks Chief thank you John Mr Mayor through you to Council in terms of the question of where things sit with respect to the motion at the

Board of police on on this issue of um sworn officers um accompanying uh those need needing mental assessment so that is um with staff for conversations Department of Justice there’s there essentially three issues one is there’s relatively broad powers to appoint um individuals as peace officers for that purpose um but

It requires ministerial approval whether it’s the chief or directly by the minister for a peace officer to to appoint either a special conable or some other individual whether it’s a sheriff otherwise as a peace officer for the purposes of the legislation um which is

Set up to deal with that and and so the the the challenge will be the risk assessment with respect to the risk to those in the hospital itself and others in terms of providing that the second issue is in in the legislation it’s I guess the third issue then besides the

Risk and and and The Minister’s willingness to entertain this is that currently the legislation requires IND idual who who takes a person into custody for the purposes of an assessment to stay with them for the entirety of that period of time and so um either there needs to be a workaround

And and which would be additional bodies not less um or potentially change in that legislation so those those conversations have begun between staff Public Safety and and Department of Justice um and so but there is there is a path forward potentially okay but it’s not going to happen right away so so

Don’t hold off thank you thank you counselor counselor Mason thank you mayor before I get to the meat of the motion I got to say you know there’s a point you know where it’s the officer coming in with someone who’s being uh admitted and there’s another point where we’re providing extra Duty

Officers for the hospitals you know like there’s a point where they need to start helping to pay for this in in my opinion the hospitals the noral health authority especially if their system is so slow it’s taken 10 and 12 and 18 hours to admit that’s not what I’m going to talk

About though so uh as I’ve already laid out uh last budget uh we did not fully fund the 8 FTE for the uh Public Safety strategy and I think we need to fully fund this to roll out those programs that are in the safety strategy to

Address what we heard today uh the board has also asked for that they asked for that in November the board of police Commissioners so my motion is about deferring the decision today and it would only be for the motion on the floor it wouldn’t do the air CMP would

Still come back on Friday to talk about that the motion is uh to defer so we can get a full picture of what’s coming get the community safety business unit presentation and ask for a supp report about what would it would cost to fund

It it also has a language in it that it could potentially be funded by a reduction of Hell Fox police and RCMP budgets but it doesn’t say certainly will be because we don’t know what the options are we’re asking for a staff report there’s a lot of ifs ands or buts

Have the costs changed since last year what are the funding options is even some of that already funded in the business unit presentation we haven’t seen yet might be we’ll find out so my motion is that the budget committee defer the motion until the community safety business unit presentation and

Pending receipt of a supplementary report that outlines implications of and updates the costs of fully funding alternative 1 of the March 7th 2023 staff report entitled Helifax Public Safety strategy 2023 to 24 to 2025 26 to potentially be F by reduction and proposed HX Regional Police and RCMP

Budgets and if passed refer this to the board of police Commissioners for consideration second and I won’t go on thank you very much Mr Mayor thank you counselor I won’t go on any further than that the other big piece on this is um that it’s about $800,000 just to give

You an idea like we had the number if you go back and look at the staff report so so we need to validate where that’s at and and how much has been funded this year uh in their business plan and how much remain to be funded and uh I

Suggest that we hold off we need to see all these things lined up next to one another before we make a decision thank you Mr Mayor thank you John Mr Mayor through the council I I’d like to suggest that the time for a deferral might be after you have the the police

Um motion on the floor as well in debated and I say that because um at the time today it looks like we’ll be doing HR sorry RCMP on Friday have a little bit more information perhaps from Public Safety the CEO but it’s it’s up to councel councelor

Mason look I’m open to do that except we have a motion on the floor right now and if we vote on it then it’s passed right decided we would not be voting on these motions until after after and we have them all on the floor well okay I can

Hold off then I mean we can just end it here withraw that I’ll withdraw until I’ll withdraw till Friday if that’s the will of councel yep uh Jerry uh thank you Mr here uh just just for context uh with the budget committee uh staff has advised that Community

Services we did at our budget Direction meetings advise that we are putting forward a complete budget in that all business units are are funded up um the only uh bow item that uh we did say was coming forward was with respect to the uh RCMP because that is a

Contractual um uh Arrangement but uh since since we gave that information there was a piece that came forward yesterday from Community safety on the food action plan Part B that was not funded that came after their final Target was issued so it’s just that amount that that’s not funded in

Community safety at this point isn’t it okay so just so in terms of process where we are John what are you suggesting that we we close up here if nobody else wants to speak on corre topic correct and then we hear from the RCMP uh first thing on Friday um the

RCMP motion and then we can decide if there’s a desire to defer um the the the Motions at that time and uh we’ll be able to get some clarity around what what is currently being brought forward um in the community safety budget okay so the motion has been withdrawn the

Second is okay with that we’ll continue the debate on this budget uh as presented councelor outfit um thank you mayor and I probably would have supported that deferral but with some some caveats um I just want to make sure that between now and Friday when this continues because I think all

Around the table here for several years all of us have said that in spirit and corly in action in some of the things we’ve done we do support uh detas and retasking but I’ve also been one of the ones that has regularly said and everybody kind of nods their heads when

I say that there’s probably no money to be saved by doing this it’s just how we spend it and where we spend it but I also worried and I don’t know if if Chief you can deal with this now or or somebody can be prepared for this

Because I didn’t see too much so far in the other budgets uh from uh Public Safety butnot that would say here’s money we can take out of the police budget even though and I agree with the young larly young people who are here today that mental health issues uh you

Know re Car special training others should be dealing with those but when they get to that state where they should have been getting help for many years and they get to that state where it’s becoming dangerous to themselves or others of course police are involved and will be

Involved and a number of us around this table have family and friends and neighbors that work in emergency rooms and I don’t know if you ever been to emergency room on a weekend but it’s a Gong Show and it’s a Gong Show because a there’s not enough people there and B

Because like police they’re dealing with things that they probably shouldn’t be dealing with because nobody else is dealing with them so they show up at emergency but to tell those workers that work there well gee we may have a constable or more security people there there’s a knife fight in the alley

That’s send in a social worker is not what we’re suggesting but we have to make sure we’re not setting that stage either because there are times and again we would love to get to that stage where these things don’t happen but they are also entitled to a safe workplace and they

Uh so my My worry is and I I’m absolutely supportive of detas and retasking but I’m very worried when it looks like there’s it’s an opportunity to save money or redirect money I I I don’t think that’s the case necessarily but I hope that we’ll be in better

Better position to discuss that on on Friday because I’m certainly open to to looking at all ideas but Chief what I don’t I don’t want City councilors and board of police officers and and to some extent City and and even police officers to tell us what should be going on in our

Hospitals because I I suspect that the there’s they deal with some really tough things and I don’t say that an officer should be there for 8 to 12 hours guarding somebody but just to throw up our hands and say well we’ll send in somebody else to try and protect and

Control these people who were brought in there in various stages just you know what I’m saying here let’s I don’t think politicians can judge what goes on in the A and maybe you can help me a little guidance on that to the councelor so I I think I think

And feel free to clarify because we’re sitting right next to one another in terms of um so you’re talking about an alternative response in terms of someone else that would be there in terms of well I I think it would have to be done

I I think that it would have to be done it would have to be an informed decision about who that what is that other right entity right right I I know some of the questions I I know some of the conversations I’ve had with provincial officials have been around well maybe it

Needs to be Corrections type folk or Sheriff type folk people who are actually trained that actually you know um may not carry firearms but you know are actually trained and and that sort of thing so I I just don’t think it’s anybody like I mean uh clearly but you

Know the legislation was written for a reason yes right um and in terms of um you know whatever that solution looks like I certainly support a solution in terms of right I think that it has to be an informed thoughtful decision that that speaks to the complexities of the

Of of of of of the issue and when you represent an area like I do that has grown so much and some would argue is not as best protect better is not as well protected perhaps in small stuff little stuff as it was when it was a

Town and we built a town on top of it you know I have to say so again all for looking at new ideas new approaches and trying to prevent people getting to the state there are what police and and others have to get involved but I am

Just so worried that we sometimes think we can just take money from this pot and put it in this pot no we’re going to have to find money for both pots or the province is going to help to have us find help us find money for both pots

That’s the reality and I hope that we’ll be able to speak to that uh a little better uh when this comes back on Tuesday and when we talk to other the other groups anyway thank you thank you councelor Kent thank you Mr mayor a couple of

Things um uh just that from some of the comments so further to councelor out hit’s comments there’s no question in my mind that we we have a lot of work to do but this is the fact that we’re even having this kind of conversation is new in the since

This Council and the the Public Safety Office the the the transformational study all these reports they’re all converging at the same time with basically all the same same parameters that say we all agree on on where we need to get we just have to get there

And but without a doubt our partners at the Province have work to do in order to uh legitimately allow us to do it um so we as a council we as a board uh need to be at those tables and I can speak for the board that we have been um and

We will continue on the public safety piece um I want you to be aware that and chief you’ll have to remind me or one of my Council mates I know I put a motion on the floor I think it was two or three two officers we asked for two officers

Of this compliment of increased uh uh members to have a dedicated space for the Public Safety Office imp um implementation and and and priorities uh recognizing that we can’t dictate that to uh the chief to do that but he has but we want we’re showing that we need

Him to focus and his members to focus on these kinds of changes um operationally you know the the day-to-day Works workings of of criminality in our in our communities and in our city have to be tended to but dedication to that those initiatives are imperative so we we put

That forward um and that was appr I put that forward and that was approved um so I know the chief is aware of it so uh our board is is in keeping with the public safety um route what I what I would hate to see and councelor O had

Said it I think councelor man it it’s not either or it means we have to fund both this is not a singularity uh uh CH bit of change we we and and yes that means we have a tough some tough decisions coming up for us as we

Approach April um the other thing the last thing I need some clarification from perhaps you uh Jerry um around what you’re talking about about the police budget being on the bow list if that’s the only item on the bow list and that’s contractual was that done in the past we

Have contracts with unions we have contracts everywhere why is that one on the bow or the only item that might be on the bow sitting there in limbo why would that not be dealt with here Jerry any thoughts on that yeah thank you so we’re we’re a party to

The provincial contract is is one reason for that and the other is um again it goes to jurisdiction and the solicitor can can uh jump in if I’m stepping off sides but the jurisdiction of the board of police uh isn’t to uh approve the RCMP budget they can

Recommend right so the additional asks for the RCMP are treated as a as a balance adjustment item as they have been in past years so I think I’m out of time but I’m just going to suggest that just I need clarification on why is it this is the

Only one when we’ve had other you’ve you’ve baked everything else in why would this not be baked in it is a recommendation that the board did exactly what they were asked to do okay so that we we looked at that is that as I said it’s a uh we’re party to

The provincial contract and uh based on the jurisdiction of the board right that would be put forward to uh Council uh budget committee to make a decision on that we’re not automatically bound as we would be a Collective Agreement so for example when you prove uh fouryear Collective Agreement you’re approving

Four years you’re you don’t do that with the RCMP so it’s like an INE ask for for uh for an increase so that’s why we do it that way councelor Kent yeah I’ll have to come back to you if you have I’ll take this offline with yeah that’s a good

Talk to Jerry about it may be offline councel Lovel oh no I’m fine sorry I’m good you’re good okay there’s nobody else on the board so we’re not going to vote on this uh now uh we are going to move to the RCMP present we have some 20 minutes should

We move to the RCMP presentation what is council’s wish to start fresh on Friday I’m gonna do something very Democratic and I’m going to ask for a show of hands on whether we have the presentation from the RCMP now or whether we start on Friday with the RC it do I know ask

Him suggestion Council Kent yeah uh so I’d ask Council to to consider uh allowing this to happen on Friday or whenever it does can happen um often we in this Council chamber are left with with hanging out one group or one initiative at the end of a meeting and

We do not give them the do the the the opportunity to really be fome and have the the full engagement if we start now he’s our Chiefs going to have to come back and he’ll start again so let’s start again on the next time we have the opportunity which is Friday because

That’s that’s a fresher mind and a frh I don’t want to debate this I just want to chove hands and we’ll make a decision so councelor outad on a point of just a just a question I mean does the world end if we extend the meeting to 4:30

Yeah I think that there are people that have commitments at 4:00 that’s why we Sorry people have commitments at 4:00 all right right we schedule these things and we do have lots of time folks it’s we not approving a budget for two months so we have contingency days built in we

If we don’t get to Planning and Development we’ll do it uh next week or you guys can do it while I’m on vacation for that matter but um so I want to vote those who want to wait till Friday to begin the presentation we see your hands that’s what we’re going to do

We’re going to wait till Friday Jeff you’re going to come back in anyway are you okay um thank you thank you to uh the chief uh thank you to everybody who’s been uh presenting um was a relatively long day after a relatively long day yesterday so maybe fresh set of

Eyes on Friday morning might not be such a a Bad Thing Friday continuation this no public participation Friday correct there’ll be no more public participation that’s this will be a continuation of this unless we go to public Planning and Development or some of new there is a there is a public participation section

For the existing meeting that was scheduled for Friday so it will be there and it’ll happen before the r CMP presentation if we get to the next Department if we get to the next thing on Friday starts at the beginning of the meeting there’s but there’s no we’ve already done public participation for

Police we don’t have to do that again yeah any other questions I’ll accept a motion to adjourn this meeting thank you councelor PR the presentation I think we could that